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Mushrooms give Wisdom & Information!?!?!

M

Mr. Frink

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 26, 2002
Messages
49
Tripping on Psilocybin Mushrooms seems to be different than any other type of drug. I (and many others) have had the experience of being in "contact" with a higher "intelligence". I'm wondering if others here have had that type of experience.
It feels like the Mushrooms has a mischevious personality all it's own. I often get the distinct feeling that it's trying to "teach" me something. The trips have a definite storyline to them. Often it's trying to show me how Humans are just animals...hairless apes that have gotten the idea that we're better than the rest of the animal world. Or it will tell a very "cosmic" story, about the birth, death and rebirth of the universe. It uses a lot of humor, jokes and puns in its lessons.
And here's the weird part. It speaks. I hear a voice inside my head that I can talk to. It will ask me questions, or answer questions that I have. I've tried rationalizing that it's just part of my subconscious that the drug has put me in touch with....but the things that it says couldn't *possibly* have come from my own mind. There's just no way.
This type of trip usually only happens on *high* doses of mushrooms. And it works best if I trip alone, in silent darkness.
I don't know....I'm posting this to see if anyone else has any ideas on what's going on. I've heard theories that the mushroom is an intersteller traveller, or it's a direct "phone line" to the mind of Gaia (Mother Earth).
If there have been any other threads on this topic, I'm sorry (and can you point them out to me?) I just find this topic so fascinating...
[ 01 May 2002: Message edited by: Mr. Frink ]
 
^^^No drug talk in social, so I don't think they'll allow this thread there.
On the subject itself, I actually heard a lot on the nature of shrooms. My best friend (and shroom lover) keeps telling me that shrooms were put on Earth by aliens from other planets (not from Mexico) to communicate deep subjects to the people willing to listen. Cosmic stories, nature stories, history of earth and mankind - all go into what shrooms tell you. I personally never heard any such stories from shrooms, but again I did small amounts for the laughs mainly.
Of course, of all the drugs out-there, Mushroom will teach you the most. Shamans of Latin America have been calling on Magic Mushroom for generations to connect with the divine nature of the universe and the spirits of their ancestors and all that good stuff. Carol Castaneda(sp?) wrote 7 or 8 books on the subject (all those books deal with shaman teaching him about shrooms and tripping with him). If you want to know more about what mushroom teaches, his books are probably the best place to start.
So yes, stories are associated with mushrooms and I wish more people here on BL would share these stories in Trip Reports or somewhere; it'll be interesting to note if people hear similar stories or if reading Trip Reports will cause someone to hear the same story as someone else. My friends who've been using shrooms for a while are now more interested in the body buzz and shrooms' ability to last longer than E and potentially be safer than E, so that's a different kind of a story that's I've been hearing from them lately. :)
 
What? What? It's just psilocin binding to HT receptors in your brain, whats so wise about that? Just a drug bro, give your mind more credit than the damn fungus, yo.
 
Well from my experience, I really do feel like the plants are trying to teach & point things out to me. This is especially true with Ayahuasca.
Any more for any more?
 
PuristLove is quite correct, thats the book you wish to read.
McKenna theorises that "on DMT you see who you hear on the mushrooms". You may find this particulary interesting, as yours is the only other account I have heard of hearing voices on shrooms, other than McKenna's himself.
You may be interested in DMT, it is quite chemically similar to mushrooms.
As for those close minded individuals who have posted here, I wish that you could be prepared to consider such things without instantly dissmissing them because they sound a little different.
I'm quite certain that plants have much to teach us, many of these instructions possibly come directly from the Earth (which provide the plants with nourishment and energies containing messages etc).
You're attitude dissapoints me, however I would not be so rude as to dismiss your opinion, having to sent off to social. In the very least give it enough thought to realise that it DOES NOT belong there at all.
This is a serious, challenging concept. Quite frankly I'm pleased to see some deep and intelligent discussion coming from this forum at last.
 
bullshit, complete bullshit. Not disrespecting your views, but bullshit. Just receptors being binded, buddy.
 
Sorry, maybe thats cause I'm jaded, tripped probably 200+ times on psilocybin, LSD, 5-meo-DMT, AMT, 5-meo-dipt, 2ct7, 2cb, and on and on and on...they're all drugs rearranging the chemical functions in your brain. Sorry.
 
I suppose I would be counted as one of the close-minded individuals, but I like to think of myself as just being more logical and in-touch with reality.
What are our possiblities here?
Mushrooms were created by aliens to try to tell people of their existence.
or
Mushrooms are the voice of Mother Earth, here to tell us the secrets of life.
or
Mushrooms contain Psilocybin, chemical which when released into the brain cause a distortion in reality perception (similar to, but not the same as, LSD, 5-meo-dmt, 2C-T-7, etc.) that may lead to one believing he or she has been enlightened.
I'm always bugged by people's bias towards psilocybin because mushrooms are natural. The fact that mushrooms have psychoactive chemicals is either an evolved defense mechanism or a coincidence of nature (I would guess the former). A chemical is a chemical is a chemical; it's origin is not of particular significance.
Now don't get me wrong, I do believe that a person can learn things by taking mushrooms, but I think this insight is gained because you are seeing the same things from a different paradigm, a change in perspective. . . not spiritual enlightenment.
 
well done Tad, you paralleled the voice I had in a rather intense arguement with a good friend standing around a keg, which coincidentally ended with us muching a few caps...hehe :)
 
boomers are extremely spiritual, i have tried many strains of cubensis as well as cyanescens and the plankae strain.. i love boomers, besides dimitra(another tryptamine), they are my favorite psychotropic!! anyone who says boomers do not have spiritual value is missing out.. maybe these people need to fast and cleanse their souls prior to ingesting this very powerful and amazing psychedelic!!!! boomers are absolutely amazing...
they are a good learning tool...
 
Drugs are not spiritual, people are. What most psychedelics do is let you loose inside your own brain, and if you’re a spiritual person and that is what you like to think about chances are that will be what your trip centers around. I am in no way spiritual, I don’t believe in a god/soul/purpose to life, none of that. I like to think about how people interact, how people think, etc… so that’s what my trips usually revolve around.
Although I did have a very scary experience with shrooms once that challenged my beliefs briefly. I thought I was talking to alien beings/god whatever. But that’s what drugs do. Once it was over I realized it was nothing more than a drug affecting my brain (as per what tad and @ndy said). It’s like when I’m dreaming I’m doing all sorts of crazy things but when I wake up I realize that it’s a dream and I don’t perceive it as a hidden reality.
 
I'm fairly skeptical when it comes to theories of this kind, but the truth is- we just don't know.
What we do know is that psilocybin, and other psychedelic drugs, cause chemical changes in the brain which result in the tripping experience.
Whether or not there is something else going on is simply unknowable with our present understanding of the brain, the mind, and the universe.
Something interesting, and thought provoking, is that people in datura experiences will often speak to each other entirely in gibberish, yet the next day will report similar content to the conversations they had with each other, conversations that observers are unable to understand.
Something else interesting, is that psilocybin serves no real evolutionary advantage to the mushrooms that carry it. I've heard theories that it was developed as a poison to prevent the mushroom from being eaten, yet some non-human animals seek out these mushrooms seemingly BECAUSE of the effects they produce.
I've also heard it said that it developed in symbiosis with man, BECAUSE man ate it for the effects it produced, yet I hardly see this as an evolutionary advantage as it has only been in recent years when our use of the mushroom has helped to promote the species. The tribal cultures that have used it since antiquity did not domesticate or cultivate it.
Pure
 
Very interesting diversity of viewpoints.
I have read McKenna...great stuff. Listening to his lectures is actually what got me interested in trying Mushrooms in the first place. I would love to see a discussion of his idea that the use of Psilocybin Mushrooms was a major catalyst in the evolution of humanity on this messageboard sometime.
As for the other posters...nowhere in my post did I say anything about *enlightenment*! Obviously no drug can give you spritual enlightenment. But most psychedelics can activate the part of your brain that also seems to regulate "spirituality". My point is that Psilocybin produces other effects that are quite different than other drugs.
To dismiss those effects by explaining that "psilocybin inhibits the production of serotonin and binds to the 5-HT receptors in the brain", is like chanting nonsense. It explains nothing! Remember that neurochemistry is a very young science, and the bottom line is that while there are many theories, currently science has *no idea how psilocybin produces its effects*!
And to those who claim that it's irrelevent that the active ingredients are naturally produced by plants, I say you should look into the science of Chemical Ecology. It deals with the chemically-mediated co-evolution between plants and humans. Remember that plants and animals evolved *together*. And plants have always interacted with their environment through the use of naturally produced chemicals. They "communicate" with other plants, bacteria in the soil, birds and especially insects through chemical messengers.
Isn't it interesting that this particular mushroom has evolved to produce a chemical that *happens* to resemble our own human neurotransmitters? And when you ingest this neurotransmitter-like chemical, it interacts with our neurotransmitter system, producing an effect that seems to allow this plant to "speak" with humans.
The fact is that this drug often gives users the impression of being in contact with an "other". In fact, Laurentian University has donea study on "auditory hallucinations" under psilocybin. More than a third of the participants reported an experience with "Other," "ego-alien intrusions," or a "sensed presence".
If this was just a case of "synaptic malfuntion", there wouldn't be any structure or cohesiveness to the experience. The fact is that you can enter into a dialog with this voice, and it can convey information that you *know* isn't coming from your subconcious. I mean, we all pretty much know what our minds contain, we've inventoried the files, so to speak. Yet these encounters can tell you things that are so utterly alien, that you can't help but conclude they are coming from outside of your mind.
Yeah you can dismiss this by just shrugging and saying, "it's,uh, just chemicals" or "well, see... it's a drug, y'know?". But you may be closing yourself off from the possibility that there *might* be something a little deeper going on.
 
Yeah, what PuristLove said. And I also like to think beyond simple binary oppositions such as:
"Mushrooms are the voice of Mother Earth, here to tell us the secrets of life.
or
Mushrooms contain Psilocybin, chemical which when released into the brain cause a distortion in reality perception (similar to, but not the same as, LSD, 5-meo-dmt, 2C-T-7, etc.) that may lead to one believing he or she has been enlightened."
and think more along the lines of:
"Mushrooms are the voice of Mother Earth, here to tell us the secrets of life.
AND/OR
Mushrooms contain Psilocybin, chemical which when released into the brain cause a distortion in reality perception (similar to, but not the same as, LSD, 5-meo-dmt, 2C-T-7, etc.) that may lead to one believing he or she has been enlightened."
I have had amazing Psilocybin experiences which have shown me things I would never have understood otherwise. Are these simply neuro-chemical reactions, or is there something more going on? I just don't know...
 
It's like LOVE.
You can look at it like a magical, beautiful thing or you can look at it like a series of chemical reactions.
I see it as both.
 
I am not a very spiritual person by nature and i tend to side with science over religion, but the one problem i always have with discussions of psychedelics is that people (@ndy for example) tends to use the normal mind (without drugs) as the baseline to gauge truth.
If you use LSD you should understand: reality is a subjective state impossed on you by a multitude of filters telling you subconciously what you should and shouldnt see/believe. And dont think that drugs are the only thing effecting your nureochemisty...everything you eat changes that balance.
Aliens bringing mushrooms does seem absurd to me at this moment, but when i finally take my hands off the steering wheel of my brain who knows what i may understand. The one thing that i have truely learned from drugs is that my identity, beliefs, and values are as fragile as anything i have every seen. It took me one hit of salvia and about 2 minutes to resign myself to a lifetime as an inanimate object (after 30 years of practice telling myself the opposite.)...thank god i didnt have to go through with that.
You talk about the brain like its just chemistry but you are talking about something that produces --conciousness--!!! (perhapes even a soul). There is absolutly nothing trivial about the brain or the way it works or the way it interacts with other substances, and i for one will wait for the jury to decied before i pass judgement on this issue.
 
how spiritual of a trip would you have if you IVed lab grade extracted psilocybin into your arm...
 
Originally posted by @ndy:
how spiritual of a trip would you have if you IVed lab grade extracted psilocybin into your arm...
Interesting question. And, it's actually been answered, in a way. In 1962 chemist Albert Hofmann accompanied R.Gordon Wasson on a trip to Mexico, where he was introduced to curandera Maria Sabina. There he presented her with a vial filled with pills of pure Sandoz-synthesized Psilocybin. After a night spent under their influence, Maria declared the pills "the same spirit as the mushrooms". So, disregarding your used of the loaded term spiritual, yes--the trip would be similiar. I'm not sure what your point is, though...
The advantage to using a drug that is the product of the natural world is that nature has use-tested these compounds for millions of years. Mushrooms have been used by man for thousands of years. It has a history of human usage that a product of the laboratory like LSD doesn't have. Not to mention the fact that psilocybin has a natural affinity to the chemistry of the brain, unlike LSD & MDMA. The trip is shorter, and the "hangover" is minimal, because the brain recognizes the compound and is able to metabolize it much faster.
People in this thread have attributed the Mushroom's effects as being due to: "seeing the same things from a different paradigm" or "synaptic malfuntion" or "Just receptors being binded". But these attempts at an explaination do nothing to address the mushroom's unique properties. Why is it much more common for people to hear a voice talking inside their head, while under the influence of psilocybin? If its effects were just due to seeing things from a different paradigm, why wouldn't the same thing happen with LSD? There is something unique about tryptamines. Reports of people experiencing encounters with entities during DMT experiences just add to the oddness of it all.
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