My recent experience with various benzos

[lost weekend]

Its had isn't it mate, with the relief they provide. Its annoying they can't find a med that does this without the potential for addiction - just 'instant' relief from worry and anxiety. I don't know about you but its crippling for myself, all I do is worry all day and I know a lot of it is down to my own thinking, I just sit and think. I need to get out more but the idea of it just brings it to the surface.

I don't know what dxm is but I'll look into the study you provided. Thanks mate. I hope things get better.

All I ever found with benzos is that it gives relief while being around people but the worries are always there when alone at home.after a while with tollarance so high anxiety creeps in anyway. Your right if there were a drug that could take away anxiety and be non addictive it would be a Miracle. Ssri 's and the like to me are dangerous .they take weeks if not months to work if they work atol plus they make you feel worse to begin with ,I hate them but doctors love handing them out like sweeties .you can get any flavour you like .

 

[lost weekend]

When I say fluxotene and the like are dangerous is the long period it takes to apparently work.all the time you feel worse and bad bad thoughts go through your head.

 

[vision conquest]

When I say fluxotene and the like are dangerous is the long period it takes to apparently work.all the time you feel worse and bad bad thoughts go through your head.

Yes it's ridiculas, ask for an antidepressant and they're like, absolutely, which one would you like, maybe you want more than one they work well together you know!
Yet ask for a benzodiazepine, which have been proven to work, if you use them right they work for most people, unfortunately being dependant on them isn't great but they work.

Antidepressant have plenty of negative side effects, and as you mentioned they can actually make depression and rumination worse until they do start working.

The list of medications I am reliant upon has become rather long, I am 51 now so no spring chicken but seriously I actually spent some time thinking about how many meds I'm on and it freaked me out.
I was stoned at the time as in the last couple of weeks thc has re-entered the fray, I am pretty stoned right now at 8:30am which probably explains this post.

So I've been typing a while so I may as well finish the job.

Here is the list of medications I am currently on for those of you who have persevered this far.
Just after 8:30am and I'm already totally toasted.
Anyway here's that list.
Testosterone.
Methadone.
Mirtazapine.
Amlodipine.
Perindopril.
Over the last 9 months or so I've also added either pregabalin at doses between 150-300mg, or a benzo and even I know that's not a great combination.

 

[Opana313]

Honestly no offense taken - I appreciate the response and the advice. I have been switching it up (between Diazepam20mg and recently Clonazepam 2mg daily) keeping doses to what I think is relatively low dose? I will speak to my drug worker who also prescribes my buprenorphine maintenance dose. IF he can't help then my GP, if they can't help the I'll have to figure out a taper of own.


Thanks for the advice man. The thing is I have such crippling anxiety that I can't leave my front door, answer phone calls etc. I have paranoia and am waiting on a mental health team referral to come through, I have recently started video call therapy with a psychotherapist to address anxiety.

Good deal..sounds like your dose is quite alright (granted your not naive otherwise you would most likely be prescribed MUCH less) i think your sitting quite alright but hey nothing better than a lower tolerance so do what you will with it.

I have noticed that same thing with Valium, as far as the high goes, like the 1st night or two of dosing 20-40mg and I feel freaking amazing THEN the 3rd night it's like I need double the amount. I love Valium and kpins are damn good too, gotta be 10mg and 2mg for me at least!!!

 

[justme6263]

Good deal..sounds like your dose is quite alright (granted your not naive otherwise you would most likely be prescribed MUCH less) i think your sitting quite alright but hey nothing better than a lower tolerance so do what you will with it.

I have noticed that same thing with Valium, as far as the high goes, like the 1st night or two of dosing 20-40mg and I feel freaking amazing THEN the 3rd night it's like I need double the amount. I love Valium and kpins are damn good too, gotta be 10mg and 2mg for me at least!!!

Appreciate the post mate - made me feel better. I am gonna start trying to get down to 10mg diazepam WHEN needed not whenever I want to etc.

 

[lost weekend]

Yes it's ridiculas, ask for an antidepressant and they're like, absolutely, which one would you like, maybe you want more than one they work well together you know!
Yet ask for a benzodiazepine, which have been proven to work, if you use them right they work for most people, unfortunately being dependant on them isn't great but they work.

Antidepressant have plenty of negative side effects, and as you mentioned they can actually make depression and rumination worse until they do start working.

The list of medications I am reliant upon has become rather long, I am 51 now so no spring chicken but seriously I actually spent some time thinking about how many meds I'm on and it freaked me out.
I was stoned at the time as in the last couple of weeks thc has re-entered the fray, I am pretty stoned right now at 8:30am which probably explains this post.

So I've been typing a while so I may as well finish the job.

Here is the list of medications I am currently on for those of you who have persevered this far.
Just after 8:30am and I'm already totally toasted.
Anyway here's that list.
Testosterone.
Methadone.
Mirtazapine.
Amlodipine.
Perindopril.
Over the last 9 months or so I've also added either pregabalin at doses between 150-300mg, or a benzo and even I know that's not a great combination.

Yeh I've been offered all sorts because they know its no it can't be abused .I was once on mirtazapine and it made me want to throw my self off a bridge.how can that be good for mental health .

 

[canadianpeduser]

Yeah same - if I were to be in bed then I'd sleep quickly otherwise I find it just takes me higher. I have been using 10mg for a while but down to 2.5mg and find it easier in the day

I wish I had some myself. lol they’re very hard to come by where I’m from

 

[justme6263]

I wish I had some myself. lol they’re very hard to come by where I’m from

I had never came across them until a friends dad passed away (R.I.P.) and he had a fuck ton in his meds and she kept them, so have access to a decently long supply thanks to her. I was lucky I guess.

EDIT: I just realised how bad that sounds, me being 'lucky'. Sorry, RIP Alan

 

[vision conquest]

Yeh I've been offered all sorts because they know its no it can't be abused .I was once on mirtazapine and it made me want to throw my self off a bridge.how can that be good for mental health .

It's all about the $...big pharma don't wan't us to be health/happy, thet wouldn't be profitable,e.
Big pharma are one of the most corrupt, evil. money hungy organizations on the palanet.
I refuse to get sucked into the rabbit hole that is covid and the various conspiracies...however to me, the one that makes the most sense is that big pharma got togethr to work on a virus that would spread quickly make a lot of people sick and then would require on going vaccination to keep us all safe/

Now we have something that requires on going vaccination for the whole world and boy it didn't take long for them to make it.

 

[Allylbenzene]

Has anyone here ever used statin or SSRI drugs?

Its annoying they can't find a med that does this without the potential for addiction

They can't patent and sell any of the best ones! Some of the best options are all OTC imo.

The study is worth a read, it appears that nmda antagonists my help lower benzo tolerence as well as opioid tolerence.
...
Iwill also experiment to see if a similar dose of dxm may help deal with benzo wd when it is time to completely stop the benzos/gabergics, the theory seems sound as many of the symptoms of benzo/gabergic wd come from the glutamate storm and nmda antagonists are good at inhibiting the effects of excess glutamate.

You have several options for preventing withdrawals and reducing tolerances (from most drugs). Many of these help "reset" things and repair any issues caused, usually via neurogenesis (BDNF) and repairing the dopamine system (eg GDNF). Many are direct or indirect nmda antagonists, and many boost GABA (sustainably).

• Theanine
  - stops stress response, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia, repairs dopaminergic system (GDNF)
• Agmatine
  - fast-acting antidepressant, anti-stress, anti-adrenaline, endogenous opioid release, boosts dopamine, prevents tolerance, potentiates other drugs, NMDA antagonist
• Magnolol & Honokiol
  - potent anti-anxiety, antidepressant, anti-stress, potentiates opioids, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia
• Rhodiola rosea (adaptogen, all-around support, boosts dopamine, anti-stress)
• Thymoquinone (pro-opioid effects, prevents opioid tolerance/withdrawals)
• Curcumin (prevents opioid tolerance, dependence, and withdrawal, potentiates opioids)
• Eugenol (direct opioid effects, prevents tolerance)
• Linalool (direct opioid effects, reduces opioid tolerance & dependence, anti-anxeity)
• Creatine (anti-depressant, reduces opioid withdrawals)
• Phytol (pro-GABA)

Opioids that work directly and indirectly:

• Caryophyllene (antidepressant, potentiates opioids, prevent opioid tolerance)
• Cannabigerol (endogenous opioids, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, antidepressant, anti-stress)
• Myrrh (delta-opioid agonist: curzerene, furanoeudesma-1,3-diene)
• Menthol (direct opioid, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, boosts GABA)
• Vanillin (endogenous opioids, antidepressant)
• Myrcene (enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, potentiates opioids, sedative)
• alpha-pinene (direct opioid effects @ mu-opioid receptor, anti-stress)

I've mentioned these things in other threads with relevant papers on their biological effects.

The other side to this appoach is restoring the body's natural ability to self-regulate.
This is achieved by restoring proper thyroid function and mitochondria (see this post on what they are and why they're worth repairing).
Using one or more of:

• Vitamin B1 (via B-complex)
• Niacinamide (50-100mg, with meals)
• Low dose aspirin (81-100mg max per day, why aspirin?)
• L-Phenylalanine (300-500mg, daily)
• Creatine (1g daily)
• CoQ10
• Ribose
• Inosine
• Coffee (+ honey + theanine) - why honey? this post explains how to avoid negative coffee reactions (shakes, jitters, anxiety)
  

  The caffeine in coffee is powerful and can act like thyroid to increase your metabolic rate and the oxidation of sugar, making it a health-protective food.
  Symptoms to expect when you do coffee right are calmness, focus, motivation, warmth, and stable energy.

All these things support mitochondria (see image below) which improves the production of energy (ATP) and the production of protective steroid hormones (see pregnenolone, progesterone in image below). Both energy and steroids are needed to handle stress adaptively.

 

[justme6263]

Has anyone here ever used statin or SSRI drugs?


They can't patent and sell any of the best ones! Some of the best options are all OTC imo.


You have several options for preventing withdrawals and reducing tolerances (from most drugs). Many of these help "reset" things and repair any issues caused, usually via neurogenesis (BDNF) and repairing the dopamine system (eg GDNF). Many are direct or indirect nmda antagonists, and many boost GABA (sustainably).

• Theanine
  - stops stress response, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia, repairs dopaminergic system (GDNF)
• Agmatine
  - fast-acting antidepressant, anti-stress, anti-adrenaline, endogenous opioid release, boosts dopamine, prevents tolerance, potentiates other drugs, NMDA antagonist
• Magnolol & Honokiol
  - potent anti-anxiety, antidepressant, anti-stress, potentiates opioids, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia
• Rhodiola rosea (adaptogen, all-around support, boosts dopamine, anti-stress)
• Thymoquinone (pro-opioid effects, prevents opioid tolerance/withdrawals)
• Curcumin (prevents opioid tolerance, dependence, and withdrawal, potentiates opioids)
• Eugenol (direct opioid effects, prevents tolerance)
• Linalool (direct opioid effects, reduces opioid tolerance & dependence, anti-anxeity)
• Creatine (anti-depressant, reduces opioid withdrawals)

Opioids that work directly and indirectly:

• Caryophyllene (antidepressant, potentiates opioids, prevent opioid tolerance)
• Cannabigerol (endogenous opioids, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, antidepressant, anti-stress)
• Myrrh (delta-opioid agonist: curzerene, furanoeudesma-1,3-diene)
• Menthol (direct opioid, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, boosts GABA)
• Vanillin (endogenous opioids, antidepressant)
• Myrcene (enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, potentiates opioids, sedative)
• alpha-pinene (direct opioid effects @ mu-opioid receptor, anti-stress)

I've mentioned these things in other threads with relevant papers on their biological effects.

The other side to this appoach is restoring the body's natural ability to self-regulate.
This is achieved by restoring proper thyroid function and mitochondria (see this post on what they are and why they're worth repairing)

• Vitamin B1 (via B-complex)
• Niacinamide (50-100mg, with meals)
• Low dose aspirin (81-100mg max per day, why aspirin?)
• L-Phenylalanine (300-500mg, daily)
• Creatine (1g daily)
• CoQ10
• Ribose
• Inosine
• Coffee (+ honey + theanine) - why honey? this post explains how to use it sustainably to avoid negative-reactions (shakes, jitters, anxiety)

The goal of all that is to support mitochondria which improves the production of energy and the production of protective steroid hormones.
Both energy and steroids are needed to handle stress adaptively.

Are they the ones you referred to later in your post? If they aren't could I ask what they are the (assuming you mean OTC = Over The Counter?)

Interesting read and post tbf.

 

[Allylbenzene]

Are they the ones you referred to later in your post? If they aren't could I ask what they are the (assuming you mean OTC = Over The Counter?)

Yes, and yes OTC = available without a prescription.
I didn't mention another good pro-GABA one called phytol.

This link explains why the items in that third list will help. It describes the potent GABAergic substances the body makes which are more effective than benzos.
Statin drugs interfere with this.

 

[justme6263]

Yes, and yes OTC = available without a prescription.
I didn't mention another good pro-GABA one called phytol.

This link explains why the items in that third list will help. It describes the potent GABAergic substances the body makes which are more effective than benzos.
Statin drugs interfere with this.

Chees mate - I'll read through it with a fine toothed comb

 

[justme6263]

Yes, and yes OTC = available without a prescription.
I didn't mention another good pro-GABA one called phytol.

This link explains why the items in that third list will help. It describes the potent GABAergic substances the body makes which are more effective than benzos.
Statin drugs interfere with this.

Ps. Would you mind if I dropped you a DM? I just don't quite understand or can't exact the relevant info from studies. Plus a couple questions re dosages and WD management.

Honestly I understand if you didn't feel comfortable providing that sort of info too

 

[Allylbenzene]

The idea is to increase levels of potent GABAergics (pregnenolone & progesterone) as shown in the image below.
The items I listed in my last post will help to achieve this. Before you use any I would encourage you to research and familarise yourself with their theraputic effects.

Also this thread has some great ideas for supporting an opioid detox.

 

[justme6263]

The idea is to increase levels of potent GABAergics (pregnenolone & progesterone) as shown in the image below.
The items I listed in my last post will help to achieve this. Before you use any I would encourage you to research and familarise yourself with their theraputic effects.

Also this thread has some great ideas for supporting an opioid detox.

Sorry - I must have got confused and misunderstood your post. My adhd means I read quickly and miss things so my apologies.

I thought it was about Managed benzo WD/taper/detox.

Thanks anyway - it will come in handy still when I reduce my current bupe maintenance program

 

[vision conquest]

There has been lots of hopefully helpful hints....man try saying that a few times quick....anyway off topic.... in this thread. so thanks to all who have contributed.

@Allylbenzene, you have posted some amazing information and I'm sure it will keep me reading for a while no worries.
There was a fair bit more to this post, stuff that I wanted to address to @Allylbenzene, as I am very interested in reading how amino acids could help me in my benzo recovery, however I seem to have lost the rest of the post and i have learned it is better to walk away sometimes. So anyway, thankyou



One of my other hobbies other than self destruction, is working out, I like to lift weights and generally if I am lifting regularly and doing ok...setting goals....achieving them, ususally that seems to coincide with periods in my life where I am much more productive as oppossed to self destructive.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Kratom can help with these things and small amounts of alcohol, like 2 beers or ciders a night till the worst has past .it will also give you motavation to get out of bed and face the world .belive me I know how you feel or will feel .replacing one drug with another is never a good idea but I firmly believe in the benefits of kratom .

Kratom i d be weary [Alcohol i d avoid], if choose Red Vein Borneo.
Or a other non stimulating painkilling/ sedating strain, start low.
Scullcap, Mulungu, Lemon-Balm, Passion flower [GABA-t inhibitor s]
and if available. A active working Valerian extract, Melatonine, Mg-bis-Glycinate.
Seem all beneficial, not feel able but shoud help on paper.

And someone else advised a good Amanita Muscaria preparation,
had a GABA effect but no real addictive properties.
Like most benzo s.The effect though is felt good,
Again no personal experience.
And almost forgot magnolia bark, a direct GABA-a.
No personal experience.

 

[vision conquest]

Has anyone here ever used statin or SSRI drugs?


They can't patent and sell any of the best ones! Some of the best options are all OTC imo.


You have several options for preventing withdrawals and reducing tolerances (from most drugs). Many of these help "reset" things and repair any issues caused, usually via neurogenesis (BDNF) and repairing the dopamine system (eg GDNF). Many are direct or indirect nmda antagonists, and many boost GABA (sustainably).

• Theanine
  - stops stress response, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia, repairs dopaminergic system (GDNF)
• Agmatine
  - fast-acting antidepressant, anti-stress, anti-adrenaline, endogenous opioid release, boosts dopamine, prevents tolerance, potentiates other drugs, NMDA antagonist
• Magnolol & Honokiol
  - potent anti-anxiety, antidepressant, anti-stress, potentiates opioids, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia
• Rhodiola rosea (adaptogen, all-around support, boosts dopamine, anti-stress)
• Thymoquinone (pro-opioid effects, prevents opioid tolerance/withdrawals)
• Curcumin (prevents opioid tolerance, dependence, and withdrawal, potentiates opioids)
• Eugenol (direct opioid effects, prevents tolerance)
• Linalool (direct opioid effects, reduces opioid tolerance & dependence, anti-anxeity)
• Creatine (anti-depressant, reduces opioid withdrawals)
• Phytol (pro-GABA)

Opioids that work directly and indirectly:

• Caryophyllene (antidepressant, potentiates opioids, prevent opioid tolerance)
• Cannabigerol (endogenous opioids, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, antidepressant, anti-stress)
• Myrrh (delta-opioid agonist: curzerene, furanoeudesma-1,3-diene)
• Menthol (direct opioid, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, boosts GABA)
• Vanillin (endogenous opioids, antidepressant)
• Myrcene (enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, potentiates opioids, sedative)
• alpha-pinene (direct opioid effects @ mu-opioid receptor, anti-stress)

I've mentioned these things in other threads with relevant papers on their biological effects.

The other side to this appoach is restoring the body's natural ability to self-regulate.
This is achieved by restoring proper thyroid function and mitochondria (see this post on what they are and why they're worth repairing).
Using one or more of:

• Vitamin B1 (via B-complex)
• Niacinamide (50-100mg, with meals)
• Low dose aspirin (81-100mg max per day, why aspirin?)
• L-Phenylalanine (300-500mg, daily)
• Creatine (1g daily)
• CoQ10
• Ribose
• Inosine
• Coffee (+ honey + theanine) - why honey? this post explains how to avoid negative coffee reactions (shakes, jitters, anxiety)

All these things support mitochondria (see image below) which improves the production of energy (ATP) and the production of protective steroid hormones (see pregnenolone, progesterone in image below). Both energy and steroids are needed to handle stress adaptively.

I just wanted to say thanks for the info in this post and the related posts and I read my previous post was slightly disjointed and maybe hard to follow.

I am also preparing to go benzo wd, mainly from clonazepam alprazelam and bromazolam along with a few others but sorry to hijack this thread, sorry to the op, lately I start to talk then find it hard to stop but I rarely actually get the point across just get lost somewhere alllong the way.

Get to the point.
I already use L-theanine and do find it helpful, but I'm interested in learning about creatine as I do also find lifting weights can help which ias kind of related.
Some of the other supplements I had never even heard of, and then there were some such as caryophyllene and myrzene that I had recently read about and thought they where cannabis terpenes?
Anyway thanks for the interesting reading and to all who contributed in this thread.....and again sorry op.....although we are pretty much talking about the same thing.

 

[lost weekend]

Has anyone here ever used statin or SSRI drugs?


They can't patent and sell any of the best ones! Some of the best options are all OTC imo.


You have several options for preventing withdrawals and reducing tolerances (from most drugs). Many of these help "reset" things and repair any issues caused, usually via neurogenesis (BDNF) and repairing the dopamine system (eg GDNF). Many are direct or indirect nmda antagonists, and many boost GABA (sustainably).

• Theanine
  - stops stress response, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia, repairs dopaminergic system (GDNF)
• Agmatine
  - fast-acting antidepressant, anti-stress, anti-adrenaline, endogenous opioid release, boosts dopamine, prevents tolerance, potentiates other drugs, NMDA antagonist
• Magnolol & Honokiol
  - potent anti-anxiety, antidepressant, anti-stress, potentiates opioids, anti-anxiety, anti-insomnia
• Rhodiola rosea (adaptogen, all-around support, boosts dopamine, anti-stress)
• Thymoquinone (pro-opioid effects, prevents opioid tolerance/withdrawals)
• Curcumin (prevents opioid tolerance, dependence, and withdrawal, potentiates opioids)
• Eugenol (direct opioid effects, prevents tolerance)
• Linalool (direct opioid effects, reduces opioid tolerance & dependence, anti-anxeity)
• Creatine (anti-depressant, reduces opioid withdrawals)
• Phytol (pro-GABA)

Opioids that work directly and indirectly:

• Caryophyllene (antidepressant, potentiates opioids, prevent opioid tolerance)
• Cannabigerol (endogenous opioids, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, antidepressant, anti-stress)
• Myrrh (delta-opioid agonist: curzerene, furanoeudesma-1,3-diene)
• Menthol (direct opioid, enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, boosts GABA)
• Vanillin (endogenous opioids, antidepressant)
• Myrcene (enhance opioid receptors, prevent opioid tolerance, potentiates opioids, sedative)
• alpha-pinene (direct opioid effects @ mu-opioid receptor, anti-stress)

I've mentioned these things in other threads with relevant papers on their biological effects.

The other side to this appoach is restoring the body's natural ability to self-regulate.
This is achieved by restoring proper thyroid function and mitochondria (see this post on what they are and why they're worth repairing).
Using one or more of:

• Vitamin B1 (via B-complex)
• Niacinamide (50-100mg, with meals)
• Low dose aspirin (81-100mg max per day, why aspirin?)
• L-Phenylalanine (300-500mg, daily)
• Creatine (1g daily)
• CoQ10
• Ribose
• Inosine
• Coffee (+ honey + theanine) - why honey? this post explains how to avoid negative coffee reactions (shakes, jitters, anxiety)

All these things support mitochondria (see image below) which improves the production of energy (ATP) and the production of protective steroid hormones (see pregnenolone, progesterone in image below). Both energy and steroids are needed to handle stress adaptively.

Where would one find all these antidotes. The local chemist .it would seem reasonable that someone going through withdrawals would have a hard time obtaining such items.