avextracker
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2008
- Messages
- 17
(MDAI/200 mg)+(BZP/280 mg) Full MDMA substitute??
Hi guys. Don't really post much on here, but felt the need to spread my findings to the world
BZP - it's like marmite, you either love it or your hate it. I, like some others, love it. I have never had any side effects from using it and have succesfully used it once weekly for months at a time without any side effects other than feeling a little tired the first few days after using - nothing that a few early nights won't solve.
I have been taking BZP for years, since 2006. I introduced my girlfriend to it, and she also likes it.
Recently, however, it has become a little bit boring. I started taking it in 2006 when I first found out about PEP pills. I took it as an alternative to Ecstasy pills, as it was something new which produced a similar effects. After taking it for so long as an alternative, over the last several months, I was wanting to try something new. Immediately, MDAI jumped out at me. A selectoive serotonin releaser!? WOW! That's very similar to what MDMDA does! I have to try it!
After successfully trying it, what with it being so long since I had tried MDMA, those fond memories of when I was taking Ecstasy came back to me. But MDAI lacked something. Mainly stimulation - while it kept me awake for some hours past my usual bed time and then when I did go to bed I couldn't really sleep that well, it definitely lacked a dopamine kick. Also duration - the peak effects seemed to be over too quickly - MDAI literally just releases serotonin. Unlike MDMA, which not only releases it but also blocks the re-uptake - hence increasing the duration that the serotonin is peresent, thus the duration of the high.
So then, it clicked. How about combining BZP with MDAI? MDAI lacks what BZP brings. BZP lacks the empathy that MDAI brings.
You have the MDAI to release serotonin. Check.
While, the actions of BZP on the brain are not as well studied as that of MDMA and other drugs, after reading lots of pages and forums on the Internet, it seems that is acts upon dopamine and serotonin too. From my experience, I think it acts more upon dopamine due to the stimulation for hours upon end after taking it. What's that, that dopamine kick that MDAI lacked? Check. See where we are heading?
Also, BZP definitely has some sort of action on the serotonin system. I'm willing to learn if I'm wrong, so if anyone knows otherwise please tell me, but I remember reading somewhere on the net that BZP amplifies the serotonin receptors and also blocks the re-uptake of serotonin. Final point - amplifiaction of receptors and re-uptake blocked, check.
So, what happens when you combine these 2 substances? Pure ecstasy - thats what!
After not reading anything about this combo on the net before, I took it upon myself and my girlfriend to research this on Sunday night.
Times are approx - we were at a rave. Also I was not intending to record a full on trip report as I didn't think the results would be this good!
T +0
140mg BZP, 100mg MDAI taken together on empty stomach.
After not having any idea how they would react together, and no idea which I should take first - I decide to just take both together and see what happens. While it is a fairly low dose of BZP, this is how I have always dosed on this. Low doses, every 3 - 4 hours. Perhaps this is why I don't see any side effects that others do?
T +20mins
Definitely starting to feel something - I think it is the MDAI- it feels like a clean high, it must be the MDAI. BZP does not give me this clean a high this soon. From my experience, BZP takes about an hour to kick in properly.
T +40mins
I'm dancing, I'm happy. Everything that I expect from MDAI, nothing too intense. Nice clean happy semi-loved up buzz. This is the first time I have tried MDAI in a club before, have only tried it at home before now. It's nice
T +1hr
MDAI effects have peaked, possibly fading a little bit now. Can feel the BZP taking over a little more. Things appear less warm and fuzzy than they were before, stimuation is taking over.
T +1hr-3hrs
Over this space of the time, the primary effects of the MDAI have worn off, I'm left with the usual mild stimulation and euphoria from the small dose of BZP I have taken and a positive mood. I feel a little disappointed that the effects were not better when combining the 2 chemicals. I think to myself that the only thing that is left in store for me for the rest of the evening is the usual BZP stimulation. I was not expecting anything more. My experience with MDAI is that once the primary effects have worn off, if you have not re-dosed at the correct time, you will not get back to the same point. Dosing at the right time, for me, ensures a prolonged peak. Re-dosing after the peak has worn off has provided minimal results.
T + 3.5hrs
Main effects of BZP beginning to wear off, time to take more. God I love BZP - you can just keep going and going and going, like a Duracell bunny! I've stayed up for an insane number of hours on this stuff in the past!
Another 100mg MDAI and 140mg BZP down the hatch.
T+ 3.5hrs - 4.5hrs
Something is happening. This feels nothing like I have felt before on BZP. I think the second dose of MDAI began to take effect first. Very strong come up, intense euphoria, very loved up, talkative, music appreciation, dry mouth, gurning, eye wobbles, urge to dance. I had to put my head between my legs a few times - the euphoria was VERY intense!
T +4.5hrs - +8.5hrs
I'm officially fucked. The euphoria remained at a constant level for a very long time. The second dose of BZP kicked in, providing me with more stimulation for dancing. Lots of eye wobbles! I haven't had this much eye wobbling in a loooong time! I am having a VERY good time! I haven't felt like this since I last did MDMA! My girlfriend came out of her shell in a way I've never seen before! She has never done MDMA before. She was having the time of her life! We were both in our own little world, nothing else around us mattered - we were having an amazing time dancing to the music , and enjoying each others company. The connection between us was like nothing we have experienced before! The rave is over, we don't want to leave! We could carry on like this for hours!
It doesn't feel like I've even taken BZP - I can't feel that BZP feeling which I would normally feel. I don't care - I feel amazing!
T +8.5hrs - 11hrs
We leave the rave, still very much buzzing. I look in some glass, wow - I look FUCKED! Our eyes are WIDE, our pupils are HUGE! We feel amazing! We're walking through the town, talking shit, appreciating buildings, taking photos. The whole world seems beautiful. The euphoria started to fade about an hour after leaving the rave, but I was still very much fucked as the fading was very gradual. No urge to re-dose like I have experienved with MDAI on it's own.
T + 11hrs
Primary effects have definitely worn off. Time to try and get some sleep, have still been talking shit, still have euhoria, very dry mouth, eye wobbles but the BZP has worn off now so now seems like the time to get some rest.
After a few hours of sleep, I wake up feeling like I have literally just closed my eyes for a few minutes, not really feeling like I have been in a deep sleep, but I feel slightly rested. I still seem to have some eye wobbles, but I'm not sure if that's because I'm half sleep or not.
Throughout the following day, I have quite possibly the best afterglow I have ever had in my life. I'm in such a positive mood all day, chatting shit, still in amazement from the experiment the night before. I still feel a little more fucked than I should be for that time in the afternoon the following day. I wouldn't normally feel like this if I had taken either substance on their own. I have work tomorrow - time to try and calm my head down a bit! Haha! Lager does the trick. I have some cans, definitely feel less high after that. Hungry now.....Pizza delivery. After eating I start to feel tired around early evening, then bed.
I was worried when going to bed that night, I was afraid of what sort of comedown I would get the following morning! I had the worst comedown of my life off of 3 does of MDAI in a night (150mg + 150mg + 100mg respectively) - and when I did that I wasn't anywhere near as fucked as I was last night! Will have to wait and see.
300mg of 5-htp taken periodically throughout the day to ensure serotonin replenishment. 100mg upon going to bed the first time at approx T +11hrs, another 100mg upon waking, and the last 100mg before proper bed time
Possible side effect - I woke up in the middle of the night with heart palpitations and a scarily increased heart rate. Not sure if this is because of the drugs (even though it is approx 24hrs since second dose), or because of dehydration from the lager. Mental note: Don't have any lager next time to confirm. I do not usually suffer from any heart palpitations, so this was a bit scary, but it seemed to subside.
Wake up the next morning. How do I feel? Exactly how I would feel if I had taken BZP on it's own - tired. No further negative side effects. My girlfriends also reports feeling virtually normal. The comedown we had from 400mg MDAI as mentioned above completely wiped my girlfriend out for a week, more so than myself - so it was also good to see that there were no negative effcets for her too. As the day progresses, I realise that I'm in a much more positive mood than I would normally be for the first day back at work, particularly after having 10 days off! The following days, I have felt completely normal!
Conclusion:
This combo WORKS! My knowledge of these 2 chemicals on their action on the brain definitely worked in practice. I think it will take a little bit more experimenting to get the dose timings right. I think perhaps I should start with BZP first, and wait for that to take effect, then begin with the MDAI, as the MDAI seemed to take action first on both dosings.
I think using 2 different drugs like this, one could cater their experience more so than taking MDMA. For example, some people like more stimulation - take more BZP then MDAI. Some people want more loved up fuzziness than stimulation - take more MDAI than BZP.
Like I said, it definitely requires more experimentation - I will definitely be doing this combo again.
Combo score: 10/10 - exceeded all expectations when it finally got going.
Highly recommended! Quite possibly the closest things I've ever had to MDMA. If anything - better because the primary effects lasted longer! To those people who like to take large doses, I would go slow with this as I can only imagine what sort of a mess you would end up in if taking larger does of these chemicals at the same time!
Wow - did I just type that much!?
Hope you enjoyed it!
Hi guys. Don't really post much on here, but felt the need to spread my findings to the world
BZP - it's like marmite, you either love it or your hate it. I, like some others, love it. I have never had any side effects from using it and have succesfully used it once weekly for months at a time without any side effects other than feeling a little tired the first few days after using - nothing that a few early nights won't solve.
I have been taking BZP for years, since 2006. I introduced my girlfriend to it, and she also likes it.
Recently, however, it has become a little bit boring. I started taking it in 2006 when I first found out about PEP pills. I took it as an alternative to Ecstasy pills, as it was something new which produced a similar effects. After taking it for so long as an alternative, over the last several months, I was wanting to try something new. Immediately, MDAI jumped out at me. A selectoive serotonin releaser!? WOW! That's very similar to what MDMDA does! I have to try it!
After successfully trying it, what with it being so long since I had tried MDMA, those fond memories of when I was taking Ecstasy came back to me. But MDAI lacked something. Mainly stimulation - while it kept me awake for some hours past my usual bed time and then when I did go to bed I couldn't really sleep that well, it definitely lacked a dopamine kick. Also duration - the peak effects seemed to be over too quickly - MDAI literally just releases serotonin. Unlike MDMA, which not only releases it but also blocks the re-uptake - hence increasing the duration that the serotonin is peresent, thus the duration of the high.
So then, it clicked. How about combining BZP with MDAI? MDAI lacks what BZP brings. BZP lacks the empathy that MDAI brings.
You have the MDAI to release serotonin. Check.
While, the actions of BZP on the brain are not as well studied as that of MDMA and other drugs, after reading lots of pages and forums on the Internet, it seems that is acts upon dopamine and serotonin too. From my experience, I think it acts more upon dopamine due to the stimulation for hours upon end after taking it. What's that, that dopamine kick that MDAI lacked? Check. See where we are heading?
Also, BZP definitely has some sort of action on the serotonin system. I'm willing to learn if I'm wrong, so if anyone knows otherwise please tell me, but I remember reading somewhere on the net that BZP amplifies the serotonin receptors and also blocks the re-uptake of serotonin. Final point - amplifiaction of receptors and re-uptake blocked, check.
So, what happens when you combine these 2 substances? Pure ecstasy - thats what!
After not reading anything about this combo on the net before, I took it upon myself and my girlfriend to research this on Sunday night.
Times are approx - we were at a rave. Also I was not intending to record a full on trip report as I didn't think the results would be this good!
T +0
140mg BZP, 100mg MDAI taken together on empty stomach.
After not having any idea how they would react together, and no idea which I should take first - I decide to just take both together and see what happens. While it is a fairly low dose of BZP, this is how I have always dosed on this. Low doses, every 3 - 4 hours. Perhaps this is why I don't see any side effects that others do?
T +20mins
Definitely starting to feel something - I think it is the MDAI- it feels like a clean high, it must be the MDAI. BZP does not give me this clean a high this soon. From my experience, BZP takes about an hour to kick in properly.
T +40mins
I'm dancing, I'm happy. Everything that I expect from MDAI, nothing too intense. Nice clean happy semi-loved up buzz. This is the first time I have tried MDAI in a club before, have only tried it at home before now. It's nice
T +1hr
MDAI effects have peaked, possibly fading a little bit now. Can feel the BZP taking over a little more. Things appear less warm and fuzzy than they were before, stimuation is taking over.
T +1hr-3hrs
Over this space of the time, the primary effects of the MDAI have worn off, I'm left with the usual mild stimulation and euphoria from the small dose of BZP I have taken and a positive mood. I feel a little disappointed that the effects were not better when combining the 2 chemicals. I think to myself that the only thing that is left in store for me for the rest of the evening is the usual BZP stimulation. I was not expecting anything more. My experience with MDAI is that once the primary effects have worn off, if you have not re-dosed at the correct time, you will not get back to the same point. Dosing at the right time, for me, ensures a prolonged peak. Re-dosing after the peak has worn off has provided minimal results.
T + 3.5hrs
Main effects of BZP beginning to wear off, time to take more. God I love BZP - you can just keep going and going and going, like a Duracell bunny! I've stayed up for an insane number of hours on this stuff in the past!
Another 100mg MDAI and 140mg BZP down the hatch.
T+ 3.5hrs - 4.5hrs
Something is happening. This feels nothing like I have felt before on BZP. I think the second dose of MDAI began to take effect first. Very strong come up, intense euphoria, very loved up, talkative, music appreciation, dry mouth, gurning, eye wobbles, urge to dance. I had to put my head between my legs a few times - the euphoria was VERY intense!
T +4.5hrs - +8.5hrs
I'm officially fucked. The euphoria remained at a constant level for a very long time. The second dose of BZP kicked in, providing me with more stimulation for dancing. Lots of eye wobbles! I haven't had this much eye wobbling in a loooong time! I am having a VERY good time! I haven't felt like this since I last did MDMA! My girlfriend came out of her shell in a way I've never seen before! She has never done MDMA before. She was having the time of her life! We were both in our own little world, nothing else around us mattered - we were having an amazing time dancing to the music , and enjoying each others company. The connection between us was like nothing we have experienced before! The rave is over, we don't want to leave! We could carry on like this for hours!
It doesn't feel like I've even taken BZP - I can't feel that BZP feeling which I would normally feel. I don't care - I feel amazing!
T +8.5hrs - 11hrs
We leave the rave, still very much buzzing. I look in some glass, wow - I look FUCKED! Our eyes are WIDE, our pupils are HUGE! We feel amazing! We're walking through the town, talking shit, appreciating buildings, taking photos. The whole world seems beautiful. The euphoria started to fade about an hour after leaving the rave, but I was still very much fucked as the fading was very gradual. No urge to re-dose like I have experienved with MDAI on it's own.
T + 11hrs
Primary effects have definitely worn off. Time to try and get some sleep, have still been talking shit, still have euhoria, very dry mouth, eye wobbles but the BZP has worn off now so now seems like the time to get some rest.
After a few hours of sleep, I wake up feeling like I have literally just closed my eyes for a few minutes, not really feeling like I have been in a deep sleep, but I feel slightly rested. I still seem to have some eye wobbles, but I'm not sure if that's because I'm half sleep or not.
Throughout the following day, I have quite possibly the best afterglow I have ever had in my life. I'm in such a positive mood all day, chatting shit, still in amazement from the experiment the night before. I still feel a little more fucked than I should be for that time in the afternoon the following day. I wouldn't normally feel like this if I had taken either substance on their own. I have work tomorrow - time to try and calm my head down a bit! Haha! Lager does the trick. I have some cans, definitely feel less high after that. Hungry now.....Pizza delivery. After eating I start to feel tired around early evening, then bed.
I was worried when going to bed that night, I was afraid of what sort of comedown I would get the following morning! I had the worst comedown of my life off of 3 does of MDAI in a night (150mg + 150mg + 100mg respectively) - and when I did that I wasn't anywhere near as fucked as I was last night! Will have to wait and see.
300mg of 5-htp taken periodically throughout the day to ensure serotonin replenishment. 100mg upon going to bed the first time at approx T +11hrs, another 100mg upon waking, and the last 100mg before proper bed time
Possible side effect - I woke up in the middle of the night with heart palpitations and a scarily increased heart rate. Not sure if this is because of the drugs (even though it is approx 24hrs since second dose), or because of dehydration from the lager. Mental note: Don't have any lager next time to confirm. I do not usually suffer from any heart palpitations, so this was a bit scary, but it seemed to subside.
Wake up the next morning. How do I feel? Exactly how I would feel if I had taken BZP on it's own - tired. No further negative side effects. My girlfriends also reports feeling virtually normal. The comedown we had from 400mg MDAI as mentioned above completely wiped my girlfriend out for a week, more so than myself - so it was also good to see that there were no negative effcets for her too. As the day progresses, I realise that I'm in a much more positive mood than I would normally be for the first day back at work, particularly after having 10 days off! The following days, I have felt completely normal!
Conclusion:
This combo WORKS! My knowledge of these 2 chemicals on their action on the brain definitely worked in practice. I think it will take a little bit more experimenting to get the dose timings right. I think perhaps I should start with BZP first, and wait for that to take effect, then begin with the MDAI, as the MDAI seemed to take action first on both dosings.
I think using 2 different drugs like this, one could cater their experience more so than taking MDMA. For example, some people like more stimulation - take more BZP then MDAI. Some people want more loved up fuzziness than stimulation - take more MDAI than BZP.
Like I said, it definitely requires more experimentation - I will definitely be doing this combo again.
Combo score: 10/10 - exceeded all expectations when it finally got going.
Highly recommended! Quite possibly the closest things I've ever had to MDMA. If anything - better because the primary effects lasted longer! To those people who like to take large doses, I would go slow with this as I can only imagine what sort of a mess you would end up in if taking larger does of these chemicals at the same time!
Wow - did I just type that much!?
Hope you enjoyed it!
Last edited:
I have found MDAI to help out many chemicals, one being 4-fa..gave it that extra little bit of entactogenic push that makes chems like MDMA and Methylone so special. Glad you wrote this report as now you have me curious. 
