Narcolepsy and GBL use (Female)

[mushi mushi 88]

Good evening all you intelligent BLers, I will start by apologising if I have posted this in the wrong forum... I wasn't 100% sure as to where this would be best suited due to the sleep disorder associated with the young lady.

OK so here is my little question that could be turned into a large discussion . One of my good friends girlfriends suffers from a sleep disorder called narcolepsyNarcolepsy Wiki Definition, which causes her to just pass out and fall asleep. She is prescribed dexamphetamines to prevent this from happening when she doesn't wish it to, she does not take the dexamphetamine all the time, only when she feels she needs them...

Anyways a lot of her friends including myself have all been using a fair bit of GBL in the past and she has always been interested in trying it, because of the effects others and myself describe from ingesting it. I have never let her taken any before because I was aware of her sleep disorder and was not sure whether GBL would effect her in a way that would pretty much just knock her out and she would not be coming back or something along those lines.

What I would really like to pick everybody's brains about is, would it be alright to give her some GBL to try or is that just writing off her death certificate for her? I've been considering giving her some lately but starting at tiny doses from 0.20mL and working my way up every 1.5 hours e.g. 0.30mL then 0.40mL then 0.50mL etc.

I told her to go to her local GP and speak with him about the effects of what it might have and what not but she wasn't to happy speaking to a Doctor about that which I can understand. So I told her I would start a thread on here because I know there are a lot of very knowledgeable people that might be able to give some very helpful feedback.

Her Body Description in case needed is:

Age: 19 years old
Height: 177cm
Weight: Apx 70kg
Sex: Female
Build: Medium/Slim

She has used plenty of other illicit chemicals in the past such as; MDMA, LSD, Methylamphetamine, Marijuana, Shrooms, Cocaine and DMT. I think that's pretty much them all.

Thank you in advance for any advice given. She is really eager to try some but I told her it is never going to happen until we are certain that you will be fine on it. I have told her how dangerous of a drug it is and explained all the fine details about it.

Oh I am very well experienced with GBL and GHB as well and always work out the doses for friends so that they don't blow out.

Mushi.

 

[Jamshyd]

I personally think it is unethical to introduce a friend to something as addictive and destructive as GBL, but then again I am biased.

 

[Wizzle]

I'm sure using a treatment for narcolepsy (ghb) in a recreational way won't better her symptons. It sounds like a really bad idea.

 

[Phener]

I'm sure using a treatment for narcolepsy (ghb) in a recreational way won't better her symptons. It sounds like a really bad idea.

second that.

Also please please DO NOT make the fundamental mistake thinking GBL equals GHB. VERY DIFFERENT COMPOUNDS, VERY DIFFERENT PHARMACOLOGY/PHARMACOKINETICS

GENERAL OPINION: Sounds like a bad idea, woulnd't recommend it

 

[vecktor]

I don't see any fundamental problem with a narcoleptic consuming GBL. Sodium oxybate Xyrem is approved for use in treating cataplexy associated with narcolepsy and all that is is very expensive legal GHB. oral GHB is converted to GBL in the stomach, there is little real difference between the two other than GBL is more irritant than a GHB salt, GBL can also give higher blood GHB concentrations for longer than GHB itself due to its more lipophillic nature allowing it to cross membranes.

tread carefully and obviosly be mindful that GBL/GHB both are insidiously addictive as well as being highly dangerous in combination with other depressants. Also be wary that narcoleptics sometimes have paradoxical reactions to stimulants and depressants.

whether the positives associated with GHB GBL are worth the downside are a whole different matter

 

[dread]

oral GHB is converted to GBL in the stomach

Funny, I always thought it was the other way around. Although it does make sense, stomach being acidic and all.

Where does GBL convert back to GHB then? In the blood or liver perhaps?

 

[vecktor]

Funny, I always thought it was the other way around. Although it does make sense, stomach being acidic and all.

Where does GBL convert back to GHB then? In the blood or liver perhaps?

assuming that the critical pH is the one where the carboxylate salt is protonated to the free acid, the free acid is highly unstable and lactonises very quickly then we are looking at GHB being essentially GBL below pH 3.7. the pKa of the free acid is 4.7

at blood pH 7.35 the carboxylate salt form is going to be favoured 1000 to 1 over GBL,

it is probably mostly converted as soon as it diffuses through the cells lining the stomach and intestine. it is then transported as the salt. The presence of lactonases in the blood ensure that any GBL is converted to GHB,

v

 

[El_Toro]

Am I the only one who is tired of seeing this sort of questions asked in this particular sub-forum?

 

[El_Toro]

Good evening all you intelligent BLers, I will start by apologising if I have posted this in the wrong forum... I wasn't 100% sure as to where this would be best suited due to the sleep disorder associated with the young lady.

OK so here is my little question that could be turned into a large discussion . One of my good friends girlfriends suffers from a sleep disorder called narcolepsyNarcolepsy Wiki Definition, which causes her to just pass out and fall asleep. She is prescribed dexamphetamines to prevent this from happening when she doesn't wish it to, she does not take the dexamphetamine all the time, only when she feels she needs them...

Anyways a lot of her friends including myself have all been using a fair bit of GBL in the past and she has always been interested in trying it, because of the effects others and myself describe from ingesting it. I have never let her taken any before because I was aware of her sleep disorder and was not sure whether GBL would effect her in a way that would pretty much just knock her out and she would not be coming back or something along those lines.

What I would really like to pick everybody's brains about is, would it be alright to give her some GBL to try or is that just writing off her death certificate for her? I've been considering giving her some lately but starting at tiny doses from 0.20mL and working my way up every 1.5 hours e.g. 0.30mL then 0.40mL then 0.50mL etc.

I told her to go to her local GP and speak with him about the effects of what it might have and what not but she wasn't to happy speaking to a Doctor about that which I can understand. So I told her I would start a thread on here because I know there are a lot of very knowledgeable people that might be able to give some very helpful feedback.

Her Body Description in case needed is:

Age: 19 years old
Height: 177cm
Weight: Apx 70kg
Sex: Female
Build: Medium/Slim

She has used plenty of other illicit chemicals in the past such as; MDMA, LSD, Methylamphetamine, Marijuana, Shrooms, Cocaine and DMT. I think that's pretty much them all.

Thank you in advance for any advice given. She is really eager to try some but I told her it is never going to happen until we are certain that you will be fine on it. I have told her how dangerous of a drug it is and explained all the fine details about it.

Oh I am very well experienced with GBL and GHB as well and always work out the doses for friends so that they don't blow out.

Mushi.

What you are doing is plainly stupid.

First of all, people suffering from narcolepsy have fucked up sleep architecture, so much that they fall asleep when they are not supposed to. Giving a drug which produces paradoxical effects such as seizures in someone whose seizure threshold is reduced is, to put it bluntly, stupid. At the very least you could have thought of giving it to her at night to put her out because that is what medical GHB (which is the same as street GHB) is used for and for that same condition. You could be even nicer and convert it the GBL to GHB.

Second, you are going to be dosing her infra-therapeutical doses (if by therapeutical we go by the meaning of "having fun") round the clock? So you wanna get her hooked without at least experiencing the fun, that is again, stupid. GBL is some nasty shit that can make one become physically depedant very fast. In a healthy subject, 1.2 ml is the minimum needed to experience anything, being 1.5mls a good starting dose. Also, as you probably know, the therapeutical margin of GBL (especially) is very low and will cause all sort of funky shit when overdoses such as absence seizures (if you are lucky and don't start spazzing).

In any case, go by the rule of not giving anything to someone who falls asleep doing the laundry. Also, please refrain of posting such marvellous topics in a sub-forum designed to discuss intelligent topics.

 

[Phener]

I don't see any fundamental problem with a narcoleptic consuming GBL. Sodium oxybate Xyrem is approved for use in treating cataplexy associated with narcolepsy and all that is is very expensive legal GHB. oral GHB is converted to GBL in the stomach, there is little real difference between the two other than GBL is more irritant than a GHB salt, GBL can also give higher blood GHB concentrations for longer than GHB itself due to its more lipophillic nature allowing it to cross membranes.

you've summized some of the properties there but I personally reiterate GHB does NOT equal GBL subjectively and addictively. There are a million threads (+on other forums) discussing the whole GBL/GHB addiction differences (not intending for this to be yet ANOTHER).

Acute dosing for "having fun" is one thing (but I am of the opinion in this case due to addictive properties + current situation dont - which is just my opinion) however PLEASE PLEASE don't be suggesting to her GBL could be used for narcolepsy (this indication is unproven and potentially very hideous) - routine use is FAR more likely to lead to addiction. I DO think GBL is the worse of the two (opinion) but GBL for narcolepsy is UNPROVEN (fact).

 

[mushi mushi 88]

Firstly I am from Australia and they do not have medical GHB over here, GHB is pretty much nonexistent full stop... If you want to take GHB you usually have to convert it from GBL into GHB yourself.

Also she is the one who has been bugging myself and others for over 6 months now in wanting to try it but I have been not allowing anyone to give it to her because we were not sure whether it would be safe for her to consume such a substance.

GBL ranges from $5-$10/mL over here so it is a pretty expensive habit to take up if you do somehow get addicted to it, not to mention how hard it is to come by with very little suppliers because of the heavy jail term it carries if being caught supplying it.

Thank you to all who have given me some helpful insight into the topic. I will be getting her to visit this forum so that she can read what you have all written, cheers.

 

[Phener]

Firstly I am from Australia and they do not have medical GHB over here, GHB is pretty much nonexistent full stop... If you want to take GHB you usually have to convert it from GBL into GHB yourself.

Also she is the one who has been bugging myself and others for over 6 months now in wanting to try it but I have been not allowing anyone to give it to her because we were not sure whether it would be safe for her to consume such a substance.

GBL ranges from $5-$10/mL over here so it is a pretty expensive habit to take up if you do somehow get addicted to it, not to mention how hard it is to come by with very little suppliers because of the heavy jail term it carries if being caught supplying it.

Thank you to all who have given me some helpful insight into the topic. I will be getting her to visit this forum so that she can read what you have all written, cheers.

good idea

(shocked at the GBL prices, guess because it's illegal - used to get 500mL bottles for £40 - which was MOST certainly part of the problem for me, complete nightmare of a situation with addiction, truely horrible wouldn't wish it on anyone- thankfully I had no family to look after, was young and family/friends helped me through it - still complete nightmare)

 

[Supeudol]

you've summized some of the properties there but I personally reiterate GHB does NOT equal GBL subjectively and addictively. There are a million threads (+on other forums) discussing the whole GBL/GHB addiction differences (not intending for this to be yet ANOTHER).

Acute dosing for "having fun" is one thing (but I am of the opinion in this case due to addictive properties + current situation dont - which is just my opinion) however PLEASE PLEASE don't be suggesting to her GBL could be used for narcolepsy (this indication is unproven and potentially very hideous) - routine use is FAR more likely to lead to addiction. I DO think GBL is the worse of the two (opinion) but GBL for narcolepsy is UNPROVEN (fact).

^^ Second that totally. For some reason on BL a lot of people on here seem to think that GBL & GHB are the EXACT same. When in fact GBL can cause more stomach irritation, diarrhea, and more side effects.

NaGHB has been prooven to treat insomnia (dosing 2x nightly). GBL has not, this reason because GBL has a much higher peak plasma level than NaGHB which comes on slower and more gradual.

 

[fryingsquirrel]

Am I the only one who is tired of seeing this sort of questions asked in this particular sub-forum?

While the original question may or may not have been of ADD quality the discussion it provoked quite certainly was.

 

[Wizzle]

I don't see any fundamental problem with a narcoleptic consuming GBL. Sodium oxybate Xyrem is approved for use in treating cataplexy associated with narcolepsy and all that is is very expensive legal GHB. oral GHB is converted to GBL in the stomach, there is little real difference between the two other than GBL is more irritant than a GHB salt, GBL can also give higher blood GHB concentrations for longer than GHB itself due to its more lipophillic nature allowing it to cross membranes.

tread carefully and obviosly be mindful that GBL/GHB both are insidiously addictive as well as being highly dangerous in combination with other depressants. Also be wary that narcoleptics sometimes have paradoxical reactions to stimulants and depressants.

whether the positives associated with GHB GBL are worth the downside are a whole different matter

The problem I see is messing with someones GABA-receptor.. Sure it is not going to kill her, but it can very well make the symptons worse when used during daytime for recreational purposes.