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lets list disproofs, or proofs, of a god.

^
haha -

good answer.


... um no, something cant exist with out being created.
final answer.
(the ultimate paradox)
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or maybe, in a prerecorded universe, who hit record first?!?
 
panic in paradise said:
i havent read anything in the bible asking or instructing others to, sit in a church and worship a "figure", but rather that this figure is us, and the church is you and i individually.

when i began to "learn" the rosary, or decided to try and learn i couldnt find any one particular way, besides the classic standards, and i also had to think that Mary wasnt saying Ave Maria with her rosary -- no... haha


a universal being, figure, entity, point-of-light, fluctuating paradigm manifold, is not in need of our praise...JC asks no where for people to start a religion, divide, slaughter each other in "his" name.
no... it just doesnt.


i feel i should try and paraphrase pascal - "if you believe in and acknowledge a God(s) or -spiritual belief system-, and they exist GREAT - if you go through life believing and acknowledging a god, and it turns out to not be real, what did you lose?!"

after spending my life, listening to other peoples comments, and experiences, and also only going on my interactions with "christians" - i finally started reading a Bible, and, yeah we dont like hearing how God is cruel...GASP, god kills babies, and does all sorts of things we dont think is "fair" indeed. what i have read, from the Bibles i have now read, is the best fucking reading ive done. and i dont mind saying fuck and bible or not capitalize bible or god...because, superstition, is actually bull shit.


i also never cared to have to hear others opinions much on this, well the bible that is.
we are stupid...lol. yeah - sheep we are, i mean, let me pitch out the death rock goth band, "christan death" - people see or hear that and, judge rather then think - and thats exactly what they were on about, i was never into them untill recently, and after connecting those dots, well, thats the way it is.

death to the assumptions made by a politically driven jesus factory inc.
you know?
if i hated fish, but was always told steak tasted like fish, well i may of never tried steak taking others word for it, or only their tastes buds interpretation.

i may of never been able to see the connection between the chakras and the lords prayer, for instance, if you are familiar Qablah practices, or the tree of life progression system, and the chakras as mentioned - then saying the lords prayer might take on a new meaning, breaking it apart into 9 steps...

the rosary is a massively "metaphysical", stella awaking-connecting practice for myself, i try and say 150 a day - thisis my Heroin, the rosary is my stargate.
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Bernadette Soubirous is list worthy i feel...
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... What?!
 
wouldn't the big cheese be beyond linear time? would that not undermine the whole "what created a creator" argument?
 
god exist only cause we believe

god does exist but i don't believe in god the creator.
god doesn't exist because the devil exist; god cant create life or control death if there is a god there always the question of us and what our past and future is even present of how the devil is present or not or we don't believe in one or the other
i'm saying whats the opposite of god?
nothing. (this might be why nihilism exist for people that have this thought.)
This is all god can do is be in our thoughts and expire with every other thought as so god isn't a solid thing a human a being a creator because it's impossible. think about the vastness of our race even the knowledge and the opinions and how it can be varied. did he just created this? how divine power? that power is even within our knowledge so we can create whats not to say were among or are gods or believe god. we have to understand the divine power that they speak of to understand god. what do you think divine power is? is it belief? it makes us who where are and individual belief we are all capable of it and its unique enough to be divine.
so what is a constant belief ?
religion? no religion is a practice without the consciousness of an enlighten mind
what do you do with an enlighten mind?
believe .even believe in nothing.
nothing is everything and its just a circle of a full circle of thoughts this is just an argument of the use of the word god as it brings weird feeling for me therefor i rambled and posted.
 
L2R said:
can god create individuals he couldn't control? what would be the point if he couldn't?

you either have omnipotence or free will, can't have both.
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I disagree, essentially you as a parent will in the future have opportunity to try to control your child. You will do this but you will also find you allow him to make some decisions on his own. If this is not having power but not using it then what is it ? Power whether limited or total can be set aside as the holder of that power has choice.

As to the car analogy, it's not much use - the omnipotence is generally presumed to come with omniscience a free extra dimension ( only if you buy before the beginning of time) thus you know the car will not crash or you don't mind if it does because it's part of a process you deem it wise not to intervene in.
 
Nagelfar said:
However, should they be discredited to the point which they are disallowed as an optional right to anyone?
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No.

I'd like to add as clarification that my "well said" comment was in no way a criticism of Pips original post as I've a feeling my intent has been misunderstood. I simply tagged the heroin religion bit on the end as some sort of aside
 
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^... takes practice, and faith haha- then maybe sooner then later there might be a personal irrefutable event, occurrence, or circumstance. talking about it though, is not usually at all a good idea - and like they also say; "do not be amazed!" true as well. these two points practiced can keep you from all sorts of trouble and drama.

and no, im not exaggerating+much stranger things have happened!
maybe it sounds kind of crude, but the stuff is in our bodies, ive had plenty experience with painkillers/opioids etc. and am in enough pain 24/7 to know WTF -
haha uhg.
;-)
if this is ones motive, good luck with that - and indecently; i havent ever "prayed" for anything in-particular...


i soon couldnt deny Jesus or the Christos, Mary and the Rosary, Isis, Lucifer, Sophia and Jehovah etc. because i have had many "spiritual experiences", and then became confused as to what the difference really was...


"she will bath your broken body - sweetly calls you near - to the garden of the lilies, by the waters clear"
-?


<3
 
Newbie here...My belief is in God. I am a Christian (not the Bible beater type, or I wouldn't be on here), but I disagree with a lot of the Christian beliefs...I drink, and occasionally smoke (though the e-cig has been great in helping me quit)....

Boil it down....like someone (can't remember) once said....
It's better to believe in God and find out he doesn't exist, than to not believe in God and find out he does exist. Just my two cents...
 
^i used that line, paraphrased quite a bit in this thread - that would be Pascal who said that.

im the opposite, im very much into the Bible, but disagree with many Cristian beliefs; which would mostly be their insight into the Bible.
from what ive noticed living and learning.
 
edit: in reply to the noob
^that rationalising of belief is a little insincere, don't you think? to submit to believe in that way, under threat of pain, is hardly a way a loving God would want to be praised.
 
^it makes sense, though. we made god to rationalize and justify our heirarchy of murder and authority. so god, unlike most of the previous deities, is a very serious person. he's quite brutal, and is willing to threaten a planet with hell to get a few songs to his name.

totally in our ancestors' leaders' image.
 
qwe said:
^it makes sense, though. we made god to rationalize and justify our heirarchy of murder and authority. QUOTE]


More likely we created a creator from whence we sprang as that's exactly what we saw in nature, if all your info says father/mother creates child then it seems reasonable to guess that the creation of a father/mother figure as an original creator would be logical. The justification for the murdering & killing comes later as a perversion of the original concept - I can't offer any concrete proofs tho
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^,^^
agree, we didn't necessarily make him for that, it's just currently a part of "His" functionality.
 
Antecessor said:
Ill start with a disproof, please follow my example when replying with your own disproofs, or aha 'proofs'.

Fact: A god must be omnipotent to be a real god.
1. Can god do anything?
Yes? Read question 2
No?
Then he is not a god.
2. Can god create a stone too heavy to lift?
No? Then he cannot do anything and so is not a god.
Yes? Then he cannot lift the rock, cannot do anything, and so is not a god.

Conclusion, god cannot exist.
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trying to prove or disprove god through logic is like trying to see the stars through a microscope.
 
There's one thing I read that seemed kinda original. It's based on the "Occam's razor," basically the simplest explanation is the likely the truest explanation. Well it goes "Where does the universe come from?" God? Okay, "Where does God Come from?" He just always exists, or he has an infinite regression of predecessors. Either way it's simpler to eliminate god from the equation and just say the universe either has always existed, in some form, or else it has an infinite regression of predecessors seeing as how there's basically no way to resolve the fact that you're going to have a make some kind of logical leap, given our limited knowledge of the universe, so you might as well make a less large leap.
I like this method better than any of the semantic games of a formal logical proof. Those are limited by cultural definitions, and the logic itself has a limitation based on language. I don't see how God would be limited simply by our linguistics. I'd rather have a vague explanation that makes sense to me than some presumptuous, formulaic, approach.

More to the point, where are some examples of Occam's Razor being a totally off-base? Wouldn't such examples, by definition, be "supernatural" or "miraculous" to some degree? I can't really think of any at the moment, but I hope other people can.
 
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