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LSD causes changes in gene expression in mice -- What does this mean?

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freedstar

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Sep 1, 2011
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This stuff is all way beyond me, but I was reading and never heard of this before.

"Researchers have examined the effects of LSD on gene expression in rat prefrontal cortex
(Nichols and Sanders-Bush 2002) and in mouse somatosensory cortex (Gonzalez-Maeso
et al. 2003). The large dose of 1 mg/kg i.p. produced changes in gene expression for a
number of genes in rat brain (Nichols and Sanders-Bush 2002) including c-fos, arc,
serum glucocorticoid kinase (sgk), neuron-derived orphan receptor 1 (nor1), IKappaBeta
and krox-20. LSD produces an early increase in c-fos and arc (Gresch et al. 2002), a
protein found in dendrites and associated with cytoskeletal rearrangements, in prefrontal
cortex (Lyford, Yamagata et al. 1995). Krox-20 may be involved in the maintenance of
long-term potentiation (Inokuchi et al. 1996), and Nor1 is a protein for a nuclear
steroid/thyroid receptor that may be involved in response to opiate and cocaine
administration (Maruyama et al. 1995)."


www.maps.org/research/lsd/swisslsd/IB_LSD.pdf


Can someone explain the significance (or non-) of this to me?
 
Layman's speak: Huge doses of LSD alter which protiens a rat brain makes, and how much.
What does it mean: I don't know. It is very hard to go from "Protien X Y and Z are expressed when drug X is administered" to "Drug X makes you more happy/depressed/angry etc."
 
Whatever it may mean for changes in subjective experience, if any, many drugs cause changes in gene expression, especially if abused. For example, this study: Transcriptional changes common to human cocaine, cannabis and phencyclidine abuse. I think I've read that changes in gene expression are thought to be implicated in the biology of addiction. This doesn't mean the changes super high doses of LSD in rats induce has anything to do with human addiction, then again maybe taking these doses will make you grow a penis from your forehead. In any case, as far as what this study is concerned with if you don't take ~70+ mg of LSD you probably wont' have to worry about it too much.
 
This won't be oral doses either - typically whenever mice are involved in Ecstasy research (and probably LSD research) they inject massive quantities directly into the brain every 3 hours for 4 days straight then try and claim that's the same as a human taking an oral dose once every 3 months. Obviously it's horseshit.
 
From a quick look i think that they are talking about reversible transcriptional changes (That gene expression changes for the duration of effects ) and not permanent changes . As a sufferer of cluster headaches i can say that it definitely works for aborting a cluster headache circle... so changes in the expression of period1 makes sense to me
 
Ismene said:
This won't be oral doses either - typically whenever mice are involved in Ecstasy research (and probably LSD research) they inject massive quantities directly into the brain every 3 hours for 4 days straight then try and claim that's the same as a human taking an oral dose once every 3 months. Obviously it's horseshit.
Click to expand...

This is not horse sht ! I have experienced this first hand. For years I could not get my hands on LSD. Finally I find a source and he has really good shit . At first i would trip my face of 2-4 tabs a night

I was in love ! i still felt good the next day with a wonderfull after glow, i would do it all weekend every weekend every chance i had i was high on acid. I consumed about 300 hits in 2 months time.

Obviousley by the end of the time my tolerance was insane. I couldent get high of magic mushrooms , (eating 14 grams produced a mild high and severe stomach discomfort) I was eating 5-10 tabs to start out my night and redosing later so i could eat anywhere from 15-25 hits a night , I could tell my synapsed have changed , maybe a shit load of other shit like you have said as i am no biologist.

When i first took acid there was no way i could eat more than 5 tabs because i would go insane !! crazy introspection and weird thoughts , even instances where i thought i had experienced telepathy.
by the end of my binge i would purely get visual effects , and no mental effects so i could think perfectley even though i had been on 20 tabs. this is very saddining as that is my favorite part about lsd....

it has now been 4 months since my love affair , and i still have lasting effects : I donot get Introspection from ANY PHYCADELIC that includes shrooms , NBOME , LSD, 2c-X, ketamine,
when i do get high my high seriousley resembles all of my lsd trips , wich i have never had LSD visuals on mushrooms or any visuals besides color change / breathing objects / introspection,

It has been slowley getting better , my tolerance is still high but ALOT Lower . This has tought me to respect phycadelics , Amphetamines , etc. as i lost the magic of mdma too
 
I could tell i was having direct toxic effects from lsd at retarded doses . evntually you cant even stand up without being nasueated . i have seen some links that note you can have mutagenisis or other toxic effects at 1mg+ i am searching for links now .

Just like MDMA damaged my receptors from unresponsable abbusive dosing, same as lsd ..
 
I didn't read but I'm guessing they dipped the mice in LSD (ridiculous and unrealistic doses).
 
^Your supposition isn't far off Mr. Cuntball. 1mg/kg means the average sized male adult would need to take around 80 mg of LSD (possibly directly injected into their brains if Ismene is right). That's around 800 decent hits of L. The PDF is just an overview of the literature. I wonder what the rationale for the original study cited here was. Psychopathic hatred of rodents? Sadism?
 
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