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MDMA Recovery (Stories & Support - 5)

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Btw also when I had briefly tried Tianeptine I had the same sort of reaction except in that case it dissapated immediately the day after I stopped it.

I had the same mild dp/dr type feelings on tianeptine though. Only lasted 7 days on it and i said no thanks this is horrible.

So it really might be some kind of horrible sensitivity to NMDA antagonist or AMPA stimulation...
 
Socrilus, have you tried supplementing with taurine and l-theanine before bed? Both are known to increase GABA levels in the brain. Might be worth a shot. I was stacking 1g taurine + 200mg l-theanine and magnesium 1hr before bed on an empty stomach before I had my setback. I can honestly say it was doing wonders for me and I was at a stable 70% for months. Im going to reintroduce it and see if it helps me with my current issues. Also, maybe try implementing a glutamate free diet. Theres some speculation about this because free glutmate in food may not pass the BBB, however in some individuals its has been shown to. This means avoidance of foods high in glutamate like gluten products, peas, mushrooms, soy sauce etc etc. And especially avoid MSG.

Its strange that for a few years leading up to my full blown dp/dr/whateverthefuckthisis.... I had intermittent bouts of mild dp and dr (but I just thought of it as brain fog and anxiety atm) and I began noticing that I couldnt tolerate gluten anymore. Everytime I ate bread (and this is still the case), I got really bad brain fog, fatigue and even dp/dr like symtoms. Which makes me think maybe glutmate excitotoxicty plays a role in my downfall. Additionally, I had some GI problems too until I changed my diet which could explain the potential for free glutamate to cross my BBB and cause me problems. Not sure if this is relevant to you at all but may be worth giving some thought, or anyone for that matter.
 
I did try those things and they definitely help.

Im sort of just really upset at this setback but I know I have to not let it get the best of me.

Previously benzos essentially cured my condition but now I feel like my LTC has become so much more complex.

Im still dealing with all sorts of hormonal imbalances still as well.
 
Hi guys i am not sure if this is the right place to post something like this but there isn't anything i can find much about lsd after affects and the people in the lsd forum said its all in my head and will take some time. About two months ago i tried my first tab of acid. I'm 19 and i think my drug usage is pretty minimal as i have only really smoked weed. After that tab of acid i smoked weed the next day and the following week weird stuff happened i started getting panic attacks. I felt like something changed in my brain and stayed in bed for like three weeks straight as i started getting twitches, insomnia,and weird body sensations. Also this head pressure it was pretty bad. Now two months later i no longer have panic attacks and no real anxiety. But its the head pressure and sometimes weird feeling in my face like it's being numb sometimes. I do have some visual problems like on an online device i can see words move sometimes and sometimes light sensitive.Dizzy only when i wake up a bit and just my head feels weird like either pressure ..ugh i can't really describe it like a plastic cap on my hand. Any advice? I do take vitamin bs. I don't know how long I can hold this out for. I think i might just have hppd?
 
Yeah, sounds like a minor case of hppd. Stay away from caffeine, drugs, 5htp, and alcohol until you're healed. There's a sub-Reddit for hppd that has a pinned post that is really helpful. Don't take an ssri until after six months or so.
 
For me there is always this 1 BIG question of

"why am I anxious or mildly dp'd now"

I know it doesnt help but its a huge thing that runs in my mind and frustrates me. Ketamine complicating LTC treatment. Now I am getting intrusive thoughts of what if I develop full depersonalization disorder and what if I beocme suicidal....

Ive gone from depression to horrid anxiety now.

Also--to increase T levels. Is it possible low T could perhaps be related to me being on the skinny end and not eating enough calories? I'm trying to figure out other factors that led to this LTC. And maybe in order to get the maximum benefit of exercise I need to eat right first...

also @martainn

Interesting about the gluten connection. I might try that by eliminating gluten gradually and seeing if it improves things. I do think food sensitivities are possible in the LTC due to the gut/immune system-brain connection.
 
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@socrilus

Seeing as the benefits of ketamine for depression poop out after about 2 months for some of the MDD patients, there could be some normalization that takes weeks to months to occur.

RE: calories - I really think people need to be starting and ending their day with a decent protein source (e.g. 30g whey protein morning/lunch/night) and eating enough calories and fats throughout the day... Try not to tunnel vision on the gluten sensitivity/leaky BBB type stuff.
 
Unless youre bodybuilding or training in a similar manner then I dont see why you would supplement with any protein supplements let alone whey. Ive been bodybuilding for 3 years now and I never drink whey protein shakes because theyre shite in all honesty. If youre eating correctly then theres no reason you wouldnt reach protein goals through the diet. Protein only needs to make up around 15% of total calories per day.

Everyone should be aiming to eat a high carbohydrate (starchy complex carbs) whole foods diet abundant in fruit and veg (dark leafy greens should be eaten daily).

And in regards to the gluten sensitivity, I wasnt suggesting everyone has it because they dont, but that a low glutamate diet may be worth a shot.
 
Yeah a protein shake isn't really necessary, it's all junk in those. I think loss of fruits and veggies and lean meats is the way to go, along with healthy seafood and some whole grain carbs. I found diet has no effect on me though.

Found out today that TMJ can also lead to floaters, VS, hyperacusis, and Tinnitus.
 
Well the only advantage of a protein shake or a shake kind of thing for me is that its easier to meet my caloric intake.

I have nausea issues from the LTC from time to time which are worst in the morning hours. So its a lot easier to drink something or eat fruits than eat a nice typical american breakfast

By far more than any other symptom I am worried about this iatrogenic derealization (or what I think is dp/dr). Just something feels off and discontinuous since I took the ketamine but nothing fundamentally has really changed.

Unfortunately its just a lot harder for me to deal with that kind of stuff than standard depression.

The weird thing is on the day of it there was definitely a massive anti anxiety or antidepressant effect but idk why my whole body went haywire for a week afterwards. And now only 1 aftereffect of this off feeling remains.

For all I know maybe this *is* the antidepressant effect people get (I have not been feeling as down as before) but its not worth all the strange thoughts causing increased anxiety due to being in a different mental state. Whereas for the completely traumatized they might feel ok with this.

I was expecting "normality" (ie pre LTC) but not some other altered state.
 
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I think youre overthinking it dude, which I too was guilty of in the early stages.

You simply took a pschyoactive drug when you were in an already sensitive state. You may have been destined for dp and dr anyway down the line. I suffered from intense, evil depression for the first 3 months or so when getting dp and dr but now I just suffer with a constant state of flatness.

It may take some time but if you dont use any more drugs, including alcohol and caffeine, you should see some improvements. It took me around 8/9 months to start really making leaps and bounds. Im not quite at square 1 again but im pretty bad atm but Im positive i can get back to where I was even if it takes a while again.
 
I do not think I was destined for dp/dr but you are right I could be overthinking it. But I never ever had dp/dr even at the worst of my LTC and right now its not even near the worst mood wise but just the strange thoughts make me uncomfortable

I do not have emotional flatness and currently have full range of emotions and I do feel pleasure from things like video games etc. So at least no anhedonia...

I just had low motivation issues which prompted me to try out ketamine therapy but I realize now its too risky to try to fix one thing and then another thing breaks.

Alcohol I have been fine with for the majority of my LTC as long as I do not overdo it and caffeine I have been fine with too (its actually helped sometimes with motivation) but since the ketamine I am scared.

It just feels like my dopamine is kind of low and my GABA is low too. Vast oversimplification though. Dopamine is probably high in some of my brain regions cause of anxiety.

Im just waiting my genetic test results so I can finally find out what COMT polymorphism I have (Warrior vs Worrier) gene to perhaps get a better idea of the supplements I can look into.

Btw I tried Taurine last night and it definitely brought a relaxed GABA-like feeling.

This is kind of embarassing but all my life whenever I got really excited I would do this thing with my hands and experience a pretty much natural high. I noticed I do the same behavior when I am extremely anxious and agitated as well. So my guess is I am the type of person to experience high highs and lower lows in life. However, ill take that cause prior to the LTC I never really recall having a low mood last very long. So as long as I can return to the identical pre LTC state I am happy. I refuse to believe it is impossible.
 
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martainnn said:
Unless youre bodybuilding or training in a similar manner then I dont see why you would supplement with any protein supplements let alone whey. Ive been bodybuilding for 3 years now and I never drink whey protein shakes because theyre shite in all honesty. If youre eating correctly then theres no reason you wouldnt reach protein goals through the diet. Protein only needs to make up around 15% of total calories per day.

Everyone should be aiming to eat a high carbohydrate (starchy complex carbs) whole foods diet abundant in fruit and veg (dark leafy greens should be eaten daily).
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Sure, people should be eating a well rounded diet with low glycemic index carbs, well rounded fats/meats and have no need for whey/soy protein shakes, but I have a hunch that some people aren't spending much time in the kitchen when they're struggling to get themselves out of bed

I wasn't necessarily recommending whey for effects on muscle protein synthesis, its caloric value or to help stave off muscle catabolism during stress/sleep deprivation, but rather I was thinking people need to be getting in their daily protein for brain related reasons.

See for example the effect of tryptophan deprivation on the brain, or protein's effect on sleep when taken before bed (it increases sleep, and so does supplementing with tryptophan purportedly).

I don't know why people are claiming protein shakes are garbage? Its amino acids, the building blocks of all your cells and neurotransmitters, and if you don't get them much in your breakfast and dinner then whey/soy protein is a fast and cheap option

The whey fraction has effects on insulin which can be beneficial for some but you can also just go with soy shakes too if you can stomach it

There is also something to be said for getting in enough daily fats/cholesterol for hormone synthesis, amino acids aside

martainnn said:
And in regards to the gluten sensitivity, I wasnt suggesting everyone has it because they dont, but that a low glutamate diet may be worth a shot.
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If glutamate was leaking through the BBB people would be having seizures (it is only actively transported into the brain and it's levels are tightly regulated, and it's non-essential as well), but anyways GABA uses glutamate as a precursor so if someone actually manages to make a significant impact on glutamate levels then it could also affect GABA levels
 
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socrilus said:
It just feels like my dopamine is kind of low and my GABA is low too. Vast oversimplification though. Dopamine is probably high in some of my brain regions cause of anxiety..
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Dopamine certainly increases during times of stress, and in many cases dopamine can actually inhibit GABA neurons. As an example, in Huntington's disease there is a die-off of GABA neurons, but dopamine receptor blockers (anti-psychotics) are used to increase net GABA output because activation of dopamine receptors located on GABA neurons inhibits said GABA neurons


socrilus said:
This is kind of embarassing but all my life whenever I got really excited I would do this thing with my hands and experience a pretty much natural high. I noticed I do the same behavior when I am extremely anxious and agitated as well.
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Like a tic? See skin rolling for example - something like that? http://www.healthboards.com/boards/obsessive-compulsive-disorder-ocd/218152-skin-rolling.html

I do think some of you guys definitely have compounding anxiety about your predicaments, and in an attempt to control the situation, the OCD type thoughts and behaviors are probably not helping
 
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Lol no not really. Its not like I pick my skin or anything but whenever I get that "high catecholamine" feeling whether it be dopamine and some adrenaline due to excitement/high from winning something or whether it be mostly high adrenaline from anxiety or agitation I start twisting my hands together etc.

Anyways reallt hard to explain but when i was at my worst when I literally could not feel any emotion at all and had anhedonia way way way back that behavior was also gone. That was when I was on SSRIs btw which robbed me of my emotional range while on them. I just dont do well on those drugs. For those struggling with that btw--my first emotion to come back in the LTC was anger. So if you are feeling angry then that is a good thing in the beginning.

i am going to be working on the hormone side of things I think somehow. I had my DHT checked recently and it was not that great (it was on the low end of the range) so I want to avoid any possible 5-AR inhibitors and increase my 5-AR production and DHT.

I noticed when this LTC started somehow my skin became clear but that could just be a coincidence of growing out of it but still.

DHT has very potent antidepressant/antianxiety effects. Ive read of guys on steroid boards saying that they have felt on top of the world on stuff like Proviron (which incidentally has been trialed as a depression treatment) but that is illegal in the US I believe.

I think cotcha is right about the fats/cholesterol too. I need to increase my fat intake if I want to boost my DHT levels.
 
Yeah sure, whey protein is essentially just amino acids, but whey protein supplements contain other ingredients and have been scrutinised countless times for being poor quality and containing other potentially harmful ingredients. Given your response I agree, those who are bedridden may benefit from them to make up calories but otherwise I would not included them as part of a standard diet.

Dairy in general is terrible for humans and is linked with various illnesses, which I why im against the use of whey supplementation, and soy protein for that matter. I get my protein from tofu, tempeh, chickpeas, lentils, beans etc and they come with the added benefit of being packed with other nutrients and phytonutrients.

I understand low glutamate diets have not been studied much so is merely a theory at this point, but seeing as sensitive individuals have a problem with MSG it is certainly possible that eating other high glutamate foods may trigger some side effects in certain individuals. Again, im aware this will probably do nothing for the majority but seeing as Ive seen people willing to try some absolute nonsense on here I dont see why its not worth consideration. Was merely a suggestion if people are our of options and need something else to try. I dont think the leaky gut theory suggests huge amounts crossing the BBB that would cause seizures but enough to warrant excitotoxicity.
 
Sorry if I seemed hyper-critical, I just don't like to see threads descend into food sensitivity/leaky BBB type stuff

People can get really paranoid about invisible stuff in their food that they think is causing them illness, even when they already don't meet their daily nutritional needs
 
martainnn said:
I think youre overthinking it dude, which I too was guilty of in the early stages.

You simply took a pschyoactive drug when you were in an already sensitive state. You may have been destined for dp and dr anyway down the line. I suffered from intense, evil depression for the first 3 months or so when getting dp and dr but now I just suffer with a constant state of flatness.

It may take some time but if you dont use any more drugs, including alcohol and caffeine, you should see some improvements. It took me around 8/9 months to start really making leaps and bounds. Im not quite at square 1 again but im pretty bad atm but Im positive i can get back to where I was even if it takes a while again.
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Martainnn, what substance did you relapse with?
 
My Dp seems to fluctuate throughout the day. Its kind of a hyperawareness sort of thing/OCD like now. Like when I realize it isn't there I sort of create it at a low level

Does that mean it should probably dissapate soon maybe in the next couple weeks? Id also imagine if this is some residual ketamine stuff it probably should resolve with that time frame too right? Is that realistic?

My psychiatrist believes this dp/dr is still the residual ketamine stuff and that a bad reaction like this may be possible given the LTC and me in general possibly being genetically sensitive to drugs.

But the doctor who did the ketamine thinks its not related to it at all!

What I want to know is why when it comes to the brain/hormones/mental health are doctors so split on the issue and are never able to give any proper answers?

Is it just because the majority of people have absolutely no issues and that when they encounter outliers they just don't believe it? Even though statistically, outliers always exist.

This seems to be a HUGE issue in medicine right now. Theres people all over suffering from prescription drugs like Accutane/Propecia/spironolactone or whatever and somehow the doctors don't believe that those things caused their symptoms and say "its all in their head".

Why exactly would that be? Its absolute madness.
 
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