Methadone for the constant Suboxone relapser

[RTrain]

I was wondering on people's thoughts about whether Methadone is a good choice for myself. I have gotten clean with Suboxone once, a short term 6 week taper, but relapsed around 1-2 months after that. I have since been in a constant back in forth with heroin (was oxy for 3-4 months until I made the switch) and Suboxone. It seems everytime I get on Subs with the intention to quit (not the many occasions of 1 or 2 days on Subs until I get a paycheck for more dope) I find it very tough to start being comfortable on the Subs, still feel mild w/d for 3-4 days. After that its all good for a week or so and I just crave like crazy. Its been about 1-1/4 years and in that time I have tried to get clean or maintain with Subs on 3 different occasions. I have made it 1 month, 3 weeks and 1.5 weeks the 1st, 2nd and 3rd times I tried, respectively.

So in my shoes does it seem like Methadone is a better option? Does it block cravings much better than Suboxone? I hear it loses the opiate buzz you get from it after a while, too, but what opioid doesn't after a long time using daily?

I'd like to get completely clean in little time I am definitely not too fond of the idea of visiting a clinic every day. I would like to try Subs 1 more time before I make a leap to Methadone. But if I can't do it that time I think I will take a much deeper look into a Methadone Clinic. The biggest obstacle opiates have presented to me is the huge financial burden. I could live with being on opiates everyday, but piling up debt and having to money to spend on anything is getting real old.

 

[itsALLfake]

If you have already gone without opiates for over a week after Suboxone, and relapsed, what makes you think trying Methadone will be any different? I'm not saying it won't work, but it takes more than getting on a maintenance program to get clean...

 

[caseface99]

^^ Agreed

Have you tried getting clean, working more of a program than simple drug replacement therapy?

I did the whole switching between dope and subs thing for a few years, made the switch and ended up relapsing way more than 3 times.

This last time though, I made the switch as well as made some real changes to my lifestyle in general, also went to meetings 5-6 days a week for the first few months, and now I'm coming up on 6 months sober.

Note that I had to be willing to quit everything, not just opiates. As well as drop all my friends, spend a couple weeks inpatient at a rehab, move into a sober living environment in a different city, and go to meetings almost everyday for a couple months. It's been hard, but it's been worth it.

 

[neversickanymore]

Nope it way to easy to use on top off. If I were you I would start to formulate a plan for recovery were you will be able to live in peace.. If you are using on top of suboxone then you have an underlying root to your addiction that you need to identify and address. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[ztalbott]

I'm not sure where some of the comments are getting their information... But there is almost 50 years of research and studies that point to the proven effectiveness of methadone treatment. Buprenorphine (SUboxone/Subutex) has a 'ceiling effect...' So, in short, it just isn't "strong enough" for many patients. Methadone might very well be a MUCH better option. The relapse rates for methadone treatment are between 10-30% with it decreasing the longer someone is in treatment... The relapse rates for "traditional" abstinence-based treatments for opioid addiction are HIGHER than 90%! Statistics and numbers don't lie. Opioid Treatment Programs ("methadone clinics") do a lot more than just dispense the medication... You will get a full treatment program there including individual and group counseling. I am NO apologist for what sometimes passes as methadone treatment in the United States, and there ARE bad clinics out there, but by and large it is certainly something you should consider. The National Institutes of Health (NIH) deemed methadone maintenance treatment the timeless "gold standard treatment" for opioid addiction and the Centers for Disease Control & Prevention (CDC) referred to it as the "most effective treatment for opioid addiction" currently available. I highly doubt either of those things would be the case, not even mentioning similar statements from the World Health Organization, U.S. Department of Health & Human Services, Institute of Medicine and COUNTLESS other academic, research & clinical authorities throughout the world, if it wasn't truly the most effective option for the VAST majority of individuals. Lack of clinical and research knowledge about methadone does not, unfortunately, stop many people from taking a strong stance against it.

I encourage you to consider it and to look at truly CREDIBLE sources when you're learning. There's a lot of crap, misinformation and stigma out there about it... But the research is clear. Methadone saves lives.

Good luck!
zt

 

[donkeyPUNCH]

IMO methadone is great for people who want to get out of the junkie lifestyle but still want to catch a buzz every day.

you can call it pessimism or whatever, but everyone I've ever known who went on methadone ended up using dope on top of it, or just outright selling it for dope money. I just don't believe in it as a way to realistically get clean.

suboxone worked for me because I was sick and tired of the whole opiate shebang. I wanted out, I wanted to be normal again. suboxone never once got me high while I was using it to get clean, and the blocker effect WORKS. so even if you do break down and try to use, you don't get the reward feeling in your brain. only the guilt of being weak, which helps you avoid doing it again IME.

 

[itsALLfake]

I'm not sure where some of the comments are getting their information... But there is almost 50 years of research and studies that point to the proven effectiveness of methadone treatment.

I'm getting the information from the fact they were already off of Buprenorphine, and then, they relapsed... I'd like to know where you're getting your statistics from.. People aren't called back to clinics after they haven't been there in a while to get a drug test to add to their statistics, and the fact that they stop going forever doesn't prove someone hasn't relapsed...and surveys..yeah, opiate addicts never lie, so those are reliable.

 

[adder]

I was on methadone, I am on Suboxone. Neither really helped me with the cravings. But in my experience Suboxone is still better. Methadone made my mind cloudy and my reactions were terribly slow, I couldn't notice it until I quit methadone, Suboxone doesn't work that way. Methadone made me very depressed to a point that I cared about nothing at all, Suboxone doesn't make me depressed on its own, it's just there in the background. However, I constantly get mental cravings on Suboxone and as it takes some time before I could get calm from using a regular opioid agonist, I often end up using other drugs on top of Suboxone, and weed kind of became a substitute for the calming effect of morphine for me. Neither substitute will help you stay away from relapsing, but from my experience much much more % of methadone patients use heroin than in case of Suboxone patients. The blocking effect of buprenorphine thus helps to some extent even if it's not really your choice not to do a full agonist but "Suboxone's", you can always have second thoughts with it much easier than with methadone.

I did a reverse switch, from methadone to Suboxone, and it was because the PAWS was making me relapse. Suboxone helped me a lot and although its mood lifting effect was gone after ~2 months, I still consider it positive unlike methadone.

 

[Sam7000]

Iv been on a subutex 3 times now & every time I got bad withdrawal symptoms in the first 3 days of using so now I get 60ml of meth a day but I sell 300ml for £30 to fund my heroin use but to be honest the methadone is stronger than the heroin that is sold on the streets of westyorkshire, the quality of H in the uk is terrible it must only be 3% if that!!!!! Is there anything else I can take ????