Opioids kratom suboxone heroin wds

[mike.vick]

Hey ive been doing heroin for the past three weeks .5g total with a 3 and a 4 day break in the middle, all day long intranasal usage. Got 1x 8mg sub strip I have never done subs before I heard you are supposed to wait 24 hrs after last dose b4 taking. What if I take kratom between the heroin and suboxone? Will it cut down the risk and time frame of percipitated wds. I have 104 kratom caps, and 50 clonidine pills and 4 xanax bars. and like 30% of the heroin i have done left but I wanna quit.

my eventual sub regimine plan per day: 1- 2.46mg 2- 1.84mg 3-1.23mg 4-.64mg 5-.64mg

 

[pbuilder]

I don't think that is enough sub for a taper. You will avoid withdrawal but 3 or 4 days after you finish the sub, you are going to be in withdrawals again. Not sure on the kratom, but I get the feeling that kratom will cause precipitated withdrawals when you dose your suboxone. Kratom works on the mu-receptors too I believe, but I don't have any experience with suboxone so I can't say for sure that it will precipitate withdrawals if you recently took kratom. Just wait as long as possible before you dose the suboxone, because I can imagine precipitated withdrawals absolutely suck ass.

 

[mike.vick]

Dang man SOMEBODY COMMENT!!!!!!

 

[Benwise]

What the fuck do you want us to say? You've made this thread already and you keep asking for people to chime in. Do you want us to say finish your heroin? Or take a fuck ton of kratom? I gave you a perfectly good answer that will 100% work in your situation.

Idk Wtf you want. You have plenty of acceptable answers and you just ask for more.

You won't even have withdrawals. You've done less than a half gram in 3 weeks. Take a Xanax whenever you have a panic attack because you apparently are only having mental withdrawals if you're freaking out this bad over such a small habit. Don't take any kratom, it'll make your addiction worse.

Does that float your boat..?

 

[mike.vick]

dude i've got answers from three different people, each varying,and I would like atleast a good sampling, like b/w a dozen and thirty people would be enough to make a little of an informed decision. ayfkmaw? If you think 3 people is a good sampling, it is not. I'm inferring a negative tone in your post but I will give you the bennefit of the doubt.

I've done a full ~.6g and 16mg diluadid in 3 weeks time I know I will wd pretty hard and rough if it was cold. I'm trying to find answer to avoid pain.

 

[Benwise]

What does ayfkmaw mean...?

and it was negative because you made another thread. There's only so much we can tell you.

Bupe = wait 24 hours to take.
heroin = flush it.
kratom = withdrawals of its own.

What you can conclude from this is, get rid of the heroin now. don't hold on to it.

Take the first 2mg of bupe 24 hours after heroin. Do a 2-2-2-1-1 taper or a 3-2-2-1, that'd work best to limit the amount of time you're still using opiates. Take .2mg clonidine 3x daily. Morning, lunch, dinner/before bed.

Use xanax to sleep, or if anxiety gets out of hand.

That's almost the same as my rehab taper. That's the medical professional plan given to me by multiple doctors in a $45k/month rehab (I actually did 4-3-3-2-2-2-2-1-1 with bupe but you don't have that much.)

theres $45,000 worth of information + real doctors / addiction specialists taper plan. Don't use the kratom.

 

[mike.vick]

ayfkmaw?- are you fucking kiddong me, are what?

I wanna avoid xanax for 2 weeks, i have exams. An I ain't flushsin the .3 of H just in case I need a pin size dot for rls some night during wd after subs

and the taper i got was straight from the suboxone company booklet except they used 8-6-4-2-2-0-0 for a 7 day, and I titrated the dosage for just 8mg

what happens if you go 23hrs before taking the sub?

 

[Benwise]

In your case, nothing. Dude you're really overestimating your habit. It's not big, at all. It will not be rough. It'll be mild.

Do not listen to suboxones taper, honestly mine is better for you. Any of the 3-4 I mentioned would be great. If you do that and then do kratom after your off sub you will literally feel nothing. You shouldn't feel anything besides anxiety and cravings anyways.

I'm banging .5 a day minimum and my withdrawals don't even require that much preparation. Sure, I'm not clean, but if I was going to get clean I'd do a 2-2-2-1-1 taper and ride out the crappy feeling for 2-4 more days and be done.

If this is your first bout with opiates and dependency you will literally feel almost no withdrawal...

Xanax is takeable with exams. If you take .5mg like you're supposed to, you'll retain everything unless you take more.

When to take sub: when your apparently horrible withdrawals kick in. Sneezing, watery eyes, stomach pain/vomiting/diarrhea, RLS (minor indicator, some people are spastic with their legs) a general sick feeling. you could probably take it 12-18 hours after your last dose...

You're 18-20, you've done all of your research on every drug before even taking it, you know everything and seem 100% prepared.

That's also how I was. You think you know you used long enough for horrible withdrawals. There's some things you can't read man, reading about other people's withdrawals and experiences can't give you the insight actually experiencing it gives you.

You will not withdrawal that hard. I don't give a fuck what you've read, how many different people you've 'sampled' and ultimately determined that from, you're wrong. And if you think you will, it'll be worse because you'll give yourself psychosomatic symptoms.

I'm not trying to minimize your use/habit. You're using heroin, after all. But it is not anywhere near as bad as you think, regardless of all the reports on erowid, bluelight, DF, opioph, etc. You've read.

 

[mike.vick]

Thanks a lot for yor replies man, I appreciate it a lot. i've w/d a couple times, but when i was doin the more pure white powder shit, .5g gave me a real rough withdrawal after just 2 weeks cold and bad rls and tired-sleeplessness and flu. I really can't take the xnx during exams cause i'm taking some real serious classes

 

[Benwise]

Thanks a lot for yor replies man, I appreciate it a lot. i've w/d a couple times, but when i was doin the more pure white powder shit, .5g gave me a real rough withdrawal after just 2 weeks cold and bad rls and tired-sleeplessness and flu. I really can't take the xnx during exams cause i'm taking some real serious classes

I'm a senior in an engineering program at a top engineering school And if taken properly xanax won't do shit to you academically.

Are you using fentanyl...?

That's not even a bad withdrawal. I didn't hear any mention of pain, vomiting, diarrhea, etc. I heard minor, minor withdrawal symptoms. Any of my taper plans in this thread or the last will give you Damn near 100% comfort, I'd say 85% absolute bare minimum. That's not shit, that's like waking up on the wrong side of the bed and being cranky for 2-3 hours. Wtf.

 

[mike.vick]

dude it was real painful, at one point i even theorized that john lennon went from being handsom to rough-looking because of withdrawaling a certain number of times. plus i had psychological symptoms like feeling like a dirtball and missing my family members too much.

but i'm a senior pre-med student so I have to be on my game, so I must wait till after exams for the xanz

and no i'm not using fent, I am a med-mj cardholder tho and picked up 20x 250mg thc colorado cannabis tears today so I don't have to pain myself w/ smoking, these things are great

 

[Benwise]

You don't know shit about the drugs you're using and if you think that's painful you don't know shit about withdrawal. You're supposed to feel like worse than a dirt ball. I personally want to die at about 36 hours in. I cry and cry and cry and i become angry etc.

You're going to be a shitty doctor if you don't withdrawal from opiates on your own. weak brained, weak spirited, pathetic mix. Doesn't matter how smart you are, you're gunna end up being a fucking junky for life if you don't grow a pair of balls and do something about it.

You don't need fucking bupe, you don't need weed (if you can even ingest weed you're not withdrawaling back enough...your anxiety should be through the roof.)

enjoy your life of heroin since you're too afraid to quit

 

[mike.vick]

geez man, you have a strange attitude. I feel like u wanna look i the mirror and tell yourself that.

 

[Benwise]

geez man, you have a strange attitude. I feel like u wanna look i the mirror and tell yourself that.

I wanna look in the mirror and tell myself I haven't been banging a half G a day but my tracks say differently. If I was in your spot I'd literally break down and cry in happiness because I could finally be free in a relatively painless 2-5 days. But no, that's not where I am and that's not the reality of my situation .

 

[mike.vick]

Gee man, don't be down beacause there's always a way to ween yourself down w/ modern medicine to not be soo painful of a fall. Replacement therapies and such are not perfect but the work reasonably well to get you started to lowering your dosage. And i'm gonna try to just wean myself using kratom for right now for a few days before maybe doing a little sub. I'm not trying to compare my deficit to yours, it's all relative.

 

[RetiredMedic]

When I used subs it was only one time. I had to be off all Opiates for 24 hours, I have seen PD's and they are scary. I've never used H but was on pretty high dose of pain meds for a very long time. I had my back fixed and knew it was time to quit. I went cold turkey for 27 hours(the extra three was by my own choice) then did a three day sub taper. From what I have read about Krantom I wouldn't use it until after the Sub if still needed. It binds to the same receptor as does H and having the subs kick it off is what brings on the PW's. Id do 2 mg am and 2 mg pm, 1 mg am 1 mg pm and repeat for last day making 3 total. you might still have some WD's but should be mild enough that the weed would get you through. With that said I was taking 160 mg of Oxy a day and 350 mg of soma a day for 9 years. I have been clean going on 90 days now and still experience PAWS IE: RLS and Insomnia. here's is what I found on Krantom to show you what I was talking about. FYI even though I am going through PAWS few times a week life is much better being free! that's from me to you!


The leaves of kratom contain mitragynine and several related alkaloids. Of all the compounds present in the leaf, mitragynine appears to be the most active and the one most likely responsible for kratom’s pleasing effects. Used as an opiate substitute, kratom contains no opiates of any kind, but it does bind to the same receptor sites in the brain. It binds to the mu-opioid receptor, as do both enkephalins and morphine. Additionally mitragynine binds to kappa-opioid receptors, which are associated with pain relief and sedation. Mitragynine is adrenergic, which produces a stimulating effect, and it also binds with serotonin receptors, producing an anti-depressant effect as well. Due to this multiplicity of activities in the brain, kratom produces an overall pleasing feeling.

 

[RetiredMedic]

I wanna look in the mirror and tell myself I haven't been banging a half G a day but my tracks say differently. If I was in your spot I'd literally break down and cry in happiness because I could finally be free in a relatively painless 2-5 days. But no, that's not where I am and that's not the reality of my situation .

I feel for you, Just to let you know when I was in detox there was a guy there that was a 1g a day H habit. He has been clean now same amount of time as me. There is always hope my friend and I wish the best for you!

 

[Benwise]

I feel for you, Just to let you know when I was in detox there was a guy there that was a 1g a day H habit. He has been clean now same amount of time as me. There is always hope my friend and I wish the best for you!

I know. I had over a year and lapsed on a whim when a friend from rehab who was in sober living house died. Random death, 35 years old, heart just stopped beating.

And to the OP, it is all relative. you have the tools to get off without sub. kratom for a week would suit you fine. Use sub first because it's the stronger opioid (If you choose to use sub...) You'll be fine even if you just do kratom every day for a week or so.

 

[Nib]

I can tell you for sure Suboxone will not Induce P/W even with an ounce a day Kratom use. I did it by accident once and was like oh fuck, felt maybe a little off for a bit but nothing serious at all.

I would go from Sub down to Kratom to get off. Quality Kratom will kill all Subs w/d and let you take another step down so to speak.

 

[Colonel Contin]

Just to chime in: OP, have you ever used subs before? I can't imagine you'd need more than 0.5-1mg daily to stave off withdrawals considering your habit. 0.5g over the course of 3 weeks? I'm not sure if I would even risk using suboxone. My habit spans 7 years, and I have resorted to sub maintenance, but truthfully, it is a nasty drug, and it's not going to leave you feeling great.

I understand that you want to be functional, and you seem to label your withdrawal syndrome as 'severe' because it is devastating to your functionality, but the symptoms you are experiencing are comparatively mild. I'm not going to sit here and try to convince you that 'you got it easy', because heroin detox sucks no matter how you slice it. And honestly, I had more success fully detoxing from a 1-2g a day habit than I did when I was chipping, just because of how debilitating the WD gets when you have a heavy habit. The biggest temptation, for me anyway, comes when you're partially mobile, rocking back and forth on the edge of the bed counting the minutes, and surprisingly not during the super-acute, 'accidentally shitting yourself in bed and then laying in it for way too long because the thought of gathering your clothes, trecking to the bathroom and hosing off is too overwhelming' phase.

I honestly think you'd be best served by clearing 4-5 days from your schedule, climbing under the covers, taking enough xanax and clonidine to relax and sweating it out. Loperamide might be the ticket for some of you lingering symptoms, and it's easy to taper... but if that's not cutting it, I'd bet you could use kratom during this time to almost completely wipe out the rest of your symptoms.

If you cannot take a few 'sick-days', I think you could cut your 8mg suboxone into 16 pieces and take 1-2 pieces daily to remain completely functional, but after you run out, you're not going to feel fantastic. You'll have to budget for a few shitty days regardless of which route you take. If you go CT, you could be back to prancin' after a long weekend