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[Ketamine Subthread] The K-Hole

Yeah, it's unique to K because some fucking teenager made up the term "K-hole" 10 years ago and now everyone in the internet uses it. It's like Tim Leary coining the term "ego-death" for taking a high dose of acid 50 years ago. Now every teenage kid has got to say "I had an ego-death dude" or he feels he won't sound hardcore in his trip report.

I'm just pointing out there isn't a "hole" that you go down no matter how much K you take. It's a meaningless and misleading term for taking a high dose of K.

Jeez - every teenager who ever takes K now comes on the board and says "I didn't go down a hole, did I do it wrong dude?". Lets try and stop this bullshit before it goes on for another 20 years.
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That is the most pedantic thing I have ever heard. You may disagree with the term, but it is obviously not meaningless. I don't like a lot of words people use, not restricted to drugs. Do you see me complaining about it on some message board?

Only on bluelight.
 
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I've had enough K to stun a charging bull elephant and I've never experienced a K hole. It's like most drugs - the more you take the more intense the experience. But you never go down a fucking hole unless you have a very vivid imagination and want to believe you're going down a hole.
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For me, a K-hole is something you can't reach with a high dose of ketamine alone. You need sensory deprivation, preferably a bed in a dark room, naked and uncovered, with either headphones and music or no sound at all. In this setting, and with a dose of 250mg+, and the right mindset (yeah, I think you have to want it, I don't see why that's a bad thing), I have experienced a state that I can recognise as a k-hole, and feel comfortable describing as such. A state of intense bodily sensations, flying and twisting and shifting. Loss of ego, loss of perception of time, entity contact, the impression of transcendent noesis. For me, this state really is qualitatively different to a "non-hole" ketamine experience- in fact, I do not find ketamine to be worthwhile, generally, except in pursuit of this state. Perhaps you have never experienced anything you would want to describe as a k-hole- I think that it is risky to generalise to the experiences of others. Presumably, you have never had a religious experience on mushrooms, nor would you have one at any dose. To conclude that mushrooms can never facilitate a religious experience, though, is clearly a mistake. YMMV.
 
See now this is interesting. I know many people, including myself, who have experienced the sort of state I'm talking about, the kind of breakthrough where you just don't even know what a what is until you start to come down. somewhat similar to a salvia breakthrough, but not as... uncomfortable. Never heard of people who apparently can't experience these breakthroughs until now. May I ask your ROAs?
 
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I have to disagree with some of these responses. A k hole is not just 'being on k'. It's when you get the balance just right and your body is unconscious but your mind is fully conscious, but in no way connected to your body or the outside world...so it's just your mine all alone..which allows it to unlock its processing power to do pretty much whatever you want...it's like a holodeck on star trek...or a very lucid dream
 
For me it's always been almost purely about dose and ROA. If I inject 100-125mg of good K intramuscularly without any tolerance, I will pretty much undoubtedly have what can be described as an "out of body experience," though it really goes beyond words. Set and setting can affect the trip, definitely, but in the end it all comes down to getting a high concentration in your body fast, just like DMT, for me at least. So on one level, yes, a k-hole is "just being on k," but who the fuck cares? It draws a worthwhile distinction between regular, lucid doses and the insane breakthroughs.
 
when I came home this morning (had some speed many hours before, a few beers and copious amounts of ganja) I decided to create some personal evidence on this topic.
I've been doing some K (and MXE) in my life but never pushed it to the limits.

I have no idea how much I took as I started with increasing bumps. eyeballed the last ones when already royally fucked but the total dose was probably between 100-150mg (snorted).
as a conclusion I have to say: there is a unique, intriguing and very intense qualitative shift in the effects of ketamine, resembling only DMT in intensity and strength. in some ways even exceeding it.
I was lying on my back in my bed, no music, no lights, naked.
the first "new effect" was a very strong sensation of shifting proportions (sensation of being very small, of hands being huge, of my my brain shrinking in my head. stuff like that..), then the familiar mandala and flying through space imagery turned more and more into "the light". this state already reached DMT-like intensity with the only possible actions being breathing while sighing in awe and bliss.
but the real qualitative shift was yet to come: when the out of body state hit me I was severely shocked for a short time and snapped out of it several times. when I let go the experience was completely immersive und novel. there is just no physical body anymore. no breathing, no heartbeat, just consciousness. free floating in space. it feels and looks like (accompanying visual activity is very impressive) consciousness is folding itself into itself into itself, finally reaching the core, the essence. the state feels very holy and special.
the state (and following afterglow) allows you to juggle mental concepts, emotions, (contradicting) perspectives in a "meta" way. resembling constellation work in systemic therapy but able to fully immerse into the different personas/perspecitves. on the way down I called a close friend via headphones (sensation of him actually sitting in my head) and it allowed my to analyze shared problems with relationships, drug (ab)use, spirituality, life in general and our outlook as soon-to-be psychologists between aspirations and doubts (fueled by neurotic patterns) in specific...iirc he caught a severe contact high. :D <3

the whole experience was very, very lucid and analytical, I was fully conscious of my state (like: "I'm on K. it took a lot of it. this must be the hole they were arguing about in bluelight..."), I remember most and not only in a semantic way but concrete in form and content and in chronological order...dose was obviously on the edge of "the hole" (or whatever you may call it. does absolutely not matter imo.) as I could voluntarily snap out of it - always thinking "oh no, don't waste any second of this state!" :D
I guess I discovered a new perspective on and respect for ketamine. I guess once you've felt it's true power it's just not the same anymore...it is not a toy to play around with.

I slept a few hours and was/am still impressed enough to write this report. hope I could provide a few insights for other keta-apprentices... :)


edit; just remembered: when full effects kicked in I felt a deep urge to constantly mumble "reinigung, reinigung, reinigung..." which roughly translates to "purification", "cleansing" sensu analytical psychology. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo_(alchemy) pretty much reflects the current state of my psyche. impressive. (please excuse psychobabble... ;) )
 
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I think the K-hole is for kids, what you really need to be aiming for is what is known as the A-hole. With experience, the correct dosage, extra-special K and a little lube, the A-hole is where Gods revelations are truly revealed.
 
Never Knows Best said:
Pretty sure there's a few H.P. Lovecraft stories about this (even if recreational dissociatives were not yet invented).
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Even if they had, he wouldn't have partaken - he was strictly teetotal. Which makes this even more amazing:

Gilman's dreams consisted largely in plunges through limitless abysses of inexplicably coloured twilight and baffingly disordered sound; abysses whose material and gravitational properties, and whose relation to his own entity, he could not even begin to explain. He did not walk or climb, fly or swim, crawl or wriggle; yet always experienced a mode of motion partly voluntary and partly involuntary. Of his own condition he could not well judge, for sight of his arms, legs, and torso seemed always cut off by some odd disarrangement of perspective; but he felt that his physical organization and faculties were somehow marvellously transmuted and obliquely projected - though not without a certain grotesque relationship to his normal proportions and properties.

The abysses were by no means vacant, being crowded with indescribably angled masses of alien-hued substance, some of which appeared to be organic while others seemed inorganic. A few of the organic objects tended to awake vague memories in the back of his mind, though he could form no conscious idea of what they mockingly resembled or suggested. In the later dreams he began to distinguish separate categories into which the organic objects appeared to be divided, and which seemed to involve in each case a radically different species of conduct-pattern and basic motivation. Of these categories one seemed to him to include objects slightly less illogical and irrelevant in their motions than the members of the other categories.

All the objects - organic and inorganic alike - were totally beyond description or even comprehension. Gilman sometimes compared the inorganic matter to prisms, labyrinths, clusters of cubes and planes, and Cyclopean buildings; and the organic things struck him variously as groups of bubbles, octopi, centipedes, living Hindoo idols, and intricate arabesques roused into a kind of ophidian animation. Everything he saw was unspeakably menacing and horrible; and whenever one of the organic entities appeared by its motions to be noticing him, he felt a stark, hideous fright which generally jolted him awake. Of how the organic entities moved, he could tell no more than of how he moved himself. In time he observed a further mystery - the tendency of certain entities to appear suddenly out of empty space, or to disappear totally with equal suddenness. The shrieking, roaring confusion of sound which permeated the abysses was past all analysis as to pitch, timbre or rhythm; but seemed to be synchronous with vague visual changes in all the indefinite objects, organic and inorganic alike. Gilman had a constant sense of dread that it might rise to some unbearable degree of intensity during one or another of its obscure, relentlessly inevitable fluctuations.

H.P. Lovecraft - 'The Dreams in the Witch House', 1932
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Merged K-hole threads...

for the record I define a K-hole as a ketamine-induced state in which there is increasingly inhibited external stimulation. Any part of the state where there is "full dissociation" (note how the boundaries are subjective) but not anaesthesia. Whether the part that produces signficant memory loss counts, IDK. I think it is a distinctive state to have a completely internal experience whilst not being asleep, awake, sleepwalking, etc. Unique, in the category OOBE / lucid dreaming.

It's a useful metaphor colloquially IMO, but it does not help if multiple people try to decide on only one person's success or failure to truly achieve this state. Just let the person himself judge, and generally match our definitions - then just finetune descriptions ad hoc.
 
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What I'm getting is that "K-hole" means "taking a high dose of Ketamine".
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i haven't followed the thread
but a k-hole is not taking a high dose
it is pretty much the equivalent of the dmt breakthrough, except that the transition is more progressive

there's no need for a definition
it's a state which, when you've reached it, you just know (when you come back) that you've reached it, without needing any explanation

has anyone got any pictures of a k-hole? a picture speaks a thousand words.
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vision-skateboards-gator-model-1984.jpg


but you'd need more than 1000 words to try to describe a k-hole
 
I've never had a DMT like experience on K per se

but i've had mind movies where I was experiencing first person the video game i'd been playing for the past two weeks and it was pretty incredible. I'd like to get to the DMT level eventually, I have a friend who has broken through on DMT directly before going into a K-hole a few times and he totally made me wanna try it so badly lol
 
The reason for me that the term k-hole exists is because of the whole drug 'rabbit hole' theme in general and also because of the sensations that occur when it happens. There's definitely a difference between being k'd out, k-holing and taking too much for you to handle/blacking out. Looking at it that way reminds me a bit of the DXM plateaus, but I haven't much experience with DXM personally.

But as for the name behind it, easy way to explain it is to just k-hole. Before I k-hole I get this real sensation of slipping from reality, my legs feel like they are rising, my vision begins to go down the 'hole', as in it's almost like everything is dissolving from the sides before me while my perception changes and to me it looks like I'm looking at the outside world through a small gap while travelling further down the hole.

Once you get there though it certainly isn't a hole! ...I've noticed that as the k tolerance rises though it becomes more of an attempt to 'hole' rather than actually manage it. Also, I can't ever k-hole properly unless I'm sitting in a dark room, music playing low and no other disturbances. If I attempt to khole at a party or with friends, I wont - at least anywhere near as easily dose wise, I might black out but I wont k-hole. Ketamine really seems to get affected by what's going on around you for me, a person moving about the room or attempting to talk to someone seems to really stop it for me.

Each to their own though, could easily say a k trip. But don't people talk of a 2c-b hole also? Haven't dosed high enough for that though, but certainly noticed how things get a bit more out of body at higher doses.
 
I have iv'd around 200 mg several times and never went into a hole. My girl plus my other friends i was doing it with went into holes and i could tell, they also banged it. Idk why i've never been in one, very confusing :[ I figured it could be from when I used to use dxm frequently at high doses, so the feeling was familiar and it made it harder to break through. One time i foolishly took 4 boxes of triple c and was stuck in a whole for hours, very enjoyable but I wouldn't dare taking that high of a dose of dxm again let alone using tripple c's. I was at a low point in my life, very depressed, but damn that trip was amazing in everyway possible.
 
i was so scared of ketamine growing up until i went to a music fest and my friend who is like 8years older than me goes dude im geting ketamine tonight this was the first day of a four day fest i ended up trying it finnaly and the seccond time k-holed and didnt eve know it when i described it to my friend he was like oh dude you k-holed a bit and i laughed i feared it for so long andnow i look at it as the best experience i did it again in an rv while it was driving and went into a lucid state where an alien spoke to me. if your afraid to do ketamine dont be it is such an amazing experience unless you dont wanna feel disconnected from things lol but overall ketamine has been some great expereinces those two in particular it is something that you haved to be timid otherwise you could have a shit experience and not enjoy k
 
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