Diet Kombucha brewer's over here?

[emkee_reinvented]

Bottled my second brew today.

The method I use is based on maybe outdated info. So any improvements are welcome.

Basicly I take a mix of 1/2 Black Tea like Pu Ehr and 1/2 Yellow and or White Tea. The last 2 I perform a cold brew on by soaking it in Kombucha. As the antioxidant's in these tea's are not heat resistant but like acidity.

This is all added to good Still water. That is not cooked to preserve the air you would otherwise loose by boiling. Bacteria love air!

The only water I boil is the water that contains various combo's of sugars. Like Dried Sugarcane juice, Arenga or Coconut Palm sugar. And the water for the Black Tea. When it is all room temp mix and slide in the SCOBY. Add some starter fluid, I prefer the top layer of the Kombucha as that is where the beneficial bacteria recide. As near to the air as possible as they need it. the lower you go the more yeasty it get's.

1st brew tasted nice minimal 5 weeks, this 2nd is somewhat sweeter, 4 weeks might be to short. These are brewed in glass, but readed wood casket's are even better.

To the point: the best brew I ever did was with this method. But due to early labor. Bottling was of no importance. And was done 6 weeks or longer then the usual 4/ 5 weeks.

During this time I had 2 brew's simultanious a normal (control) one with everything cooked and the coldwater brew. This last one had the best taste my Kombucha ever had. And while being quite acidic, Ph 3, it tasted not sour at all. Nor sweet like my last 4 wk brew. It was perfect.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

4 week's is probably to short to produce a proper Kombucha. Did taste good though just a bit on the sweet side.

No clue what my usual fermentation time was. Prob 5 weeks at least.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Another question. Is brewing of Black tea necessary for bringing out the antioxidant's. Or should i do a cold brew on that to?

If anyone knows something about Black Tea, I am using Pu Ehr, and the way the antioxidant's behave please share. I be doing some researching on the subject myself.

The Green Tea and heat is well documented. But I have never looked into Black. If there is no info against it I'll make it and drink it.

"In black tea, and oolong, during fermentation while making these teas, catechins are converted to theaflavins – theaflavin (TF1), theaflavin-3-gallate (TF2A), theaflavin-3′-gallate (TF2B) and theaflavin-3,3′-digallate (TF3). As with catechins, these also possess antioxidant properties."

"Black tea contains antioxidants (although fewer than green tea). To release them most effectively, the tea needs to be brewed at a temperature near boiling (194 F) because of oxidation."

So boil it is.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Any thought's anyone on the actual ideal fermenting time.

21 day's come on that is 3 weeks, my best brew was at least 6 week's.

Continuous brewing sounds interesting as you get a build up of whatever is in Kombucha we want.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

According to this my super sugar's are not doing the bacteria any good.

Way back when I was brewing I was also adding pure dextrose. At times, looking back that was probably better then the Gula Java. Which seem to benefit the Yeast and by so kill the Bacteria.

It seem's crystal sugar is the better option. And not the pure expensive healthier ones. Wow.

Titration of sugar, how do you do that?, that and Oxygen in the water are my focus points for the next brew.

 

[SunriseChampion]

I don't think my old man ever brews for more than a week before bottling. He's had other ferments going for up to a couple months....don't think they were kombucha though. It's hard to tell with the guy. He's like some wizard with all the rando stuff he's always cooking up, brewing, baking, etc.

I have to ask, because if it is a week or so only then I can't say his concoctions are a miss. They've got plenty of the good stuff.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

I don't think my old man ever brews for more than a week before bottling. He's had other ferments going for up to a couple months....don't think they were kombucha though. It's hard to tell with the guy. He's like some wizard with all the rando stuff he's always cooking up, brewing, baking, etc.

I have to ask, because if it is a week or so only then I can't say his concoctions are a miss. They've got plenty of the good stuff.

Is it a gelatine like pancake or are it more like little beads.

The last are more akin to Kefir, GingerBeerplant or Tibiscos?

 

[tired of crap]

I helped a buddy start his kombucha business here and I brewed for him for about a year before it turned into a gong show lol and I bailed... along the way he taught me some of his tricks of the trade. And I’ll share some here

He used organic cane sugar, only because of the whole natural organic fad -thanks hippies lol. However, he mentioned that it was subpar when compared to more refined sugars - as the scoby is better able to utiliZe the energy without all the extra crap in there.

Hes now using the cold brew technique... and honestly I haven’t spoke with him since I left (rather abruptly tbh lol), so I can’t speak as to why but I’m assuming it’s in part due to the whole raw food kick... but it’s also in part due to polyphenol loss when brewing. That’s why we were always mindful of temperature (depending on the type of tea used, higher for black, lower for green) and technique (Use a pot where the tea forms a solid crust on top) when brewing.

He recognized that boiling the water drove off air. So he only used enough water for the brew so that he could aerate the rest (add the sugar to the remaining water and either stir or use some other way to aerate it while the tea brews).

We also used the continuous brewing method. Taking off enough starter fluid before flavouring at bottling time. (Let this ferment for the duration of the primary ferment.) We wouldn’t use the pump after the tea was added, just stir. Then add the starter, stir and cover.

Primary fermentation times were only a week. Secondary was only 4 to 10 days on avg (depending on the juice added for flavouring).

Seems that’s all I can think of for now. Hope it helps.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Primary fermentation times were only a week. Secondary was only 4 to 10 days on avg (depending on the juice added for flavouring).

That's consistent with how my old man does it. He also uses refined sugar. I think all the cookbooks he has mention that as being the best to use.

@emkee_reinvented ...it's a pancake and a half. The guy fries them up sometimes, makes weird sashimi out of them. He's got loads of SCOBYs.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

That's consistent with how my old man does it. He also uses refined sugar. I think all the cookbooks he has mention that as being the best to use.

@emkee_reinvented ...it's a pancake and a half. The guy fries them up sometimes, makes weird sashimi out of them. He's got loads of SCOBYs.

Got some refined cane sugar. But he actually eats the culture, the 'pancake'.

Sent me the recipe!

 

[emkee_reinvented]

I helped a buddy start his kombucha business here and I brewed for him for about a year before it turned into a gong show lol and I bailed... along the way he taught me some of his tricks of the trade. And I’ll share some here

He used organic cane sugar, only because of the whole natural organic fad -thanks hippies lol. However, he mentioned that it was subpar when compared to more refined sugars - as the scoby is better able to utiliZe the energy without all the extra crap in there.

Hes now using the cold brew technique... and honestly I haven’t spoke with him since I left (rather abruptly tbh lol), so I can’t speak as to why but I’m assuming it’s in part due to the whole raw food kick... but it’s also in part due to polyphenol loss when brewing. That’s why we were always mindful of temperature (depending on the type of tea used, higher for black, lower for green) and technique (Use a pot where the tea forms a solid crust on top) when brewing.

He recognized that boiling the water drove off air. So he only used enough water for the brew so that he could aerate the rest (add the sugar to the remaining water and either stir or use some other way to aerate it while the tea brews).

We also used the continuous brewing method. Taking off enough starter fluid before flavouring at bottling time. (Let this ferment for the duration of the primary ferment.) We wouldn’t use the pump after the tea was added, just stir. Then add the starter, stir and cover.

Primary fermentation times were only a week. Secondary was only 4 to 10 days on avg (depending on the juice added for flavouring).

Seems that’s all I can think of for now. Hope it helps.

Certainly helpful

The top layer of the fluid is said to contain the most of the beneficial bacteria. As they need Oxygen. So with some selection I assume the balance between yeast an bacteria can be manipulated this way.

Like cold brew saves the unfermented tea's antioxidant's, which is in a way manipulating the end product.

I read that its better to give the sugar's in three stages rather then in on go. The way I was doing it till now.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

He recognized that boiling the water drove off air. So he only used enough water for the brew so that he could aerate the rest (add the sugar to the remaining water and either stir or use some other way to aerate it while the tea brews).

What is a good way to aerate the cold water you are not gonna cook ?

Stirring?

 

[SunriseChampion]

Got some refined cane sugar. But he actually eats the culture, the 'pancake'.

Sent me the recipe!

He legit just makes like schnitzels from it by breading whole SCOBYs and frying them up, for example.

I'll ask him if he does anything else with them and how.

I've tried a bite of the schnitzel and his sashimi (which in retrospect I think I remember him doing something with vinegar to it). The texture almost made me puke, but have at it! He loves eating them.

 

[tired of crap]

@emkee_reinvented
Yes, we would add the sugar and the starter in halves. Ie fill the fermentation vessel up with say 5/8ths the water, add half the sugar and and starter and aerate. We used an inline pump but at home I just stir (you’ll need a large enough vessel to allow for proper stirring).

While this is going, bring 2/8ths the water to temp for your brew. When the brews done, strain and add to the sugar water. Then add the remaining sugar, stir and then add the second half of starter. Finally add the rest of the water.

(The numbers are simply for illustration purposes but) I believe the idea is that by cooling the brew first and adding it to only half the starter the temperature of the tea should be cool enough that it won’t effect the culture due to the larger heat capacity of the greater volume.

And the thoughts behind adding the second half of the starter are similar to what you have above (greater availability of oxygen for a good portion of the scoby).

Also of note, the shape of the fermentation is thought to have an effect on a number of things - due to the varying amounts of surface area. At home I use a 30L wine pail lol and cover it with muslin

 

[emkee_reinvented]

@emkee_reinvented
Yes, we would add the sugar and the starter in halves. Ie fill the fermentation vessel up with say 5/8ths the water, add half the sugar and and starter and aerate. We used an inline pump but at home I just stir (you’ll need a large enough vessel to allow for proper stirring).

While this is going, bring 2/8ths the water to temp for your brew. When the brews done, strain and add to the sugar water. Then add the remaining sugar, stir and then add the second half of starter. Finally add the rest of the water.

(The numbers are simply for illustration purposes but) I believe the idea is that by cooling the brew first and adding it to only half the starter the temperature of the tea should be cool enough that it won’t effect the culture due to the larger heat capacity of the greater volume.

And the thoughts behind adding the second half of the starter are similar to what you have above (greater availability of oxygen for a good portion of the scoby).

Also of note, the shape of the fermentation is thought to have an effect on a number of things - due to the varying amounts of surface area. At home I use a 30L wine pail lol and cover it with muslin

So in a nutshell. The wider the vessel top the better.

Cold brew the unfermented Tea's in starter fluid. Fermented Tea's in boiling water. I used to let it seep at least twice as long as i would for my own use as tea. 1/3 sugar in boiled water, stir till its in solution.

When cooled with the added still water added. Stir to areanate. Add starter and Kombucha culture. While keepin some room for the 2nd and 3rd sugar water in week 2 and 3. As the level will rise. Obvious


Thanks

You measure Ph? I did back then to aim for a 3.

 

[tired of crap]

I never bothered to measure pH at home. But when I was with buddy we tried to keep it between 3.5-4.5

 

[emkee_reinvented]

He legit just makes like schnitzels from it by breading whole SCOBYs and frying them up, for example.

I'll ask him if he does anything else with them and how.

I've tried a bite of the schnitzel and his sashimi (which in retrospect I think I remember him doing something with vinegar to it). The texture almost made me puke, but have at it! He loves eating them.

Tell him I think he is really hardcore.

Like eating a baked Yellyfish. You know I used to get shivers from just touching the Scoby.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Ready and set over 6 liter's. With an sugar gift in 7 day's planned.

my philosophy for using Cocos sugar was the Nitrogen content. Wherever I got it from ? But the bacteria in my reasoning would benefit. Weird its the other way around. Maybe a certain Cane to wholesome sugar ratio would be optimal.

I'll try to dig up that info on the bacteria needing Nitrogen.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17267978/

This is better, they fix nitrogen from the air?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_fixation

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Well since my brew before and now the last also. There is brown (dark) seamingly death tissue sticking to certain area's on one of the pancake's (or scoby), on the under side . Probably caused by yeast, my guess.

I am tossing it out after this. And will add a pic in a few minute's, when kitty is satisfied with being petted.

any idea what is going on, never had this in the year's I brewed. And it is the original that came in the mail that behaves like this.

There is no mold on the surface. 10 days into the brew btw.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Looks normal to me, but I'm no expert...I just drink the stuff.

@tired of crap ?