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[MEGA] JWH-018 Thread

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From Mouse99 @ Blacklight

Thanks to Mouse99 for supplying us with these. I'm posting them without any comments about whether or not I consider them fraudulent, but this should at least provide some discussion.

Mouse99 said:
As was previously announced:

A series of ADMET studies were completed to assess the toxicological profile of JWH-018. These studies were chosen to screen for several key issues and are typically used to identify major potential problems early in the development sequence of a new drug candidate. To fully evaluate the safety of JWH-018 more studies are needed. However, this data does provide some good signs and helps to build a much better picture of the toxicological profile of JWH-018.

The sponsor and provider of these studies wishes to remain anonymous, therefore I will not be able to provide information that would allow verification of these results. This data is provided in good faith, and I'm hopeful it will be received as such. We expect that anyone replicating part or whole of these studies will come to the same results.

And now as promised:
Part 1 (containing 4 Attachments)
(Tox-Results-Summary/CYPs/Cytotox/Green-Screen-HC)
Click to expand...

Part 2 (Containing 4 Attachments)
(hERG/Rat-Pharmacokinetics/Rat-Repeat-Tox/JWH-018-Analysis)
Click to expand...

Link for file downloads:
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=4f9cc64ce31f6fe1d2db6fb9a8902bda
 
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Just read a press release from the german ministry of health: In January 2009 Spice will be declared illegal cos of JWH-018 as ingredient.

Press Release (german)
 
Unregistered1911 said:
Pierre: Thank you very much for this!! Amber is a darker golden color, so I could definitely see someone calling that yellow, pale or not.


Sorry, I forgot to put the thread on my last post. Please put this here:

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=407913&page=7
Click to expand...


Quoted...since it was merged from ANON and the time stamps may have gotten it lost in the following replies....also this one

Unregistered1911 said:
Pierre: Thank you very much for this!! Amber is a deep darker golden color. I could definitely see someone calling that yellow especially if it is very pale.
Click to expand...
 
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I found out if you don't smoke ridiculously large amounts of this stuff then you don't get that worrying epoxy-glue-like buildup. So low doses from now on!
 
^^^^ from mouse99 tox-studies :
"Two out of the three male rats died during the high dose 5mg/kg PK study (equivalent HED is .8mg/kg or for a 68kg human a 54.4mg dose)."

yup
no more high doses.

your ex.
 
what did they die of just out of curiousity?

I got some worrying signs of respiratory depression when I combined it with GHB. Worrying enough that I had a friend make me some gatorade (to get my blood sugar up) and I got up and moved around a bit to get my blood pumping. I just thought that the synthies were synergizing with the G, but now that I think about it the synthetic cannabinoids might actually depress breathing on their own.
 
the reasoning i hear for the safety of cannabinoids is that there are no CB receptor sites in the lower regions of the brain responsible for respiratory function, so what would the mechanism of death be???

also thats a pretty low toxic dose, it equates to a bit over 100mg for me, or less according to examine's figures, im amazed.
 
really. if the data from mice extrapolates thats some scary figures, cause I had friends ripping bongloads approaching about half of that (friends with really high tolerance though).

Ham, don't you agree that the synthies (JWHs at least) feel more 'fundamental' like they go across more parts of the brain. We all agree (that have tried it around here) that its a much more drug like high it feels like it shuts down more parts of your brain than normal cannabis especially when you rip high doses of it.
 
The only thing I could see as an obvious possible mechanism for fatality is the decrease in GABA release associated with cannabinoid agonists, so perhaps its not associated with respiratory depression at all, although, anecdotally, for what its worth, smoking bongloads of weed, on top of opiates, seems to magnify respiratory depression in me, I have become quite alarmed before (or at any rate in a state where I decided to take some action, being alarmed would have been pretty difficult in the states I was in =D) combining just 500mg dihydrocodeine and the green stuff, the PROPER green stuff that is.

I imagine it would have to be a fairly large decrease to kill though.

Are there any published patch-clamp studies available for JWH-018 or its near relatives?
I would be very interested to compare the behaviour at the electrophysiological level to that of THC.

These are partial agonists are they not? might be quite difficult to cause a fatality,
 
Considering the large volume of fat cells available for lipophillic redistribution in humans versus rats, I would bet that the directly extrapolated LD50 of 54mg is lower than the real value considering the highly lipophillic nature of these (and really all) cannabinoids. Not that I would ever recommend taking a super high dose with a completely untested novel class of compounds.
 
The only thing I have a REALLY hard time buying is the half life claimed in those documents. 2 hours seems far, far too low.
 
invert said:
Was his answer to the first question referring to the base of JWH-018 or one of its salts?
Click to expand...

Short sidenote: There are no salts of JWH-018 because there is neither a sufficiently acidic nor a equally baseous site in the molecule. In other words: For a salt you either need an acid or a base. JWH-019 possesses neither.
 
MurphyClox said:
Short sidenote: There are no salts of JWH-018 because there is neither a sufficiently acidic nor a equally baseous site in the molecule. In other words: For a salt you either need an acid or a base. JWH-019 possesses neither.
Click to expand...
Thank you! That clears up my confusion. :)
 
Limpet_Chicken said:
The only thing I could see as an obvious possible mechanism for fatality is the decrease in GABA release associated with cannabinoid agonists, so perhaps its not associated with respiratory depression at all, although, anecdotally, for what its worth, smoking bongloads of weed, on top of opiates, seems to magnify respiratory depression in me, I have become quite alarmed before (or at any rate in a state where I decided to take some action, being alarmed would have been pretty difficult in the states I was in =D) combining just 500mg dihydrocodeine and the green stuff, the PROPER green stuff that is.

I imagine it would have to be a fairly large decrease to kill though.

Are there any published patch-clamp studies available for JWH-018 or its near relatives?
I would be very interested to compare the behaviour at the electrophysiological level to that of THC.

These are partial agonists are they not? might be quite difficult to cause a fatality,
Click to expand...

That assumes that these are highly selective in what they do, ie: no other affinity. I don't know if they've been assayed for affinity at other sites, I'm sure they have to some degree, but who knows.

Not to mention possible toxicity, even if they don't do the things they were (supposedly; though if they weren't, it's an elaborate hoax) tested for, there are just so many potential ways to wreak havoc in our bodies.
 
Hammilton said:
The only thing I have a REALLY hard time buying is the half life claimed in those documents. 2 hours seems far, far too low.
Click to expand...

have you not tried them? 2 hours would be a long 'stone' from a rip of it. You really are completely sober in 2 hours...unlike say a bongrip or two of cannabis (leaves me stoned much longer).
 
When maintaining a baseline blood cannabinoid level and tolerance to a variety of CB agonists, JWH-018 will as the dosage rises begin to become extended in duration faster than it becomes more subjectively intense. I can still feel analgesic and sensory enhancement activity 6-8 hours after vaporizing a large dose in the morning.

I think Riemann Zeta's point about lipophilic redistribution might have something to do with this.
 
Gaian Planes said:
have you not tried them? 2 hours would be a long 'stone' from a rip of it. You really are completely sober in 2 hours...unlike say a bongrip or two of cannabis (leaves me stoned much longer).
Click to expand...

Yeah, tons, actually. I couldn't be called a moderate user of 018 by any means, though since last spring and somewhat into the summer, I don't use it much anymore. Actually, since my baby was born, I haven't used it at all.

Your argument is nonsense, though. Consider the exceptionally long half life for THC. Does that produce an exceptionally long intoxication? Nope.

Does buprenorphine produce an exceptionally long high? Again, no.

Half life and length of intoxication are linked to a degree, but not very closely.
 
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