[MEGA] God v.2

[IGNVS]

the workings of things, of synchronicity, what you might call karma, love, the way information flows, and how energy and perspective, enlightenment, etc... some is known and understood through wisdom granted by being a hand in it all, and much more is unknown, knowing that it cannot be known.
this force, what is known and the greater unknown that finds a way to put a smile on your face, this i call GOD. it is in everything, it is the form and function of the sum of all things physically and metaphorically as one functioning the way it does. this force has an almost "you" characteristic to it, you can communicate with it by letting it into yourself, then its just like a conversation with yourself with this spirit of god there too. its pretty cool tapping into it all.

 

[MyDoorsAreOpen]

^ Very nicely put, IGNVS.

 

[thebuzzardking]

I mostly certainly do, and for you that don't that's ok cause god believes in you

 

[fizzle]

"We like your Christ but not your Christians"

This is an article I found in my school paper. I thought the author brought up some interesting points and I'd kind of like to get the opinions of people here, plus I think its an interesting topic to discuss.

I’m a short, brace-faced, four-eyed Italian bitch. If you’ve been reading my columns for the past year you’ve probably noticed I call myself a lot of things. I’ll call myself nearly anything; except Christian.

I know what you’re thinking: “Great. Another member of the liberal media here to spew anti-religion on us.” I beg, though, stick with me, because here’s the kicker: I’m pretty close to Christian, just not quite.

I went to a Catholic church intermittently as a child and was in the Christian club at my high school. I’m dating a Christian guy and even go to church with him every once in a while.

My reason for avoiding the label is not that I lost Christianity. Christianity lost me. And, for once, I’m not alone in my logic.

The 2009 American Religious Identification Survey showed that the number of non-believers more than doubled between 1990 and 2008 and the number of adult non-believers has increased from eight percent to 15 percent.

Apparently organized religion has lost all these people as well.

However, I’m not sure that shunning religion entirely would be beneficial for society.

I think, essentially, Christians have the right idea. That’s kind of like saying that the only kid who actually made his way to the starting line on the track automatically takes first place, but still, it’s something.

Those basic Christian ten rules of “don’t steal, cheat, commit adultery, etc” and other more generalized “don’t be a dick” guidelines are a pretty good start for how people should live their lives.

The problem that I have — and I think a lot of other people agree — is that the term “Christian” and the terms “conservative” and “Republican” have become inexorably intertwined. Whether this co-mingling is valid is another argument for another day.

One of the main problems I have with Christianity or, more accurately, the modern interpretation and culture of Christianity is that it allows no room for progress or development. To be Christian you must believe that the word of God is infallible.

However, if you look at the thing most Christians hit you over the head with, it’s this little short story called the Bible, which has two big chapters: The Old Testament and the new one — both written by men.

If we know one thing about humans it’s that we’re definitely fallible. I mean, I know I’m making a mistake writing this column because for the next 24 hours I’ll be bombarded with emails and comments about my lack of knowledge and general ignorance.

My question is, if God knows he’s not fallible and that men are, why would he take his infallible word to an inadequate translator? If God is capable of creating the universe, he could create a list of perfect rules that are untouched by human hands.

And yet, he didn’t. So the Bible must be flawed in some way. This seems like a logical conclusion, and yet Christians will continue to adamantly argue.

Most Christians think the Old Testament is kind of crazy — it’s the one where they tell you it’s good to stone people and what not. Christians say, “oh yeah, well, that one got a little out of hand; but the new one is better and more reasonable.”

If the first one was perfect, why do you need a new one?

Once you corner a Christian with this line of logical reasoning, they leap to faith. Or I guess more accurately make a leap of faith, but either way they’re stretching.

Christians argue they don’t need logic because they have faith. These are the same Christians who go to church and tithe because it makes them look charitable. These are the same Christians who carry a Bible and quote passages such as “love thy neighbor,” only to turn around and beat gay people over the head with judgments. But it’s OK for them to judge people because they have faith it’s what God wants.

This kind of hypocrisy is what I hate about modern-Christian culture, and it is the reason I will never call myself a Christian.

I think Gandhi had it right when he said, “I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”

If Christians could ever get back to the basic, moral principles on which their religion was founded and stop the silly war over the interpretation of the Bible — which I consider to be a collection of metaphorical stories with nice moral lessons — I would join them in a heartbeat.

From my readings I have deduced that the basic idea at the core of Christianity is that, as humans, we need to do right by each other and find a higher purpose for our existence. If Christians could take this core value and build a movement that is more about love an acceptance and less about arguing and judging, I’d be right there with them.

For now, I guess I’ll have to remain a marginalized citizen and a subscriber to my own interpretation of a historical document.

-Jen S

Since its my college newspaper, I'm not going to give an exact source for personal privacy reasons, but it is not my work, just an article I found interesting. A lot of my family is pretty hardcore Christian and follows the bible closely, but my parents raised me to ask questions and not take the bible literally, so I tend to agree with what a lot of this says. I'm a little tempted to show it to my more hardcore family, but wont because I'm sure it wont change anyones beliefs.

 

[|>R()|)!G/-\|_]

These are the same Christians who go to church and tithe because it makes them look charitable. These are the same Christians who carry a Bible and quote passages such as “love thy neighbor,” only to turn around and beat gay people over the head with judgments. But it’s OK for them to judge people because they have faith it’s what God wants.

This kind of hypocrisy is what I hate about modern-Christian culture, and it is the reason I will never call myself a Christian.

These are a handful of many examples of Christianity straying far from the original principles and church that Jesus enlisted Peter and his disciples to build. In fact, many of the examples of hypocrisy included above are similar to the Pharisees' behavior which Jesus taught his followers to avoid. In fact, many fundamentalists & Neo-Cons are the modern day Pharisees.

My question is, if God knows he’s not fallible and that men are, why would he take his infallible word to an inadequate translator? If God is capable of creating the universe, he could create a list of perfect rules that are untouched by human hands.

He originally took his word to Moses b/c God understood he would do a good job of preserving them. Knowing Moses wasn't a great speaker, he enlisted Aaron to teach the rules. Moses + Aaron = adequate translators. The problem was with the exiled Isrealites' lack of faith. They didn't listen/follow God's laws.

Keep in mind that this is long after he originally created a perfect world, the laws of which changed when Adam & Eve disobeyed in the Garden of Eden. Although God is powerful, so is Satan. They wage battle back and forth. Although Christians believe that God will be victorious in His overall war against Evil, that doesn't mean that Satan doesn't win some battles (like in the Garden of Eden).

So the Bible must be flawed in some way.

Of course it is. It's been edited and re-edited. Kings and Popes who have wanted to be king have edited it to fit their own agendas. I guess in BL terms we could say the Bible has been "stepped on" more than a couple times since its initial assembly .

Most Christians think the Old Testament is kind of crazy — it’s the one where they tell you it’s good to stone people and what not. Christians say, “oh yeah, well, that one got a little out of hand; but the new one is better and more reasonable.”
If the first one was perfect, why do you need a new one?

The Old Testament is crazy. It outlined behaior for a crazy time for people that didn't have a clear idea of how to live well, let alone in accordance with God's will. Keep in mind, the beginning of the Old Testament (Pentatauch) was directed toward Isrealites who had been prosperous, enslaved, released, exiled, and marooned in the desert. If I'm not mistaken, there eventually grew to be >500,000 in the desert with Moses. They needed some hardcore rules to keep them alive and in line.

My $.02.

 

[MyDoorsAreOpen]

I agree with this article's writer: the label 'Christian' has been hijacked by the American Right to a large extent. I really don't think Jesus would agree with many evangelical Americans' worldview much at all, to tell you the truth.

As qwe has pointed out numerous times, the picture we get of Jesus from all available sources is one of a renegade, who advocated throwing off the chains of blind deference to tradition and authority. A true Christian very much thinks for him/herself, and will always choose to act with compassion, rather than just act on precedent.

I was fortunate enough to be raised with a form of Christianity that's far truer to the roots of this faith, and emphasizes being good to other people, rather than salvation-grubbing and falling into line. It still, and probably always will, chafe me to hear people tar this and all forms of Christianity with the same ugly brush, thanks to the abuse of Jesus' teachings by small-minded fascists. Trust me, I share the same disdain for mindless obedience and insularity.

Unfortunately, no matter how wisely or eloquently any wisdom figure speaks, someone is bound to twist their words to justify truly foolish ends. This is just like saying that you can write the most powerful story in the world, and there's bound to be people who just don't get it, whom the message is utterly lost on. Following someone wise from days gone by is no guarantee you'll reach the intended destination -- all true paths to spiritual transformation are treacherous ones, and many lose their way on them.

 

[elbroski]

Ya, I agree with all, the label Christian certainly has connotations today having nothing to do with the alleged prophet of old. I was raised in a very stringent Evangelical, right-wing Christian household, so I have first hand experience of how perverting the original principal of love=salvation (which is what I believe the core of Jesus' teaching really was) into some moral flagellation designed to inspire guilt and fear has become the norm in today's Christian community. However, I don't limit my words to people of the Christian faith only. I feel the same has happened (more or less) to all monotheistic religions in the western world. I guess that's a conversation for another thread, but great post girl very informative.

 

[fizzle]

Thanks for everyones input I dont really have anything personally to add at the moment, maybe later, but I enjoy reading everyones comments and different perspectives, keep them coming! :D

 

[mr_p]

i have no trouble geeting along with god. Its his fan clubs, that annoy me!

..... (~o~)

 

[swilow]

I dunno even know about this christ chap anymore.... I tend to like his sayings, but I find no deeper profundity in what jesus said as compared to the likes of Gandhi. Its common sense, by and large.

I deeply question the facts of his execution and its implications on freewill. It erases it. As I believe in free will, I don't believe that christ was a god or was executed for such a reason.

 

[B9]

Chistians tend to taste rank ( anecdotal) Christ however is so tasty they still hanker after a bite today. Strikes me as a thinly veiled cult covertly promoting cannabilism - however I digress...

I deeply question the facts of his execution and its implications on freewill. It erases it. As I believe in free will, I don't believe that christ was a god or was executed for such a reason.

As usual swilow you tempt me ask you a question - if everything is god/is made of god how & why would jesus be somehow different to Thou & I ?

& implications on freewill who ? why ? how ? - I don't understand what you mean.

 

[prometheus72]

The only true christian died on the cross, everything created after that was either misinterpreted or manipulated to the Church's advantage.

 

[straycatphizzle]

No human can follow the bible as a whole because it contradicts itself constanty. So apparently I'm supposed to love my neighbor, but stone him to death if he works on the sabbath.The idea that jesus was non-violent is wrong, he rampaged through marketplace flipping over tables and such like a madman.Not to mention the fact that he was a habitual user of psilocybin mushrooms as were his followers. Anyone will believe they're messiah if they take enough psilocybin. Try reading the new testament as a trip report and it will make tons more sense. Evidence? The great canterbury psalter

 

[swilow]

^You do realise that that picture is only a small portion of a 12th century painting?

If christinaity is smehow connected to psychedelics, I'm quitting them as drugs; for fear I'll start an endless worl war too

As usual swilow you tempt me ask you a question - if everything is god/is made of god how & why would jesus be somehow different to Thou & I ?

& implications on freewill who ? why ? how ? - I don't understand what you mean.

Well, I am unsure how to answer yer first part; but I'll have a crack at the second...

Jesus was "sent" down by "god" to attone for our sins. He had to die to do this. The people who killed him (tha actual individuals who nailed his limbs) HAD to do this, so our 'sins could be forgiven'. As these elements imply a lack of choice, and indeed, much of his execution was 'prophesied' I feel that those involved did not have free-will in the matter; god "made them" do this so Jesus' death could be worth something to humankind. But, as I said, I believe we have free will.....

My theory- Jesus was a super karma beast; from a pantheon of similar, highly evolved "gods". A meeting was held, and the physical force of "karma" was discussed somewhere up in the ether; it was determined that humanity was never going to be free from karmic-bonds; hence one of these super karma dudes offerred his eternal existence so that humans had the chance to begin again. By some law of meta-physics his eternal death would revoke all karmic troubles, and eradicate them- he could do so, as his nature and life was on a scale much vaster then every human at that time; hence, he died (forever), in agony and torment, and with a puff of smoke, dissolved all humans karma; in a sense, perhaps this opened the gates to paradise, or cessation of the endless cycle of rebirth.

However- I don't believe in that either. :D I think jesus was/is a myth or just a human who died for politcal reasons. As could be argued, the world is no better and maybe worse for his existence.....

BOM. All this above, does not stop my worship of the dark gods

 

[straycatphizzle]

^ many people since jesus' crucifiction have endured pain far greater than any crucifiction. There was no intense suffering that made our so called sinning alright. If a crucifiction will do that, a man being burned alive should make us all gods.

 

[stonerfromohio]

Jesus was just as wise,compassionate, and loving as any other psychedelic guru. He showed people the wonders of psychedelics. Evidence is shown in the canterbury psalter but im sure with your extensive knowledge on the subject you've heard of this theory.I deny him being a messiah, I deny him having supernatural powers, but i do not deny the fact that he was an extremely loving and wise man that helped a ton of people. But his true teachings were lost many centuries ago. Too many interpretations,translations,and rewrites were put into the mdoern bible and now its the opposite of what christ would've wanted. Evidence of Christian mycological shamanism

You made this statement in the last thread ill adress it here the first thing I want to adress is supernatural powers.

Supernatural powers are called Siddhis which are defiend as:

Siddhi (Sanskrit:सिद्धिः; siddhiḥ) is a Sanskrit word that literally means "perfection", "accomplishment", "attainment", or "success".[1] It is also used as a term for spiritual power (or psychic ability). The term is used in that sense in Hinduism and Tantric Buddhism. These spiritual powers supposedly vary from relatively simple forms of clairvoyance to being able to levitate, to be present at various different places simultaneously, to become as small as an atom, to materialize objects, to have access to memories from past lives, and more. The mastery of specific Siddhis is taught to be attained through the right kind of Samyama.

A list of Siddhis:

Parkaya Pravesha: Parkaya Pravesh means one’s soul entering into the body of some other person. Through this knowledge even a dead body can be brought to life.

Haadi Vidya: This Vidya or knowledge has been mentioned in several ancient texts. On acquiring this Vidya, a person feels neither hunger nor thirst, and can remain without eating food or drinking water for several days at a stretch.

Kaadi Vidya: Just as one does not feel hungry or thirsty in Haadi Vidya, similarly in Kaadi Vidya a person is not affected by change of seasons, i.e. by summer, winter, rain, etc. After accomplishing this Vidya, a person shall not feel cold even if he sits in the snow-laden mountains, and shall not feel hot even if he sits in the fire.

Vayu Gaman Siddhi: Through this Siddhi a person can become capable of flying in the skies and traveling from one place to another in just a few seconds.

Madalasa Vidya: On accomplishing this Vidya, a person becomes capable of increasing or decreasing the size of his body according to his wish. Lord Hanuman had miniaturized his body through this Vidya while entering the city of Lanka.

Kanakdhara Siddhi: One can acquire immense and unlimited wealth through this Siddhi.

Prakya Sadhana: Through this Sadhana a Yogi can direct his disciple to take birth from the womb of a woman who is childless or cannot bear children.

Surya Vigyan: This solar science is one of the most significant sciences of ancient India this science has been known only to the Indian Yogis; using it, one substance can be transformed into another through the medium of sun rays.

Ten Secondary Siddhis
In the Srimad Bhagavatam Lord Krishna describes the Ten Secondary Siddhis as:

anūrmi-mattvam: Being undisturbed by hunger, thirst, and other bodily disturbances
dūra-śravaṇa: Hearing things far away
dūra-darśanam: Seeing things far away
manaḥ-javah: Moving the body wherever thought goes (teleportation)
kāma-rūpam: Assuming any form desired
para-kāya praveśanam: Entering the bodies of others
sva-chanda mṛtyuh: Dying when one desires
devānām saha krīḍā anudarśanam: Witnessing and participating in the pastimes of the Apsaras
yathā sańkalpa saḿsiddhiḥ: Perfect accomplishment of one's determination
ājñā apratihatā gatiḥ: Orders or Commands being unimpeded

Five Siddhis of Yoga and Meditation
In the Srimad Bhagavatam the Five Siddhis of Yoga and Meditation are described as:

tri-kāla-jñatvam: Knowing the past, present and future;
advandvam: Tolerance of heat, cold and other dualities;
para citta ādi abhijñatā: Knowing the minds of others and so on;
agni arka ambu viṣa ādīnām pratiṣṭambhaḥ: Checking the influence of fire, sun, water, poison, and so on;
aparājayah: Remaining unconquered by others;

"For a sage who has conquered his senses, breathing and mind, who is self-controlled and always absorbed in meditation on Me, what siddhi could possibly be difficult to achieve?"

Second I want to discuss you claiming that Jesus showed humanity the wonders of psychedelics, first what makes you believe this? Second why is this not talked about in any scriptures included in the bible nor in The Gospel of Thomas or The Gospel of Mary Magdalene?

Also his teachings were not lost they are still widley circulating all over the world. Too many interpertations? The level of realization a person is operating on would change the truths they pull from scriptures. A fundamentalist at times merely gets hellfire and brimstone. A main-stream Christian gets that Jesus was loving, kind and compassionate but believes Jesus as the only person to have realized cosmic consciousness. Someone on Paramahansa Yogananda's level interperts the Bibles esoteric meaning and shows the correlation of the words of Jesus and many other traditions and illustrates how Christ honestly was a Yogi.

What you were correct on however is that Jesus has helped many people and that he was wise, loving and compassionate.

Sorry for hi-jacking the thread but I wanted to respond to straycatphizzle's post and the thread was locked where he made these statements.

 

[stonerfromohio]

Well, I am unsure how to answer yer first part; but I'll have a crack at the second...

Jesus was "sent" down by "god" to attone for our sins. He had to die to do this. The people who killed him (tha actual individuals who nailed his limbs) HAD to do this, so our 'sins could be forgiven'. As these elements imply a lack of choice, and indeed, much of his execution was 'prophesied' I feel that those involved did not have free-will in the matter; god "made them" do this so Jesus' death could be worth something to humankind. But, as I said, I believe we have free will.....

My theory- Jesus was a super karma beast; from a pantheon of similar, highly evolved "gods". A meeting was held, and the physical force of "karma" was discussed somewhere up in the ether; it was determined that humanity was never going to be free from karmic-bonds; hence one of these super karma dudes offerred his eternal existence so that humans had the chance to begin again. By some law of meta-physics his eternal death would revoke all karmic troubles, and eradicate them- he could do so, as his nature and life was on a scale much vaster then every human at that time; hence, he died (forever), in agony and torment, and with a puff of smoke, dissolved all humans karma; in a sense, perhaps this opened the gates to paradise, or cessation of the endless cycle of rebirth.

However- I don't believe in that either. :D I think jesus was/is a myth or just a human who died for politcal reasons. As could be argued, the world is no better and maybe worse for his existence.....

BOM. All this above, does not stop my worship of the dark gods

Found this which pretty much sums up my viewpoint:

I believe Jesus Christ, if he existed, had an experience of cosmic consciousness similar to what was experienced by Buddha, Ramana Maharshi, and many other people throughout history. Jesus apparently tried to communicate this experience to his followers as best he could, limited by the language and cultural concepts of his time and place.

It is possible that each of us is a function of what the whole cosmos is doing at a point called here and now. In effect, each of us IS the whole universe looking at itself through our eyes. The universe is conscious and self-aware, a.k.a. God, and this awareness and consciousness is within each of us. In other words, what happened to Jesus was NOT a unique experience that only happened to one man in all history and prehistory, but something that EACH of us can experience directly when we tune in to the consciousness that is the base of our existence.

I read the exact same Bible as the Christians do, yet I see Jesus teaching us the same message taught by Hinduism, Buddhism and Taoism. Consider the following verses along with the interpretation I offer as an alternative to the mainstream Christian interpretation.


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John Chapter 10, verses 30-36 (KJV)
10:30 I and [my] Father are one.
10:31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.
10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

The King James Version of the Bible has “the” in italics before “Son of God” in verse 36. This is not for emphasis as some may think, but shows words interpolated by the translators. In this case, they were mistaken. The original Greek does NOT have an article before “Son of God,” which in Greek is equivalent to having an indefinite article. In the original Greek of this scripture, Jesus did NOT say he is the Son of God; he said I am a Son of God. He also quoted Psalm 82 that says “Ye are gods.”


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John Chapter 14, verse 12 (KJV)
14:12 I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. HE WILL DO EVEN GREATER THINGS THAN THESE, because I am going to the Father.

Jesus says the ordinary humans he left behind (who, according to traditional Christian mythology, are NOT divine as he is) will do greater things than Jesus did. I put those words in all-caps to emphasize them.


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John Chapter 17, verses 21-22 (KJV)
17:21 THAT THEY ALL MAY BE ONE; as thou, Father, [art] in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; THAT THEY MAY BE ONE, EVEN AS WE ARE ONE:

Again I put some words in all-caps to emphasize them. It seems pretty clear to me that Jesus says we can be one with the Father just as he was. In other words, what happened to him is NOT something unique that could ONLY happen to him, but it can happen to each of us. Jesus even PRAYS that we can experience it too!


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Now many Christians will protest that Jesus says quite plainly:

“I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.” (John 14:6, KJV)

I agree, but perhaps not the way that Christians would like me to agree. It is my opinion that this “I am,” this “me” that Jesus speaks of is the big Self of divine consciousness (not the little self of the ego) that is within EACH OF US and was consciously realized by Jesus.


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Here is a plausible explanation of what happened: Jesus tried to explain his experience of cosmic consciousness as best he could, using the language and concepts available to him from the culture of his time and place. Awed by his miracles, the disciples of Jesus missed the point of what he was trying to share with them. They distorted the meaning of his message and worshipped the messenger instead. Christianity does not teach the religion OF Jesus, which was the realization of divine Sonship, but the religion ABOUT Jesus, a castrated version of the Gospel that puts Jesus on a pedestal and says that only He, and nobody else, is divine.

For further study, I recommend anything by the late author, philosopher and “spiritual entertainer” Alan Watts, but especially pertaining to this subject Myth and Religion 3: Jesus, His Religion that I paraphrase portions of on this page. Alan Watts does a great job of explaining eastern philosophies to western audiences, and he is also good at explaining what mainstream Christianity teaches, even if he doesn't necessarily agree with it. In at least one of his audio files, Alan Watts makes the point that if Jesus had been born in India he would NOT have been crucified. When Jesus told others that he and the Father were one, they would have said “Congratulations. You finally figured it out.”

 

[qwe]

If christinaity is smehow connected to psychedelics, I'm quitting them as drugs; for fear I'll start an endless worl war too

without psychedelics, we would not have christianity and the face of religion would be quite different

 

[swilow]

^Proof please?

 

[swilow]

^ many people since jesus' crucifiction have endured pain far greater than any crucifiction. There was no intense suffering that made our so called sinning alright. If a crucifiction will do that, a man being burned alive should make us all gods.

Like I said, it was a hypothesis of sorts. Basically, if you imagine a bunch of gods- greater in all ways then us- sitting around somewhere, thinking 'we gotta save these humans from endless life' and one of them suggests that- on a cosmic scale- his death will erase the present karmic debt that humans owed. Thus, he inhabits and earthly form, and instead of opening the gates if heaven as is alleged, he dies- forever- and the accumulated karma for humanity is erased.

That said, I don't believe in christs godliness, karma, or anything I wrote. :D Just musings as to why jesus could somehow have "washed away our sins" by dying.