Gabapentinoids Megathread Retro Sedatives

[red22]

This medication was originally called desoxyphenobarbital:

"Yes, primidone really boosted my mood. I was feeling more productive at work even at times, my motivation levels skyrocketed but it wasn't a constant feeling. It was like a big boost at first but then it dropped off. I started taking it just after 2020 lockdown started and I was having the best time of my life. Didn't realise at the time primidone probably had something to do with that. And at that time I got a lot more emotional. Watching films would make me tear up and choke up. Some films which I'd seen before, just thinking about powerful scenes in them would make me question whether I'm capable of even sitting through it. I'd just get so choked up."

"On day 3 of taking primidone I cried for 30 minutes in my room because I felt like it's actually helping and I thought I've finally found something which helps my tremors and I believed I can finally beat ET. Honestly, those 30 minutes were the happiest I have ever been and probably ever will be."

trikristmas  2025-05-03  h‍ttps://www.reddit.com/r/EssentialTremor/comments/1kcvmgi/primidone_slight_euphoria_and_physical_symptoms/mqajuug/

 

[red22]

"I would describe it as a Benzodiazepine with moderate cognitive euphoria (such as talking a lot) and moderate motivation enhancement. Additionally, there is one aspect that I particularly appreciate: while all Benzodiazepines numb your emotions to some degree, Mephenaqualone does not. Substances like Clonazepam, Flunitrazepam, and Rilmazafone are milder in this regard, whereas Alprazolam, Clonazolam, Bretazenil, and Lorazepam can induce dysphoria and make you feel completely emotionless. Mephenaqualone, on the other hand, only numbs negative thoughts and replaces them with euphoria, despite also being a positive allosteric modulator on GABA-A receptors." @Mana0909 2024-12-17 https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/16179939

 

[placebonaut]

had to look up the Dali miltown art, pretty cool.

Dalí's Crisalida

The drug Meprobamate, invented by Frank Berger in the 1940s and available to the public in 1955, is largely associated with suburban housewives. Marketed as “Miltown” by Wallace Laboratories, these minor tranquilizers were aggressively advertised towards women, claiming to allow them to stay...

www.minniemuse.com

I love Soma, tried a few Quaalude analogues but would love the real deal. I suspect I would very much enjoy real barbs, shame you can't get any!

 

[red22]

Thanks for posting that, I was wondering about that.

Based on your experience with Soma, do you agree with the quotes in one of the Miltown ads on that page:

"The primary finding of these studies is that meprobamate ['Miltown'] alone ... produces no behavioral toxicity in our subjects as measured by our tests of driving, steadiness and vision."

Marquis, D. G., Kelly, E. L., Miller, J. G., Gerard, R. W. and Rapoport, A.: Ann. New York Acad. Sci. 67:701, May 3, 1957.

"Since it [meprobamate—'Miltown'] does not cloud consciousness or lessen intellectual capacity, it can be used ... even by those busily occupied in intellectual work."

Kepecs, B. L.: Pennsylvania M.J. 60:177, Feb. 1957.

"... the patient never describes himself as feeling detached or 'insulated' by the drug ['Miltown']. He remains completely in control of his faculties, both mental and physical ..."

Sokoloff, O. J.: A.M.A. Arch. Dermat. & Syph. 74:393, Oct. 1956.

"It ['Miltown'] ... does not cloud the sensorium, and has a helpful somnifacient effect devoid of 'hangover'."

Kessler, L. N. and Bernard, R. D.: M. Times 84:431, April 1956.

"In anxiety and tension states, meprobamate relaxes without dulling cortical function to the same extent as the commonly-used barbiturates."

Rindskopf, W., Ravreby, M., Gutenkauf, C. and Sands, S. L.: J. Iowa M. Soc. 47:57, Feb. 1957.

 

[placebonaut]

Thanks for posting that, I was wondering about that.

Based on your experience with Soma, do you agree with the quotes in one of the Miltown ads on that page:

"The primary finding of these studies is that meprobamate ['Miltown'] alone ... produces no behavioral toxicity in our subjects as measured by our tests of driving, steadiness and vision."

not at the dose I take it at!

maybe a light dose you'd get away with it but then at a light dose there's not much point taking it IMHO.

calling BS on this

Marquis, D. G., Kelly, E. L., Miller, J. G., Gerard, R. W. and Rapoport, A.: Ann. New York Acad. Sci. 67:701, May 3, 1957.

"Since it [meprobamate—'Miltown'] does not cloud consciousness or lessen intellectual capacity, it can be used ... even by those busily occupied in intellectual work."

again at high dose I think it does cloud you, maybe worth noting the therapeutic dosage v rec dose for soma and miltown here to put this into better context.

AI slop:-

• A typical Soma dose (350 mg) produces meprobamate blood levels far below those seen with a therapeutic Miltown dose (400 mg).
• Even at the maximum daily Soma dose (1,400 mg), the resulting meprobamate exposure is still significantly lower than the exposure from standard therapeutic meprobamate dosing.

1000mg for me clouds shit up, I sometimes take 1500mg, and I ain't driving, I can work but it's a harder task to concentrate. I also think it's much better with Weed so double no then!

I've considered looking at what increases CYP2C19 metabolisation to improve the conversation but I'm lazy, think st johns wort helps but it has other interactions I need to check given the meds and other drugs I take...

Kepecs, B. L.: Pennsylvania M.J. 60:177, Feb. 1957.

"... the patient never describes himself as feeling detached or 'insulated' by the drug ['Miltown']. He remains completely in control of his faculties, both mental and physical ..."

pretty much

got to ignore the soma shuffle though....as that's not a miltown thing

Sokoloff, O. J.: A.M.A. Arch. Dermat. & Syph. 74:393, Oct. 1956.

"It ['Miltown'] ... does not cloud the sensorium, and has a helpful somnifacient effect devoid of 'hangover'."

again pretty much agree

Kessler, L. N. and Bernard, R. D.: M. Times 84:431, April 1956.

"In anxiety and tension states, meprobamate relaxes without dulling cortical function to the same extent as the commonly-used barbiturates."

Rindskopf, W., Ravreby, M., Gutenkauf, C. and Sands, S. L.: J. Iowa M. Soc. 47:57, Feb. 1957.

it relaxes yes, can't compare to barbs as I've not had any though

 

[red22]

Seconal: The Red Devil That Destroyed 1960s Housewives

 

[red22]

"I tried clomethiazole (named Distraneurin in Switzerland, Heminevrin in the UK) several times recently as a hypnotic medication. It is remarkably efficient and recreational too. To me 1 capsule of 192 mg clomethiazole is roughly equivalent in potency to 10 mg diazepam (Valium). The effect of clomethiazole is quite shorter than that of Valium but not too much shorter." @Octave77, 2025-10-24, https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/16337744

"By far the most euphoric downer I've tried was methaqualone, with clomethiazole a close second." @haribo1, 2008-01-29, https://www.bluelight.org/community/threads/1-ethynylcyclohexanol-cns-depressant.283141/post-5688797

"it's hypnotic effects blow away the strongest benzos. I've also had Seconal and I found it much more enjoyable then Seconal (but I only had a few to play with so I don't know if there are tricks for getting more out of them."

@clubcard 2013-10-09 https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/11876635


"I wasn't expecting it would be so much like a short-acting barb. The buzz was not Seconal nor Nembutal (I'd wish!) nope, but what it reminded me of was either a medium-strength dose of amobarbital or Tuinal, in the range 75mg to 100mg of either, still a very decent performance. I too have a keen memory for buzzes of old and I never forgot the Seconals, Nembutals and Tuinals I had managed to get prescribed to me from older physicians during the early 80's under various pretenses during the days of my youth's forages into the surreal but waning days when Rx death traps were still entrusted even to young men as long as they claimed some weird neurological or psychiatric condition that was difficult to disprove by non-specialists without access to then non-existing databases."

Hover 2014-09-18 https://drugs-forum.com/posts/1512912


"I'm a big fan of clomethiazole (Heminevrin). It's very nice, but drink one or two beers on top of it and it's lethal."

@Feretile 2022-02-22 https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/15447021


"It came on pretty fast. A very clean inhibited feeling. Much cleaner than alcohol. It was different from any sedative/hypnotic I've ever felt. It had a bit of a sparkle to it. I felt very lazy, but didn't care. I also felt significantly less intelligent, like it would be hard to solve complex problems on this stuff, but I welcomed the feeling. It was relaxing."

"There was a definite decrease in mental function, which I found pleasant. I was relaxed and engulfed with a sparkly euphoric feeling. I felt at peace with everything. The last time I looked at my clock was around 9:30pm. I fell asleep around this time."

@holyservant 2012-05-01 https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/10556173


"It never really took me as high as I wanted to go, and the peak left me with a truncated feeling. I would judge the peak experience to be about equivalent to 4 beers in terms of degree of intoxication, and similar in effect, but with its own unique flavor. The effects were rather brief and subsided in about 2 hours, and left me feeling pleasantly fuzzy-headed."

"I value this drug over alcohol and benzodiazepines, due to its absence of negative side effects (aside from the sinus issue, which is minor) over alcohol, and due to its pleasant euphoric effect, which is virtually absent from benzos. Next time I will up the dose to 3-4 caps, since the rather low dose I took left me wanting. This drug definitely has potential."
…
"I forgot to mention that this drug has a fantastic body high that one could easily forget if you are sitting perfectly still, but once you get up, you are hit by the full force of the ataxia. I recently tried 3 more tabs, which seems to be a lot more fun that just two."
…
"Fuck, feel FANTSTIC right now."

@Everlasting Reign 2012-11-03 post-11027676 & post-11028980


"I was totally unimpressed, anyone that even remotly compares it to qualudes never did any real ludes. Ok for sleeping aid but worthless for getting a high."

@rsmith309 2013-04-06 https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/11468353

 

[red22]

I've done butalbital, sodium barbital, and secobarbital. All 3 produce decent euphoria and sedation, plus that slight tendency toward irresponsible behavior and redosing like I've noticed with soma. So yes, very comparable,

How would you compare secobarbital to butalbital and Soma? In the Erowid experience report I referenced in my first post, "Modern Barbiturate Abuse", the author describes secobarbital as "the most addictive substance I have ever ingested."

 

[General alcazar]

From what I recall, though it was 40ish years ago, it blew soma as out of the water. All the anxiety relief of benzos with intense euphoria. Very sedating though, and it was hard not to knock out. I don’t think i had a proper appreciation for it though and mostly used it to come off meth binges. I haven’t tried butalbital so don’t know, though it’s an intermediate barbiturate, so unlikely to hit as hard. The few times I tried pentobarbital, it was similar. Glad they don’t exist. Barbiturates are even more deadly than opiates to those inclined to compulsive behavior.

 

[placebonaut]

have started upping my soma dose given how much gets metabolized to meprobamate as I think the meprobamate effects are the really good thinkg about soma.

I also think it works very well with a little diazepam (CNS stacking warning).

@red22 out of interest what are you goals/hopes/aims for this thread? I really like the retro stuff, would love to try some real barbs, have had a dabble with lude analogues but I suspect far worse than the OG

 

[red22]

@red22 out of interest what are you goals/hopes/aims for this thread?

To collect all relevant info and get more details about the effects of these drugs.

Miltown, the original anxiety medication

 

[HeadphonesandLSD]

GHB is a miracle drug for insomniacs. Gave me a decade of deep, restful sleep. I’ve never found anything like it since I ran out. Of all the drugs available, GHB is the one I miss the most. when it ran out, I used a gallon of 1,4 butanediol until it ran out. I stopped after that, and did not have any withdrawals. I just couldn’t sleep anymore, like before I discovered it. Fucking rapists ruined it for everyone…

I wish I had a doctor that would give me a proper drug for insomnia. Every time I've been to a GP they just throw a variety of anti-depressants at me all of which had horrible side effects. I forget which one it was but they once gave me something that caused painful erections. I was so concerned I called the GP's personal phone number (my Grandmother is friends with him). You know what this idiot told me? Keep taking it and eventually that will go away. I looked it up in my large book of substances and it said discontinue immediately.

After that he gave me an old school anti-depressant that I also can't remember the name of. It was very easy to OD on. Like if you took 3-4 of the pills I had you would die and plenty of people had used it to commit suicide including a couple of famous people.

I couldn't even get a valium or a xanax out of that doctor but every I knew called him "doctor feel good" because he was liberal with opioids and benzos for many years.

I think what you get from a GP boils down to what kind of insurance you have. If he knows he can run up the bill with insurance they'll give you drugs to ensure you want to come back every 1-3 months. But if you're a cash paying customer they give you whatever samples they have laying around or some very weak bullshit.

I have horrible insomnia. Like sleep schedule has been fucked for 30+ years and I regularly stay awake for 2-3 days insomnia. If anyone should be on the hardcore benzos and classics like GHB it should be me. But I've never once been prescribed anything worth a shit. I always get stuff that makes you drowsy off label. Usually and anti-depressant or something like promethazine.

I've thought about making my own GHB. I wasn't aware you could make it from GABA because I didn't look too deeply into the subject. I tried to buy GABA several times OTC from various different pharmacies but I never saw it anywhere for sale. I asked the pharmacist at one place and she had no idea what it was.

All the OTC sleeping aids are garbage in my experience. They do nothing for me. Xanax and the benzos don't help either because I just end up staying up through the effects and never falling alseep. They also make me eat all the sweets in the house. Usually, ice cream.

I understand they don't want you to get dependent on something like GHB but damn. It's impossible to maintain a normal life if you can't sleep like normal people. My sleep cycle is so fucked that one week I might be getting up at 5am on a few hours of sleep. Then the next day I get up at 2am. The next day 11pm. The next day 6pm in the afternoon. You get the idea. I can not maintain a regular sleep cycle. So it doesn't matter if I work 1st shift, 2nd shift or 3rd shift graveyard. I'm always going to be walking around like I got jet lag. The only way I can maintain that type of schedule is to come into work sometimes on no sleep for 2-3 days. Then when my body finally gives out I crash hard and sleep sometimes 12 hours. Well at least I did before I got on opioids. Now the withdrawal wakes me up 4-6 hours after I finally get to sleep. But I still don't fall asleep when I want to. I've regularly tried to go to bed at say 10pm and it never happens. I end up laying in bed all night watching the clock or if I do fall asleep it's like 2-3am so I barely get any sleep at all.

It made me so angry that they were giving me bullshit while people I knew that really didn't need them were getting stuff like xanax like candy.

 

[General alcazar]

Welcome to the current medical system. “Sleep hygiene” is what all doctors recommend. Guess if they had real insomnia, they might feel differently. It’s like how they treat people with chronic fatigue (myalgic encephalomyelitis) and fibromyalgia, or chronic pain (have some gabapentin and fuck off). If there’s no scientific evidence, it’s depression or other mental illness. Multiple sclerosis was treated as hysteria until the advent of the MRI…

 

[placebonaut]

To collect all relevant info and get more details about the effects of these drugs.

Genuinely interested in why you're trying to collect all this info.

These retro drugs are very well studied, lots of papers around about them, in fact it's 1 of the areas that I find AI performs generally a lot better in compared to newer drugs as the papers get lots of quotes & references throughout the decades so the usual AI slop is much more accurate and is able to actually reference real papers that actually exist!

I was reading this on Miltown addiction earlier in the week to get a feel for what levels of usage was found to give addiction issues (note for people reading that you need to take into account Soma > meprobamate metobolisation rates)

Sci-Hub. MEPROBAMATE ADDICTION / Journal of the American Medical Association, 1958

Miltown, the original anxiety medication

got to say I have a massive crush on miltown, it's bloody amazing, shame I have to get mine via Soma.

the "Miltini" where an olive is replaced with a miltown pill - my god this sounds like heaven, I think I just found my perfect cocktail!

 

[Troppo]

I would have to include 2-methyl-2-butanol (2M2B) as it was used years ago as a sedative and anaesthetic. I have found that, for me, 1 mL is roughly equal to 1 standard drink of alcohol. Some sources say it's 20 times stronger than ethanol but I'd have to say only 10 times. For me it produces an alcohol-like experience without all the negative side effects and hangovers, and the effect lasts well into the next day if you use a large dose. It seems more euphoric than alcohol. I've never had barbiturates so I can't say how it would compare to them.

 

[placebonaut]

I would have to include 2-methyl-2-butanol (2M2B) as it was used years ago as a sedative and anaesthetic. I have found that, for me, 1 mL is roughly equal to 1 standard drink of alcohol. Some sources say it's 20 times stronger than ethanol but I'd have to say only 10 times. For me it produces an alcohol-like experience without all the negative side effects and hangovers, and the effect lasts well into the next day if you use a large dose. It seems more euphoric than alcohol. I've never had barbiturates so I can't say how it would compare to them.

interesting, would give this is a try if it weren't for the long effect time.

is it something that helps with alcohol (Ethanol) at all? I drink way too much and need to cut down

 

[Troppo]

interesting, would give this is a try if it weren't for the long effect time.

is it something that helps with alcohol (Ethanol) at all? I drink way too much and need to cut down

The long effect time is mostly noticeable with large doses, say over 10 mL. I find that it totally stops me wanting to drink ethanol, because it directly substitutes for it. A person could of course drink on top of it but there's no point, because the 2m2b does everything that alcohol does, and more. It gets you drunk in a large enough dose. The problem with using it as an alcohol substitute is that if you regularly drink a lot, then the amount of 2m2b you will need will leave you half-drunk and sedated the following day. Its effects last from 12 to 24 hours. You will also become dependent on it with regular high-dose use, and I imagine it could create alcohol-like withdrawals. I've never used it long enough to know if it causes tolerance. By the way, ALWAYS dilute it massively with water or some other liquid, because pure 2m2b will burn the hell out of your mouth, throat, and stomach. It also smells a bit like gasoline and has a peculiar taste even when diluted, although I've come to like it now. When diluting, mix 2.5-5 mL with at least 250 mL water.