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Morphine chemistry question

L

lptrax

Bluelighter
Joined
May 31, 2011
Messages
119
This might be more of a chemistry question but here goes.

Morphine used in pills is morphine sulfate (pentahydrate) which weighs about 750 grams/mol

Morphine base comes to 285 grams per mol.

So does this mean that if I isolated the morphine from the pills and then based it out my final product of morphine base would come to half the weight?

For example I take 10 100mg pills and extract the morphine sulfate into water then raise the ph to 9.1 to precipitate out morphine base I'm going to end up with less than a half gram of the base?

This is confusing me because wouldn't that make 1 mg of pharm morphine (sulfate) actually a lot weaker than say 1 mg of morphine HCL (the HCL is 300 g/mol whereas the sulfate is 750). That sulfate powder will have a bunch of bound water and a heavy SO4 group whereas the HCL powder will be more 'pure' (or at least contain more morphine ions per same mass of molecule).

So if morphine HCL pills hit the market a 30mg HCL pill would be as analgesically effective (as strong) as a 60 mg morphine sulfate pill?

I also hear that base to base morph and heroin are just as strong. I also hear people say H is twice as strong as M. Is this because heroin HCL has half the mass of morphine sulfate?

Also makes you think drug producers might use a heavier salt than HCL to make their heroin and get more weight for the same bang. If I'm right about any of this that is.
 
Heroin is 2x to 3x more potent then morphine because of its efficiency of crossing the BBB due to the acetyl group at the 3,6 location.
 
you missed that morphine sulphate is a compound of 2 molecules of morphine and 1 molecule of sulfuric acid. sulfuric acid is diprotic, it has 2 acidic protons. if you just had 1 equivalent of morphine to 1 eq of sulfuric then it would be morphine hydrogensulphate or morphine bisulphate. (shoot me, i like the antiquated sulphur spelling.) codeine phosphate has 3 mol codeine and 1 mol phosphoric, etc.

you will always lose some weight converting from a salt to a free base 'cause you're removing the acid component of a drug salt. that doesn't mean you're losing potency. generally people think up this number called the freebase conversion ratio which is what fraction of the drug salt is the actual drug molecule.

heroin is more potent than morphine (2.2x more potent than an equal dose of morphine when IV or smoked) not only because it's more lipophilic (more drug molecules reach the brain) but also because its metabolites the monoacetylmorphines fit better into opioid receptors than plain morphine does. if you take them orally, heroin is converted into morphine pretty rapidly so it acts as a prodrug for morphine with high bioavailibility. (morphine is only ~30% absorbed orally).
 
Last edited:
sekio said:
you missed that morphine sulphate is a compound of 2 molecules of morphine and 1 molecule of sulfuric acid. sulfuric acid is diprotic, it has 2 acidic protons. if you just had 1 equivalent of morphine to 1 eq of sulfuric then it would be morphine hydrogensulphate or morphine bisulphate. (shoot me, i like the antiquated sulphur spelling.) codeine phosphate has 3 mol codeine and 1 mol phosphoric, etc.

you will always lose some weight converting from a salt to a free base 'cause you're removing the acid component of a drug salt. that doesn't mean you're losing potency. generally people think up this number called the freebase conversion ratio which is what fraction of the drug salt is the actual drug molecule.

heroin is more potent than morphine (2.2x more potent than an equal dose of morphine when IV or smoked) not only because it's more lipophilic (more drug molecules reach the brain) but also because its metabolites the monoacetylmorphines fit better into opioid receptors than plain morphine does. if you take them orally, heroin is converted into morphine pretty rapidly so it acts as a prodrug for morphine with high bioavailibility. (morphine is only ~30% absorbed orally).
Click to expand...

Yes people don't realize that oral diamorphine is more potent than morphine itself(1.5-2x under normal circumstances, but is dose dependent.) That is why oral H and oral oxycodone are actually about equipotent with each other, contrary to the popular opinion that oral oxy is amazing, while somehow oral H is the worst thing in the world.

Not too sure on mono-acetlymorphine making dia more potent though, I mean it may very well contribute to the initial rush and euphoria, but the half-life is still like 10-15 minutes, so it doesn't make much sense that it contributes much to heroin, which is known for lasting several hours at high doses.
 
Thanks sekio that's exactly what I missed; the 2:1 ratio of morphine to sulfate. Forgot the H2 in the H2SO4 that's why I posted my findings didn't seem right. Thanks
 
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