Kratom Kratom Journal

[pnillyg]

Ok I’m quitting kratom. I’ve done and quit about every other drug from benzos to bupe to oxy and now we’re on kratom. I’m over it. Today we start coming off. Keeping this as a daily journal so yall can hopefully see/use this to help yourself in any way applicable.

So far today halted my morning dose from about 12g kratom tea to 6g accompanied with 300mg gabapentin at 7:20am and again at about 9am.

This will be my journal. Let the games begin…

Today (day 1)

7:20am - 300mg gabapentin *too late I was already hella restless so need to take earlier tomorrow morning or before bed

8:20am - 6g kratom tea

9:43am - 300mg gabapentin *for anxiety

2:21pm - 6g kratom tea
300mg gabapentin *anxiety around election/wanting to quit kratom/girlfriend tripping about election

5:00pm - 3g red maeng da powder

8:58pm - thc live resin vape

 

[paltatomate]

if you want, you can do it!

 

[pnillyg]

we gonna do it. It’s just a matter of how fast

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Where it extracts or powdered leaf ?

Powdered leaf was ime so easy to taper and get off.
Kratom>GHB>Alcohol, the last one is i assume one of the last Dragons.

Hardest drug I had to kick. Or i d die within my time.

Keep going and if you have left just taper.
Never lost a night of sleep even when WD-ing. B9 plant, not the super extracts.

 

[paltatomate]

we gonna do it. It’s just a matter of how fast

if doing it the safe way takes a little longer, so be it.

 

[jasperkent]

we gonna do it. It’s just a matter of how fast

Best wishes and keep us posted.

I'm about to do some kratom tapering myself, but without any other drugs to help. I'll be cutting back very slowly.

 

[pnillyg]

Where it extracts or powdered leaf ?

Powdered leaf was ime so easy to taper and get off.
Kratom>GHB>Alcohol, the last one is i assume one of the last Dragons.

Hardest drug I had to kick. Or i d die within my time.

Keep going and if you have left just taper.
Never lost a night of sleep even when WD-ing. B9 plant, not the super extracts.

Right now only plain leaf! Was gunna use extracts to taper or just CT this.. never been one to taper but really don’t wanna be down bad for another CT of opiates… doc says go 6,5,4,3,2,1 on the bupe but I may just go for the CT… would you recommend taper? I have everything in my toolbox from clonidine-gabapentin-lunesta-benzos and everything in between. But don’t wanna trade either

 

[pnillyg]

I usually just thug it out for 2 weeks on the floor by the fire having somebody bring me Gatorade but not sure if kratom is like that… never done it. This is a new dragon, cold turkey’d 16mg bupe with 15mg diazepam - just recently CT’d 500mg of Oc daily for 4 months (took Ibogaine). Only been on kratom for a month and I always hype myself up for this stuff to be so bad… hopefully it’s a walk in the park

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Right now only plain leaf! Was gunna use extracts to taper or just CT this.. never been one to taper but really don’t wanna be down bad for another CT of opiates… doc says go 6,5,4,3,2,1 on the bupe but I may just go for the CT… would you recommend taper? I have everything in my toolbox from clonidine-gabapentin-lunesta-benzos and everything in between. But don’t wanna trade either

Not Buprenorphine for Kratom leaf, to me that sounds ridiculous.
However Bupe does make dr. s money. Kratom doesn t.
So there is a logic for it, but not one that matters. Baldheads.

No extract s of Kratom, certainly not for a taper.
These are used to get really addicted beyond what powdered leaf could do.

No ime its easy as A B C, assuming you have surplus.
Slowly start restricting, postponing and reducing your dose.
Just feel along the way how it goes, just never raise.
Maybe keep a log if needed.

Stayin even a few days is no problem. post pone x hours.
And you may tap on your shoulder, and think well done !

The first two toolbox items are pretty usefull i hear, unless you have low BP.
Then Clonidine might be not the best. I have so i d faint probably.

 

[pnillyg]

As of now been 7 hours since last dose and last dose was 6 gs lower then normal. So only 6g tea today. We shall do this! Sometimes taper gets too long and I use gabapentin or something to help but then end up on gaba or last time clonidine which is a bizarre feeling. Just really want off but not too much pain. Worst for me is restlessness/body aches /chills

 

[pnillyg]

Best wishes and keep us posted.

I'm about to do some kratom tapering myself, but without any other drugs to help. I'll be cutting back very slowly.

May I ask how much you’re cutting back from? How long you have been taking it (this time around?) and how you cut back/at what pace?

 

[jasperkent]

May I ask how much you’re cutting back from? How long you have been taking it (this time around?) and how you cut back/at what pace?

I've been on kratom for a little over 4 years. I'm up to about 25g to 30g daily. I'll try to go down by about half a gram a day.
For me, the toughest part is busy workdays. I tend to backslide on those days because I need the energy to get through my shift.

 

[pnillyg]

I've been on kratom for a little over 4 years. I'm up to about 25g to 30g daily. I'll try to go down by about half a gram a day.
For me, the toughest part is busy workdays. I tend to backslide on those days because I need the energy to get through my shift.

May I ask how you take it? Just toss and wash? With any potentiaters? How many x per day?

 

[Didgital]

GL man I know it can be tough. You picked a hell of a day to quit imo.

 

[Keif' Richards]

Hey @pnillyg we all support you 100%. Good for you for trying to make the change. Opioids are really fun for a while. They "work" and they don't seem to cause any damage to our lives. Eventually they start causing more problems than they solve. It can be really hard to recognize this. It's even harder to to something about it. We're all proud of you. I'm sure you're gonna inspire a lot of other people, both in the Kratom-user community and in general.

My feelings on Gabapentinoids for Opioid withdrawal:

Gabapentinoids are an amazing remedy for Opioid withdrawal. Without them, I don't know if I ever would have made it; they are that important. The akathisia/restless legs are enough to make you want to amputate your legs. In my experience, Gabapentin helps most with this symptom. Being that it relieves these symptoms, it's also an effective anxiolytic/hypnotic too.

One issue people run into is the rapid onset of tolerance. Folks often need relatively high doses to mitigate their symptoms. In my experience, you have 5-7 days in which Gabapentinoids can be truly effective before tolerance causes rapidly diminishing returns.

For this reason, I usually tell people to try cutting their dose hard for a period of 3-4 days while the Gabapentinoids will be their most effective. Opioids and Gabapentinoids are not cross-tolerant in any way that we know of, thus you can heavily use the Gabapentinoids while also proceeding through withdrawal normally.

You aren't going to be completely done withdrawing after 3-4 days, though that should be the worst of it. You can use your other available drugs however they work best for you. Gabapentinoids are the ones you have to strategize with.

My philosophy for withdrawing at home is to use other drugs to mitigate the effects of Opioid withdrawal, while ceasing their use prior to the development of any kind of significant dependence.

This is usually a 10-14 day period in which you use these other substances within reason. Once your withdrawal is over, you stop using the Benzodiazepines and the Gabapentinoids and ideally stop using Opioids altogether. If this was unclear or you have any questions, feel free to ask.

 

[pnillyg]

great advice I’m going to take it. Going to feel it out day by day but yes for me the key is to also not use anything prior to detoxing with them because I want them to be 100% effective and I’ve be using diazepam about 2 x per week.

Hey @pnillyg we all support you 100%. Good for you for trying to make the change. Opioids are really fun for a while. They "work" and they don't seem to cause any damage to our lives. Eventually they start causing more problems than they solve. It can be really hard to recognize this. It's even harder to to something about it. We're all proud of you. I'm sure you're gonna inspire a lot of other people, both in the Kratom-user community and in general.

My feelings on Gabapentinoids for Opioid withdrawal:

Gabapentinoids are an amazing remedy for Opioid withdrawal. Without them, I don't know if I ever would have made it; they are that important. The akathisia/restless legs are enough to make you want to amputate your legs. In my experience, Gabapentin helps most with this symptom. Being that it relieves these symptoms, it's also an effective anxiolytic/hypnotic too.

One issue people run into is the rapid onset of tolerance. Folks often need relatively high doses to mitigate their symptoms. In my experience, you have 5-7 days in which Gabapentinoids can be truly effective before tolerance causes rapidly diminishing returns.

For this reason, I usually tell people to try cutting their dose hard for a period of 3-4 days while the Gabapentinoids will be their most effective. Opioids and Gabapentinoids are not cross-tolerant in any way that we know of, thus you can heavily use the Gabapentinoids while also proceeding through withdrawal normally.

You aren't going to be completely done withdrawing after 3-4 days, though that should be the worst of it. You can use your other available drugs however they work best for you. Gabapentinoids are the ones you have to strategize with.

My philosophy for withdrawing at home is to use other drugs to mitigate the effects of Opioid withdrawal, while ceasing their use prior to the development of any kind of significant dependence.

This is usually a 10-14 day period in which you use these other substances within reason. Once your withdrawal is over, you stop using the Benzodiazepines and the Gabapentinoids and ideally stop using Opioids altogether. If this was unclear or you have any questions, feel free to ask.

Also wondering how much gabapentin you have used for detoxification and how long you use it for? Don’t want a gnarly gabapentin dependency.

 

[pnillyg]

November 5th 2024

6am - 4g Green Maeng Da (capsules)

7:10am - 2g Green Maeng Da (tossed)

 

[Keif' Richards]

Hey @pnillyg

Gabapentin (Neurontin) is going to be most effective for 3-5 days, especially when you're using moderate-heavy doses like those required to mitigate withdrawal. However, you're using Kratom, so you're not doing Cold Turkey.

For someone withdrawing from Heroin or Fentanyl, I'd say anything up to 4,800mg per day for 3 days if that's what it takes. This is the maximum prescribed dosage FYI.

For someone in your situation, who is dealing with a more minor situation, I would say start with 900mg in 3 divided doses. The lower the dose, the longer you will be able to extend the beneficial effects of the drug. A person using heavy like above-posted is going to typically hit a wall on day 3-4 in which the benefits drop precipitously. By day 7 they could be completely without benefit.

For someone using doses like I've described for you, you could probably get good benefit from Gabapentin for a 10-14 days before you hit the same wall. I'm not saying Gabapentin in general is only effective for this short period. I'm saying that when we are in withdrawal, we typically need higher dosages more frequently than someone with neuropathy would need.

It would probably take a person at least 1 and probably 2 months of using Gabapentinoids before they develop a significant dependence/withdrawal. If they are used for short periods of time, they're safe and don't tend to cause complications. This is why they have become mainstays of the withdrawal process.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

As of now been 7 hours since last dose and last dose was 6 gs lower then normal. So only 6g tea today. We shall do this! Sometimes taper gets too long and I use gabapentin or something to help but then end up on gaba or last time clonidine which is a bizarre feeling. Just really want off but not too much pain. Worst for me is restlessness/body aches /chills

If you are motivated enough these can be countered/ or made less noticeable. By activity.
Especially restlessness and chills. Maybe it will even distract from body aches.

6 gram a day ? That is doable for taper. Used about 15 gram a day [about 5 x 3 gr. doses], but high quality.
Red Vein Borneo is quit sedative vs Maeng Da.
And stronger then the best i now can get, online national quality is lower then direct from the source.
Soon it ll be illegal in EU i presume going by Smartshop owner rumours. .

 

[pnillyg]

Yesterday I ended up smoking a ton of ganja and now I’m at the 24hr mark no Kratom. Like I said before I’ve gone cold turkey on 500+ mg of Oxy, 16+mg of buprenorphine two separate times. With both times also including a minimum of 15+mg of diazepam and or clonazepam. I’ve done bad detoxes. Medically, spiritually (Ibogaine) and at home. I just get scared when it’s something I’ve never experienced which in this situation is kratom. I was using it for a month. Started at 3-4gs now up to 10-15g.

So far today:

2:56am - 300mg gabapentin

8:00am - 300mg gabapentin, 5mg Adderall XR

12:16pm - 30ml DayQuil, 300mg gabapentin

12:56pm - 2mg THC / 4mg CBD edible

4:56pm - 1mg Clonazepam (a lot of external stress not due to the withdrawl)

6:46pm - 30ml dayquil, 300mg gabapentin

9:26 - THC Vape, Pepto