Benzos Looking for a drug like klonopin or Xanax, only lasts longer.

[D-isomerSpeedy]

Hey everyone. Sorry if this is in the wrong place.

So, I'm prescribed 30 Clonazepam a month. I take .5mg in the am. Then I take .5mg at night. Also, i habe a Script for 90 Focalin ir a month. The Focalin works great. The only issue I have is the anxiety is sometimes crippling. I don't know why, but the klonopin doesn't last long enough at the right dose. I was on Alprazolam when my Doc wanted to give me a brake from the klonopin, and it worked great. It just didn't last long at all. Does anyone know if there are strong, long lasting Benzodiazepines or any anti anxiety med out there that are long acting (+6hrs) that I won't have to resdose and worry about the stimulant induced panic attacks and horrid uneasiness around other people? If anyone has some constructive ideas, that would be most appreciated.


Also, before anyone says lower your Focalin does we've tried that. Anything less than what I'm on know just makes me tired, groggy and just flat out doesn't work.

Thanks for any input.

 

[Backfromthebrink]

Diazepam sounds like it would be ideal.

 

[D-isomerSpeedy]

Hey thanks a lot! I'll have to look into that and talk to my Doc about it. Thank you.

 

[king kpin]

I second Diazepam/Valium, it is pretty much the next best option.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Although clonazepam is considered a long acting benzo, diazepam can sometimes last nearly twice as long. So yes as the other stated that would be your best bet.

 

[Backfromthebrink]

Although clonazepam is considered a long acting benzo, diazepam can sometimes last nearly twice as long. So yes as the other stated that would be your best bet.

Yeah true..

Diazepam has an elimination half-life of between 30 and 50 hours..

Clonazepam 19.5 to 50 hours

Alprazolam 10 to 20 hours2

The main difference is that diazepam breaks down into active metabolites such as desmethyldiazepam (it's main one...also known as nordiazepam) temazepam and oxazepam and these can have a half life of up 170 hours..or roughly a week. Now that doesn't mean the drug stays working for a full week at optimal efficacy, but it does last for a very long time and would be ideal for the OP to ask to try.

It also has an oral BA of 100% (versus a rectal BA of around 90%) with peak plasma levels being obtained after around 30 to 90 minutes, versus 10 to 45 minutes for rectal..This is why it's so pointless for people to want to plug benzos..Is it really worth sacrificing 10% of the drug (at least depending on how it's prepared) to get it to work a few minutes quicker? I don't think it is but that's just me...I like to avoid sticking things up my poop chute unless there is a clear advantage in doing so

 

[Oxynormal]

Medium to long duration anxilytivcnc benzodiazepines include oxazepam, diazepam, clorazepate... ethhyl loflazepate lasts ages... to mention a few

 

[Backfromthebrink]

Medium to long duration anxilytivcnc benzodiazepines include oxazepam, diazepam, clorazepate... ethhyl loflazepate lasts ages... to mention a few

That's why diazepam is so ideal as it metabolises into oxazepam ..

Most of the others you mention aren't readily prescribed (if at all) in the US or elsewhere...and if they are doctors are unlikely to have any experience with...whereas all doctors are familiar with diazepam (or at least they should be).

I've noticed though by reading people's posts on benzos how much more readily doctors in the US are willing to prescribe a benzo compared to doctors in the UK who will go to extreme lengths to avoid prescribing a benzo for all but life threatening emergencies.... like for general anxiety or insomnia? Forget it... maybe 2 or 3 days worth if your extremely lucky, but generaly they don't.... God damn N.I.C.E. guidelines grrr!!!

 

[D-isomerSpeedy]

I really appreciate all the opinions and knowledge you guys have given me. I'll deffinatly be bring this up to my doctor when I see him. On a side note. I started off on clonazepam, then was put on alprazolam which worked great but inter does W/D's eventually started to become a problem. That's when I was put back on clonazepam. I guess my question is, why would my doctor chose the others over diazapam? Just his personal preference? Either way I appreciate all of you input.

 

[Backfromthebrink]

I really appreciate all the opinions and knowledge you guys have given me. I'll deffinatly be bring this up to my doctor when I see him. On a side note. I started off on clonazepam, then was put on alprazolam which worked great but inter does W/D's eventually started to become a problem. That's when I was put back on clonazepam. I guess my question is, why would my doctor chose the others over diazapam? Just his personal preference? Either way I appreciate all of you input.

That's a good question..I guess it kind of depends what exactly you said to him when he switches you. He's basically moved you from a moderately long acting benzo to a short one and back again... What did you say to make him switch from clonazepam to alprazolam?

It's also worth noting that not all doctors know a great deal about benzodiazepines..GPs are expected to know something about a huge number of things but not necessarily a great deal about any if them (bar their particular speciality)..The reason many of the people here know quite a bit about things like benzos or opiates is that they have spent a lot of time researching them..that's not something your average GP has either the time or inclination to do. Personally, my job only requires me to have to ever prescribe a very limited number of medications so I can take the time to look into them in more detail. Many others here have degrees in pharmacology, biochemistry etc. and so study medications in great detail...not to mention many of us either currently are, or have been in the past prescribed them and researched them in detail.. (or not prescribed them, but still used them ).

Anyway, hope you manage to get sorted when you see the doctor next. Maybe just explain to him that you think you would benefit from switching to diazepam...try and make it seem like it was his idea all along...doctors like that..some hate to think that a patient could possibly know more about a medically related subject than they do for reasons of their own egos lol..

 

[Trabbamab]

In the USA and many other countries you can find "Xanax XR" or "alprozolam extended release". These are designed to prevent the re-dosing and rapid peeks and valleys of effect. It is designed to more steadily and slowly deliver the drug over the course of the whole day. It is rapidly growing in popularity in the US as doctors find it more difficult to abuse and people seem to handle it better with less "drugged-up" highs and nervous lows. That could also be something you may want to discuss with your doctor if clonazepam or alprozolam aren't lasting long enough.

 

[D-isomerSpeedy]

That's a good question..I guess it kind of depends what exactly you said to him when he switches you. He's basically moved you from a moderately long acting benzo to a short one and back again... What did you say to make him switch from clonazepam to alprazolam?

It's also worth noting that not all doctors know a great deal about benzodiazepines..GPs are expected to know something about a huge number of things but not necessarily a great deal about any if them (bar their particular speciality)..The reason many of the people here know quite a bit about things like benzos or opiates is that they have spent a lot of time researching them..that's not something your average GP has either the time or inclination to do. Personally, my job only requires me to have to ever prescribe a very limited number of medications so I can take the time to look into them in more detail. Many others here have degrees in pharmacology, biochemistry etc. and so study medications in great detail...not to mention many of us either currently are, or have been in the past prescribed them and researched them in detail.. (or not prescribed them, but still used them ).

Anyway, hope you manage to get sorted when you see the doctor next. Maybe just explain to him that you think you would benefit from switching to diazepam...try and make it seem like it was his idea all along...doctors like that..some hate to think that a patient could possibly know more about a medically related subject than they do for reasons of their own egos lol..

Haha I'll deffinatly have to try that. Luckily, I have a very good relationship with my psychiatrist. I will deffinatly will discuss it the next time I see him. Thanks for the reply

 

[D-isomerSpeedy]

In the USA and many other countries you can find "Xanax XR" or "alprozolam extended release". These are designed to prevent the re-dosing and rapid peeks and valleys of effect. It is designed to more steadily and slowly deliver the drug over the course of the whole day. It is rapidly growing in popularity in the US as doctors find it more difficult to abuse and people seem to handle it better with less "drugged-up" highs and nervous lows. That could also be something you may want to discuss with your doctor if clonazepam or alprozolam aren't lasting long enough.

I didn't even realize they made in XR formulas. I'll ask for sure.

 

[Lorne???]

Yeah true..

Diazepam has an elimination half-life of between 30 and 50 hours..

Clonazepam 19.5 to 50 hours

Alprazolam 10 to 20 hours2

The main difference is that diazepam breaks down into active metabolites such as desmethyldiazepam (it's main one...also known as nordiazepam) temazepam and oxazepam and these can have a half life of up 170 hours..or roughly a week. Now that doesn't mean the drug stays working for a full week at optimal efficacy, but it does last for a very long time and would be ideal for the OP to ask to try.

It also has an oral BA of 100% (versus a rectal BA of around 90%) with peak plasma levels being obtained after around 30 to 90 minutes, versus 10 to 45 minutes for rectal..This is why it's so pointless for people to want to plug benzos..Is it really worth sacrificing 10% of the drug (at least depending on how it's prepared) to get it to work a few minutes quicker? I don't think it is but that's just me...I like to avoid sticking things up my poop chute unless there is a clear advantage in doing so

I am sorry, however valium IS NOT A LONG ACTING DRUG, and yiu cannot
change that;

IT is rapisky abaorded, into circulation and then the CNS; however it then quickly exits the cns, and is then redistrinuted into varius bisy tissues, rendering UT useless as iT is gradually metabolized; and it is Highly protien bound making plasma levels, undeliavle at best, so that whatever is keft in plasma , is only a fraction and had no practical effect.
At clinical doses, it?s metabolites are useless; oxazepam is, what, half as potent as dzp, iT gas a slow onset, and is converted so gradually, throw it out (and only a small amount of a 10mg dode is converted; even if 10% of the Daisy dose was converted, that is ~7.5mg of oxazepam per day, so?)

Same for Temazepam, valium(dzp,) is typically1.5-2x as potent( though Temaepam is more relaxing typically and a better sedtive/hynotic, though again 15-20mg Temazepan= ~10mg dzp(Some sources say 5mg valium= a whooping 15mg, though mostly an overestimation)

And the big one, nordazepam; nordazepam and tranxene are effectively the same medication, abd it doesn't really last as long as clonazepam; duration 4-12 hours for Cloraepate(Tranx), and clona holds longer

W/out multiple large doses per day, dzp is a fast acting medication, that quickly wears off

There are a couple of other ?long acting? benzodiazepines that actually had a long duration, corresponding to -roughly~ t1-2

And Nordazepam is a partial agonist and valium itself is typically consedered to be 1.5-2x as potent (making nordazepam similiar to temazepam, as per converters

#

 

[Backfromthebrink]

I am sorry, however valium IS NOT A LONG ACTING DRUG, and yiu cannot
change that;

IT is rapisky abaorded, into circulation and then the CNS; however it then quickly exits the cns, and is then redistrinuted into varius bisy tissues, rendering UT useless as iT is gradually metabolized; and it is Highly protien bound making plasma levels, undeliavle at best, so that whatever is keft in plasma , is only a fraction and had no practical effect.
At clinical doses, it?s metabolites are useless; oxazepam is, what, half as potent as dzp, iT gas a slow onset, and is converted so gradually, throw it out (and only a small amount of a 10mg dode is converted; even if 10% of the Daisy dose was converted, that is ~7.5mg of oxazepam per day, so?)

Same for Temazepam, valium(dzp,) is typically1.5-2x as potent( though Temaepam is more relaxing typically and a better sedtive/hynotic, though again 15-20mg Temazepan= ~10mg dzp(Some sources say 5mg valium= a whooping 15mg, though mostly an overestimation)

And the big one, nordazepam; nordazepam and tranxene are effectively the same medication, abd it doesn't really last as long as clonazepam; duration 4-12 hours for Cloraepate(Tranx), and clona holds longer

W/out multiple large doses per day, dzp is a fast acting medication, that quickly wears off

There are a couple of other ?long acting? benzodiazepines that actually had a long duration, corresponding to -roughly~ t1-2

And Nordazepam is a partial agonist and valium itself is typically consedered to be 1.5-2x as potent (making nordazepam similiar to temazepam, as per converters

#

Diazepam isn't a long acting drug???? What??

Yes it is..literally every single medical source there is states it as such..

I don't just pull these things off the top of my head you know..I'm quoting research...

Can you can quote me a single piece of research thst states "DIAZEPAM IS NOT A LOING ACTING DRUG"

Similar to your statement that the oral BA of oxycodone Is 50% your simply stating your opinion without any evidence...

And it's wrong I'm afraid

 

[Scrofula]

Sounds pretty long-acting to me, with a long-acting metabolite.

Maybe not the longest?

 

[Prescottdave]

Although clonazepam is considered a long acting benzo, diazepam can sometimes last nearly twice as long. So yes as the other stated that would be your best bet.

This sums it up.

 

[Lorne???]

Good diazepam duration... it says " despite it's long t1/2 it must be administer frequently" and soneelfhingh else... think it quote it as lasting ~4 hours

And it isn't opioinion; have you ever taken diazepam? It feels more like alcohol than a benzodiazepine

and MULTIPLE STUDIES CONFIRM ~50 Ba%, have already posted them in numerous threads, including this one: (a side project of sort)

http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/838186-BA-T1-2-Tmax-duration-superthread-by-Lorne

Please do NOT presume to know what is in my head, or claim that it is opioinion; pretty much deal w/ facts, if it is opinion, shall say so

Like you saying that methadone must be given multiple times for chronic pain, when at least one study found a single dose lasted upwards of 10 hours; it's well know that analgesic and opioid suppressant effects are different, though BID would work, imo for many(most?) patients, along w/ reasonable breakthrough prn

 

[Lorne???]

Sounds pretty long-acting to me, with a long-acting metabolite.

Maybe not the longest?

Scrofula, you of all people should know that T1/2 and duration of action are 2 completely things... Clonazepam is the longest benzodiazepine you are likely to get scripted, as it's poor solubility allows it to renter the brain as it is slowly metabolized(nordazepam lasts longer than DZp Itself, not as long as CZP in general and certainly not for me, though with large doses it may build up

Nordazepam is available, and seems to be used more now, though in the form is Tranxene, which is pretty much completely converted to nordazepam in the stomach/go tract; and guess what? They were giving it to me 4 times a day, and that still didn't work, it was a disaster(another story for another time)

It has to do w/ lipophillicy, primarily. Dzp is so lipophillic it is rapidly absorbed and quickly enters the CNS; the father a drug enters, the faster it exits. It is distributed to adipose tissue, and is even stored in the heart

Loraepam lasts longer than a single dose of diazepam, and prevents seizures longer, this is a simple fact, and why hospitals have changed to Lorazepam as the go-to abti-epilipectic; of all people, Lorne here would know

and multiple studies again confirm the BA% of oxy, one put it a little less than 50%, one a little more, and another 70-80%, intranasal for snorting well ground oxycontin tablets(old school, not OP's)

Will repost more references, Backfromthebrink, though w/ all due respect, do NOT claim am stating an opinion when am stating irrefutable fucking facts

(second part was for Backfromthebrink, who seems cool, though he effectively insulted me; 15 minutes of reasearch would explain why diazepam is either given as an infusion, or every 2 hours, and why it isn't prescribed in favor of more effective (and newer) longer lasting benzodiazepines

 

[Steady Scootin]

Speaking of someone that could use a chill pill...