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"Mind tools" and tripping.

mydrugbuddy

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There seems to be alot of fortunate people that have rock hard fearless psyches, when it comes to taking psychedelics.

Do you ever use any thougt tools or mantras etc to turn a potential bad process of thoughts.

Its in the lap of the gods to an extend i guess, but im sure there must be thigs to help make it good, and not scary.....

all replies welcome. Even BHM.
 
I've never used such techniques as far as I can recall. Although sure I must have at times. Would be nothing especially deep, mind. Muttering "Aaaaaaaaaand relax" to meself under me breath if coming up sillyhard on summat maybe. That'd be about the extent of it. Have never had more than fleeting moments of The Fear. Most psyches produce euphoria as a handy side-effect so is rarely an issue for me or anybody else really. Truly bad trips are actually very rare. Admittedly not much use to know that if you happen to be amongst the unfortunate minority :\

My tips for keeping a good mindstate for me would be fairly obvious stuff like having some good music to hand to focus and/or distract/absorb you if desired or required. If really needing distraction then viewing material can be very effective. Summat light and entertaining - comedy, cartoons, kids tv and the like are always a good bet. Even video games can help to ease nagging anxieties. The idea of distraction techniques is simply to distract from the heavier thought processes which can take over and remind yourself that tripping is mostly just great fun =D

Also, one tried and tested method to avoid trip anxiety is to have benzos to hand. But not to use 'em. Just knowing you have something within easy reach that will mellow (not abort - you need large doses of antipsychotics to actually abort a trip) even the most out-of-control headfuck of a trip is generally enough to ensure it won't happen. GBL & Co are also very handy for similar reasons: you can simply KO yourself and sleep through as much as you may wish to if it somehow does go sour. That and it's a true euphoriant so puts a positive spin on anything. MDMA can be used to similar effect - namely providing a solid bedrock of pure euphoria to nestle your psyche of choice into so all stays very much on the fluffycomfyfunfunfun side of Swirlsville.

But mainly...

NSFW:
don%27t+panic.jpg


Tripping is fun not scary. That's all you really need to know to make it so <3
 
I haven't taken LSD for many years now, but really enjoyed it with a small group of trusted friends for a good while.

I didn't enjoy it out at big parties and preferred to take it in a safe place so I could immerse myself completely.

I've seen people get in some very nasty states and lost a good friend to serious mental illness triggered by a bad acid experience, although he certainly had problems prior.

For me there was often a point where I felt I would fall into the abyss, possibly death and the letting go at this point seemed key to not ending up in a bad way. The same with 'the horrors', acceptance of those images and thoughts seemed to disarm any real problems.

Letting go of everything including your very self is the most rewarding and enjoyable part of the experience, coming out the other side as the sun comes up often felt like being reborn.

You can't go wrong with a copy of Easter Everywhere by the 13th Floor Elevators<3

13th Floor Elevators - Pictures (Leave Your Body Behind)

All that said don't take it too seriously ;)
 
Aye. Thanks. David Bowie said it in Hunky Dory though i couldnt guarentee he meant it in the same context."fear is only n your head, so forgot your head, and you'll be free yeah"

I think I'll know if and when im ready. I'll be resilent, calm, and happ. Maybe a little bit one day lol.
 
Swans, TG and Whitehouse while coming up. Florid religious texts and / or Baudelaire to read.

If you're not laughing at yourself within a couple of hours, then you know it's time to lay off the tripping.
 
I haven't taken LSD for many years now, but really enjoyed it with a small group of trusted friends for a good while.

I didn't enjoy it out at big parties and preferred to take it in a safe place so I could immerse myself completely.

I've seen people get in some very nasty states and lost a good friend to serious mental illness triggered by a bad acid experience, although he certainly had problems prior.

For me there was often a point where I felt I would fall into the abyss, possibly death and the letting go at this point seemed key to not ending up in a bad way. The same with 'the horrors', acceptance of those images and thoughts seemed to disarm any real problems.

Letting go of everything including your very self is the most rewarding and enjoyable part of the experience, coming out the other side as the sun comes up often felt like being reborn.

You can't go wrong with a copy of Easter Everywhere by the 13th Floor Elevators<3

13th Floor Elevators - Pictures (Leave Your Body Behind)

All that said don't take it too seriously ;)

QFT. All of that.

Particularly the letting go stuff. Is absolutely vital. Am nigh-on positive this is why I've never really had problem tripping. Am just naturally inclined to go with the flow even when not tripping. Being either alone (if sure of yourself and/or inclined to be more comfortable in your own company) or with a small group of trusted chums (or both - friends present but "escape" options (to a different room or whatever) available) is much more preferable than around strangers. At least in general. Some do find it works better the other way round though.

Trip curve:

Falling apart/comeup - this is usually the scary bit if there's gonna be a scary bit cos you can never be sure when it's gonna level off and your ego is starting to show the cracks. Let it crack.
Losing yourself/plateau - this is usually the most fun part when your inhibitions are down... or at least all over the shop. Even a rough comeup is usually forgotten during this stage. Imo, ime, ymmv, lsd, xtc, etc.
Reconstitution/driftdown - this is usually the most rewarding part when the lesson (if any) subconsciously learnt during the loss stage are found a home. I generally find this stage the chilled 'n' dreamy stage when cupsa tea and comfy things are king. Probably the least appreciated and most important part of any trip. Imo, ime, mda, 2cb, etc.

That aside, I don't tend to go in for planning trips. Go with the flow at every step of the way. Unless you feel the need to learn to fly via the medium of upper storey windows or summat :D

Fun, not work. Any work stuff involved is a natural by-product you get by osmosis anyway.

"fear is only n your head, so forgot your head, and you'll be free yeah"

This.
 
Good thoughts, bad thoughts - George Clinton. Sorry for no link, but it's the thought that counts. As it were.
 
Also, one tried and tested method to avoid trip anxiety is to have benzos to hand. But not to use 'em. Just knowing you have something within easy reach that will mellow (not abort - you need large doses of antipsychotics to actually abort a trip) even the most out-of-control headfuck of a trip is generally enough to ensure it won't happen. GBL is also very handy for similar reasons: you can simply KO yourself and sleep through as much as you may wish to if it somehow does go sour. That and it's a true euphoriant so puts a positive spin on anything. MDMA can be used to similar effect - namely providing a solid bedrock of pure euphoria to nestle your psyche of choice into so all stays very much on the fluffycomfyfunfunfun side of Swirlsville.
So true! Having any real anxiolytic around just seems to ease the mind. If I have GHB/GBL or another potent alcohol like sedative(1-ethynylcyclohexanol was pretty damn amazing....liked it just as much as GHB in certain respects)I have pretty much no fear, if I have a 5HT3a agonist as well, there will be zero fear. Benzos pretty much cut down 75% of the fear especially if I have a quick acting one like Etiz or Alp/Diaz. Really though I just like to have GHB or the alcohol esque sedatives on hand as they take even less away from the trips than benzos do and only last for about 3ish hours mainly, kick in easily within 15-20 minutes usually feeling it really strongly by 30, and their highly euphoric in addition to the anxiety relief it provides. I dunno though, I definitely don't recommend KO'ing yourself(you clearly didn't recommend they do that but just sayin!), at least not right away. Even when the seas where seriously rough I only ever KO'd myself once by accident and rarely need to high of a dose to put a positive spin on things, note though that i'm one of those people who find GHB ridiculously euphoric. Plus its always a weird feeling to wake up tripping and waking from a g-induced sleep can be a bit confounding in its own right. I remember that time when I came to, super confusing, though after I realized what was going on I was laughing pretty hard. I wish I liked stimulants more but unfortunately as time goes on I seem to disdain them more and more. MDMA is one of the few things with a stimulant push i'll use without another sedative in the mix and even then sometimes MDMA gets a bit out of hand, though it rarely lasts more than an hour(i'm sure some of you know what i'm talking about, when that come up literally floors you, I just always seem to never expect it and it always hits me at the wrong time). Though I do have to say bumping or plugging around 15-40mgs does do the trick for me without the overstimulation but I don't think i've tried it to many times for fear that it would only escalate the problem, though I know i've done it when GHB was around(shit if it did turn even more sour its just an excuse to dose GHB, after all who in the world doesn't like MDMA+a little GHB?!?).

Like Shambles as well, I don't have any particular tricks that I use besides one, kinda like Shambles except its just a technique I use to shut up my mind when a hard come up occurs thats me me and my mind on edge/antsy. I just think a nice thought like "Simply relax, float away into the bliss that will soon surely come, relax and let the peace take you away." and i'll repeat the line over and over in my head. As i'm going, I progressively slow the sentence down until it takes me 30 seconds or more to fully finish it in my mind. It probably sounds weird but I started doing it when anxiety first began appearing in my life as a way to quiet my mind and the sometimes persistent racing thoughts. That state can pretty similar to the irky fast/hard come up psychedelics can provide. It can really quiet my mind and then allow me to deal with the dumb thoughts and get rid of them, or simply just sit in peace and let things cool down for a few minutes.

I also like Sham don't really have many problems past the come up but on occasion things might lurch along with me into the trip, but then I use the next best step he pointed out, distraction! Just find anything that makes you feel comfortable. Sometimes during the rough ones, I would just go over and burrow into a soft blanket on my comfortable bed and shut my eyes, and slow down my mind until I felt comfortable trying to get back to things. Almost always after 45 minutes I would be in a better place, if not and I had to much energy to keep laying I would usually put on a favorite show. Video games do work for me, but when in a bad mood on psychedelics they have to be specific ones or else they just annoy me because they don't provide that perfect level of focus without actually focusing to hard, if that makes any sense, haha. Almost always I just chose some absurd comedy or quirky children's show. Adventure Time is a good pretty nonsensical child's show and I would recommend pretty much anything you liked as a child as it has the added bonus of warm cozy nostalgia. Anything that you like that will make you feel more at home whilst in an uncomfortable altered state is a good one. For me one thing that calms me is nature, so when its possible I love to either by myself or with my dog walk into the woods. That or simply just take a walk. I find it pretty hard to focus on the thoughts when there's so many other things going on around you in the outside world. Oh and you could call a friend or jump online and chat with them about anything really. I love just having standard, "So hows everything?" sort of talks with people when things aren't the greatest. As always though the ultimate healer is time. That is also a large calmer to me. I just keep remembering that no matter what this state will end in a matter of hours, this usually actually prompts me to really try to work everything out as who wants to sit in some uncomfortable state for the duration of the trip instead of having a blast figuring new things about yourself and having all the existential ponderings a person could ever want whilst blasting through the cosmos of your mind ?!?

On occasion the negative feelings can be related to body load or the projectile vomiting but I find 9 times out of 10 its down to you, not god or that sort of thing, once again least to me(not trying to trample on someones beliefs even though I doubt it was meant to be super literal!). I mean when I think about I doubt I have a rock hard psyche, maybe a bit stronger than some others but its no impenetrable fortress thats for sure. Oh and its my thoughts that the people that can better deal with psychedelics are just better or more versed with dealing with emotions and that, maybe from the lives they lived or what not. I think its more dependent on that sort of thing rather than having some fearless psyche. Those without fear usually either die quickly or don't, but I can tell you being fearless plays more towards arrogance as everyone in this world has reason to be scared, fear was incorporated into ourselves for good reason, though it like anything is subject to balance. For example as well, someone whos able to realize that fearing death is an irrational concept in many forms would probably be able to handle a psychedelic state better than someone who can't, though thats my opinion of course. I mean psychedelics aren't always puppies, kittens, and rainbows but in my mind the reason people don't really report so many bad trips is as its said, the bad are some of the best most times. While its going on you may despise it but i've know few people who didn't take away quite a bit from a bump ride down the road! All the trainwreck sort of trips i've seen or read about came from people breaking psychedelic commandments like set/setting or binging on other drugs for days without food or much water then arbitrarily chomp down a psychedelic without much thought. As long as you put love and forethought into your trips they should all turn out pretty well, that is if you like the psychedelic state.

For me personally, taking a good dose of LSD feels reminiscent of returning home....especially if its been awhile since its graced my tongue with its sexy presence!
 
I've never had a Benzo on hand while doing acid, ever.

Yeah I'm hard.

But that's not the point. I'm from a different age/planet delete as applicable. If you need a Benzo on hand doing acid then you shouldn't be doing acid. Probably.
 
^ I'd almost say the opposite if I were more cavalier about mental health issues. Folk who feel the need to sedate themselves quite possibly have the most to gain by realising they actually don't.

Just to make clear: Definitely not recommending KO doses of GBL or anything else! But as an absolute last resort it's a guranteed success: you will be unconscious and remember nothing. I've only ever done it by accident and - aside from being annoyed at losing an hour or so of tripping time - I actually kinda liked it. As you mentioned up there, GBL/GBH is insanely euphoric so is hard to get anything other than feeling bloody great out of it (assuming you're not somebody who reacts badly to it anyway). So ya, don't KO yourself, kiddies. But for the uberanxious it may be good to know there is an emergency exit that'll slam shut within 15minutes or so in the case of GBL if you really, really, really need a way out inna hurry.

And for MDMA I'm mostly meaning just a low background dose. Full-on doses also much fun but perhaps not recommended for the less-experienced. Can be very disorientating no matter how euphoric.

Also, as Help?!?! mentioned above, panicky feelings tend to be fleeting. Overwhelming sometimes but brief. Worth perservering with cos "This too shall pass" (a damn fine mantra if ever there was one - words to live by <3). That and the fact that "difficult" trips tend to be the most rewarding. I say I don't have bad trips cos I don't. I do sometimes have tricky blighters that would ruin me (at least in the acute timescale) if I didn't feel able to let things go so easily.
 
I never had benzos to hand when I was taking LSD, I used to like a bit of sped with it now and again for the psychotic edge but that was in the fairly brief period when I took it at parties. I have done it a few times on the back end of MDMA but in general I prefer to take it on its own.

I have some Chlorpromazine which I've read is supposed to be one the recommended medical treatments for 'LSD psychosis', I've always managed to survive the rough bits and come out the other side feeling better for it. Although, like I said I have seen people in a truly awful state and looking back if I'd have had access to Benzos or Chlorpromazine I would have given it to them.

There is always a danger of building acid and the like up to being something to be scared of, it does need some respect but in general it's a very safe drug and very unlikely to result in a truly unpleasant experience.

Music on acid is something I do miss, I was introduced to TG, psychic Tv and The Butthole Surfers for the first time all on acid, not for the faint hearted but really quite enjoyable with the right group of people who know when to take the piss and when to back off and look out for you a bit.
 
I've never had a Benzo on hand while doing acid, ever.

Yeah I'm hard.

But that's not the point. I'm from a different age/planet delete as applicable. If you need a Benzo on hand doing acid then you shouldn't be doing acid. Probably.

people have different reasons for wanting to trip. The thing is for me, the perspective shifting makes the risks and fears more worthwile. See things in a flash or remain blind for life ? Is that overdramaticing it ? Benzoes are like putting those stabilers on a little kids bike.

Bad or good trips have affected me deeply for months aftewards. One time i was very warm and friendly for months, then the next time i was introveted and self concious for months......
 
Yeah I used to like speed and acid at parties, also never had benzos to hand. But always plenty of weed.

One time had E and acid at a party and that put me on a bad trip, you know the score, just feeling very very vulnerable, out of place, no way out of this venue for hours, everybody plotting things, went very bad.

From that time on, I couldn't take acid at parties any more, I always went down the same path...

And gradually I stopped taking acid altogether, I enjoyed the come-up, and the peak, but that 6 hours or so of slowly coming down just led me to bad feelings.

I miss it, especially the parties, to me that's the perfect environment to trip, a proper pumping little party where acid (music and drug) is the focus....sooo much better than tripping at home, in the country, wherever.....Not that I haven't had some amazing trips in all sorts of situations, but for me acid and parties were the best....

I did manage to continue partying on mushrooms and speed after the acid got bad, they were a slightly different vibe, and didn't send me down the bad paths.

Only psych I do now is DMT, and there's no chance of spending hours in torment with that. But I doubt i could do much in the way of stacking boxes or throwing shapes on it, never tried standing up even =D
 
^ m uberanxious it may be good to know there is an emergency exit that'll slam shut within 15minutes or so in the case of GBL if you really, really, really need a way out inna hurry.

A.

Also, as Help?!?! mentioned above, panicky feelings tend to be fleeting. Overwhelming sometimes but brief. Worth perservering with cos "This too shall pass" (a damn fine mantra if ever there was one - words to live by <3). That and the fact that "difficult" trips tend to be the most rewarding. I say I don't have bad trips cos I don't. I do sometimes have tricky blighters that would ruin me (at least in the acute timescale) if I didn't feel able to let things go so easily.


is gbl/gbh the very best. Will etizolam do ? (appartney it has 7 times more effective anxioltic action than etizolam. i can still feel that effect from the etiz.)
 
Mmmmm as I've said I've never tried benzos with LSD, I've seen people drink heavily on it and it seemed to seriously dull the effects, I'd image Z drugs or benzos would have similar effects. I assume you would just knock yourself out with GBL, can't deal with the stuff myself.

I think having something to hand might well lessen any panic as you have options but using them would be a very last resort as, like the venerable Mr S says theses things will pass, working through them can be so rewarding ...seeing things for what they are or at least it can seem that way, the wiring underneath the board as Terence McKenna once said.

I've taken Chlorpromazine for medical reasons in the past and would imagine it would work quite well in a really messy situation but to really need something like that I doubt you would be in a position to take it of your own accord.

Dosing is quite important IME to small an amount of LSD can be quite unsettling, I decent dose is much better. Memories of such experiences are vague and explanations impossible to provide but more than once I remember the epiphany 5 hours in of realising that I'd dropped acid earlier and that's what had been going on, you need a good degree of immersion to get the best out of psychedelics IMHO

I've never done DMT but will do before I die
 
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"Best" is obviously completely subjective. It's certainly not everybody's cuppa (burntplasticky-tasting) tea. It's fairly stimulating, unfeasibly anxiolytic, and outrageously euphoric. But some folk would no doubt disagree if it disagrees with 'em. And it obviously comes under the "risky for those with addictive personality" heading which may not be ideal. I'd cautiously advise it for people who feel the need to remove all trace of anxiety but also warn that it will strongly colout the actual trip. Very easy to overdo it and KO yourself too - especially when spangled enough to have changed your baseline tolerance. Like - say - drinking alcohol on stims, you will need more than you would sober but unlike stims/booze combo you will pass out cold if you overdo it even slightly. Short-acting too and comes with rebound stimulation and anxiety so redosing tends to be required. Still, anxiety is almost inconceivable on geebs.

I'd probably say a low dose of a benzo is probably "better" if anxiolytic stuffs really are necessary. Best off just taking the psyche itself and not combining with anything if at all possible.
 
Even noids open those 'doors of perception' for me. I dont get trapped ina viscious snarling vipers nest in there anymore. I fly through visions of what movies and pc games will look like in 20 years time. I feel as if there is no reason to be afraid, yet i am afraid.

im not looking to kill any bad trip, just calm it to a managable level,
 
... the wiring underneath the board as Terence McKenna once said.

Cliche as they may be, checking out folk like Mr McKenna can actually be helpful too. The true psychedelic envangelists may be prone to hippydippy claptrap but their enthusiasm and positivity can be infectious. Also the insights presented can be really fascinating. Plus McKenna's voice is just soooooooo soothing and hypnotic. Could listen to him speak for hours. And often have.

One of me fave talks of his: Terence McKenna: Surfing Finnegans Wake. Particularly good introduction to McKenna (imo and all that) cos it's such an insightful take on literary criticism with very little hippydippy shite involved yet still all about psychedelia. Any excuse to post it and spread the word ;)

Dosing is quite important IME to small an amount of LSD can be quite unsettling

QFT. Again. Within reason, more is actually more with acid. Within reason. I'd avoid low doses no matter what. Sub-psychedelic/borderline doses just feel weird and uncomfortable. Not enough to dissolve enough ego to not intensely miss the bits you have temporarily misplaced. Not saying you need to be thumbprinting or owt, but "solid" dosing is the way forward. Of course knowing your dose with acid can be tricky so probably not worth worrying too much about. Worth mentioning though.
 
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