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Naltrexone: ULD to stop tolerance buildup and Precipitated Withdrawals

What we are saying is: Why are you interested in 'detoxing with naltrexone' if you arn't physically addicted? If you arn't physically addict, like you say, you would have no withdrawls to precipitate. But, I think you are a bit addicted so, I think it would precipitate SOME wds. other people have tried this ULD stuff, searchfor the threads. One guy made a journel.


Oohhh wait, you DID take that pill. and you did get precipitated withdrawls, whaddya know :). Well, it should go away in like 12 hours. Just keep some dope for then. Or you can shoot dope over the antagonist, but they say its dangourus.


Why did you take that pill again? Did you want to precipiate withdrawls or not? I guess you wanted too :p. I hope at least.

Don't call 911, just man it out.
 
Hm, well here's the story.

I've been doing about $10-20 of dope daily or so for about 2 months. For whatever reason, physical addiction seems to develop slower in me and I'm not as privy to the effects since I have pretty extreme insomnia and RLS (both medically diagnosed. To give an example, my freshmen year I never went to bed before 4am).

Last night I took about 10mg of Naltrexone orally when I was pretty tired, thinking I could maybe detox my system a bit while I slept. I also took 6 x 3mg = 18mg Melatonin to help me sleep, as I always have a hard time getting to sleep.

The pain I was ranting about earlier in this thread came from eating WAYYYY too much Melatonin, I believe you aren't supposed to go past 9mg in a 24 hour period.

I'm pretty sure I wasn't going through withdrawal (or maybe partially I was, whatever), but that this pain was from eating too many sleeping supplements. At one point I was outside crawling, puking my guts out, in a fetal position outside. My stomach still hurts but whatever.

Thanks wiggi for your posts, I know I felt the withdrawal come on but that wasn't nearly as bad as the pain I felt from taking too much melatonin.

ngesting melatonin supplements may cause some unwanted side effects, especially at high doses (~more than 3 mg/day)
Click to expand...
 
Yes, as you mentioned, it can be extremely uncomfortable taking large amounts of melatonin, very unpleasant at best. There is alot of physical pain from high doses of melatonin, a strange burning sensation that can be frightening (i once made the huge mistake of taking 12mg of melatonin while on LSD, dont ask me why). Though very different, i can see how you could have mistaken this for drug withdrawal.

Also, perhaps im still unclear, but are you still taking heroin?
 
Theo: it sounds to me like you ran into a terrible case of precipitated WD. Maybe you also took too much of the supplement but nausea, vomiting, GI discomfort etc are hallmark WD symptoms and do not happen with excess melatonin.

Anyway, the past 7 days I have been doing ULD naltrexone with each shot of heroin. I have also gotten 3 of my friends (also daily users) to do the same. I'm still experimenting with dosing but so far I (as well as my 3 friends) have had INCREDIBLY SUCCESSFUL results with using ~1-2mcg with each shot of heroin. Here are effects I have noticed (each of my friends claim to get these same effects):

TOLERANCE
I had gotten up to at least $20 #4 per shot to even feel slight effects from heroin. I was up to about 3-4 shots per day. AS SOON as I starting adding 1mcg naltrexone to my shots I have been catching extreme nods (like never ever before) from $8 of #4 per shot.

Not only has my previous tolerance been obliterated, it does not increase either; if I shoot $8 worth at 10am then another $8 2 hours later the rush is ALL THERE. No decrease in effects with subsequent dosing; each shot is like the first shot of my life no matter how much I've done that day.

CRAVING
Previously shooting junk would almost immediately induce cravings to do more and more and more junk. With naltrexone I experience NO craving to do more heroin at all.

WITHDRAWL
I have yet to experience WD since I've started doing naltrexone with my dope. Yes I have taken enough time off and have felt no signs of WD as well as no cravings when abstinent.

Again this is with doses of 1-2mcg per shot of dope, WITHOUT skipping the naltrexone at all with any of my heroin shots. Even after a week I am still nodding HARD (yes right now in fact) from ~$10 of NE #4.

Feel free tp ask me any q's at all i gott go though i cant keep my eyes open but holy shit i have NEVER nodded this hard from$8 of jj
 
Also the high is a bit different. The rush is full and immediate but the high continues to grow until about 20-30mins when it seems to peak and this is where the serious nodding starts to take place. I will never use chronic opioids without ULD naltrexone again.
 
The theory is that over time, low-dose naltrexone will lower tolerance, or at least keep it from rising.
Not that it:
increases strength of heroin
makes the rush last for 20-30 minutes instead of 20-30 seconds
eliminate cravings to do more heroin
& prevents withdrawal

This is either total bullshit, or the best damn self-trickery (placebo) I've ever heard of.
 
I didn't say the rush lasted for 30mins I said that the high didn't fully kick in until then. Believe what you guys want but I didn't tell my friends anything about it and got the same reports from 3 different people: "I'll never shoot junk without naltrexone again."
 
Maybe you just made some earth-shattering discovery.
But its more likely that you've coincidentally been getting better dope since the first time you decided to add the naltrexone to it.
I'll go with that, rather than the earth-shattering discovery, because as Ham-milton said, 1 microgram is nothing.
 
Can someone please tell me the difference between naltrexone and naloxone?
I know that naloxone (narcan) is used on people who OD (my dad is a paramedic) and that it is in suboxone pills, but this is the first I've heard of naltrexone. I remember people in rehab saying that they took a pill that basically brought on all withdrawals at once, and that it was HORRIBLE, but it was all gone in 24hrs. I think they actually called it the 24hr detox. Is that naltrexone? Now I don't use every day (oxy), but I do experience minor withdrawals (get EXTREMELY agitated, sleep ALL day.) Could I take naltrexone (or naloxone) on the days I don't use to knock out withdrawals and/or lower tolerance? Pardon me if I'm asking stupid questions, but if either are possible I'd really like to know. Thanks guys.
 
Opiate Withdrawal and Naloxone

Now i forgot where i read this, but i've heard that using a MINISCULE amount of an opiate antagonist (i.e naloxone) combined with the opiate causing withdrawals can in fact both:

A) increase the opiates effects DRASTICALLY (like 50% of normal dose to feel)
B) Severely reduce tolerance--which in fact could lead to much help with withdrawal

Now i dont know if this is widely used (as i have never had to experience the hell that is withdrawal) but it sounds very interesting. If i ever get my hands on some of the antagonists, perhaps ill give it a try...
 
The effect of oral naltrexone is all about timing--if you take it while you have no opioid on board, it will do nothing.

Precipitated withdrawal is no party, and, remember that you will have to take the naltrexone while you still have an opioid on board. If you are jacking with tolerance, the effects of naltrexone upon your tolerance will be minimal at best. You need to know the half-life of the drug you are using (heroin has a pretty short half-life).

Don't shoot it. It isn't meant to be used IV. You will have a better effect using it PO as designed.
 
The theory is that over time, low-dose naltrexone will lower tolerance, or at least keep it from rising.
Not that it:
increases strength of heroin
makes the rush last for 20-30 minutes instead of 20-30 seconds
eliminate cravings to do more heroin
& prevents withdrawal

This is either total bullshit, or the best damn self-trickery (placebo) I've ever heard of.
Click to expand...

There's actually been studies to say that ULD of naltrexone (Ultra-Low dosing, which is a lot different from Low Dosing) with opiates will actually potentiate the high. What he is saying is consistent with past research into ULD, although such research is minimal.

It has also been shown to prevent tolerance from rising as fast. I think it's similar to how DXM has been shown to do similar, as it also acts on the receptors (not sure if it's an antagonist similarly or competitive agonist, I'll just leave it at that though).

Anyways, I took 10mg again after doing a bunch of heroin one day last week. I went into terrible withdrawal, and didn't take any melatonin. I wasn't doing enough at all to substantiate withdrawal symptoms if I had cold turkeyed. I think that using a large dose of naltrexone even after doing just a single $20 for once can lead to a miserable, insomniac-driven time. It's not that I had gotten a physical dependency at all, but the 'shock' of taking naltrexone after doing a bunch of dope is so much that you will get withdrawal symptoms even if you have no dependency and wouldn't feel any withdrawal effects if you cold turkeyed.

However, afterward I just felt so 'clean'. I know that I won't be using heroin again for a long time.

I think there are positives and negatives with using naltrexone. I think if you are trying to quit for a long time, it is good. Painful, but good.

Can't describe it, I just feel so ready to stop using heroin for a long time...
 
^ How long did the withdrawal last?
I assume it "kicked in" quite fast, then slowly eased up? Can you explain the duration and all that?
 
I was bone tired, I had been up for about 2 days and did quite a bit of dope throughout. I must've had quite a bit in my system, even though they were drastically lower then when high.

I fell asleep for all of one minute before it kicked in within 10 minutes; I had eaten a broken quarter of a 50mg Naltrexone pill, so the dose was around 12.5mg-2mg lost from breaking it perhaps, so 10mg. Suddenly I couldn't sleep, my RLS was out of control as I normally am (which is pretty bad), and I was yawning and strech-yawning so hard it actually hurt.

Someone told me like earlier that day that they knew they were getting sick when they started to yawn a lot.

It went away in probably 6 hours. I think I did 2 bags that day like 12 hours later with no effects, totally blocked by the naltrexone (or could've been weakass dope, probably both, but it did let me sleep).

It was quite painful and nerve wrecking. I'm quite certain I had no developed any noticeable physical addiction, but just the sheer shock of the naltrexone of someone who had probably a good amount of half-lifed dope in my system just made me miserable. I went to bed after those 2 bags like 10 hours later, and woke up feeling kinda refreshed.

I've had very minimal effects afterwards when I woke up. I had strong mood swings and was very emotional, and today I'm not emotional at all. My bowels are still kinda 'loose' and my insomnia and RLS are back to normal for me - which is total shit. However I have to write 3 papers, a presentation, and study for 3 exams, as well as get sorted out with a few embassies as I'm traveling to Japan in 2 weeks, something I just found out yesterday, and which will cut my college semester short by 2 weeks and makes me really have to up my work load.

It left me feeling clean. It was miserable, but I feel anew, released from any physical addiction I may have had, however slight, but definitely released my psychological addiction, which has always been quite strong the last 5 years.

I would recommend it to anyone who is struggling with psychological addiction, preferably with maybe a strong dose of benzos. I cannot imagine being awake through that if you had a substantial physical addiction, and think that heavy medication and a semicomatose state is required for the Waissman Precipitated Withdrawal Detox method (which I essentially did unsupervised).

Calling those who love you helps, the mood swings are strong. It definitely is effective in kicking psychological addiction, but no matter how small your addiction is, it will hurt. I think that if someone totally naive did 1 bag of heroin, and then did naltrexone, they will hurt from it.

It does block opiates for a good amount of time afterward, which is good if you relapse as it is essentially is a 'cheat' and will let it go by. I think it makes your system metabolize dope without the dope actually attaching to your receptors, preventing an actual physical relapse.
 
ULD Naltrexone wont work. Use Low Dose. Take up to 3 mg before bed , about 50 minutes after swallowing a temazepam capsule, about once every 3 nights. Do not exceed 3 mg.
 
Unless it is absolute shit dope, $20 worth of Heroin is enough to make someone without a tolerance OD. I've seen more than 1 person OD on one $10 bag IV.

If you are shooting $20 worth of dope a day for more than a couple weeks, you are dependant and addicted.

Trying to use Naltrexone for this purpose is going to end badly. You will probably end up using too much and going into precipitated withdrawals for 3 days, at which point you will not be able to deny you're an addict to anyone or yourself.

Unless this were being administered by medical professionals with exact dosages, I don't see how it could work. I seriously, seriously doubt the ability of ultra low dosages of Naltrexone to do this. I would say it is physically impossible for you to administer this medication to yourself successfully for the purpose you wish to use it for. Meaning, if even if you managed to accurately give yourself less than a milligram of Naltrexone from a 50mg Rx pill, I do not think it will do what you think it will to you.

I oppose Naltrexone implants as well. Unless hospitals around the world want to treat a former addict for sepsis and a hole in the belly when they try to dig the thing out with a screwdriver or housekey or whatever else is handy. Just thought I'd mention that.
 
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