Dissociatives Ketamine, but without the side effects

[scabbard]

Are there any drugs like ketamine (in terms of effects) that don't have the same negative side effects (physical health issues, risk of addiction, permatolerance, etc.)?

I will be trying ketamine next week. I'm planning on using it in conjunction with 5MeO-DMT in small amounts to make for a smoother experience. It's a trial, we'll see how it goes. I've heard of others doing that combo with success. If it works, I'd rather not use ketamine on the reg because I know that there are so many risks. I was wondering if I could replace it with something similar.

The most physically "dangerous" medicine I've ever worked with is MDMA, and I still think that's pretty safe if you're hydrated during the experience, and you don't do it more than once a month. But ketamine is a different story from what I've read, so I'm approaching with extreme caution.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

I wish there was but no not really.
However if you have the ability to not do it often then Ketamine is quite benign when it comes to harmful side effects.

Even once per month would probably not be very bad longterm tbh.
But imo every 2-3months would be an optimal frequency if one wants to indulge somewhat high doses for a evening.

My experience with Ketamines addictive qualities is that it triggers a urge for a few days up to a week after dosing.
So if i just do it one night then i will usually want to do it again for a few days afterwards.
But if im able to resist it for a week then that urge goes away and i barely think about it.

So i tend to just buy small amounts and make sure i use it all up in the time ive planned to indulge it.
Usually a day or two then do my best to stay away for at least a month or two.

 

[Asante]

Look into Memantine for a superior mild dissociative.

check out my site on it, qv my signature.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

Look into Memantine for a superior mild dissociative.

check out my site on it, qv my signature.

Forgot about that one, really nice stuff if you dont try to go deep.
Can last for days so be very careful with dosing.

Very few if any real side effects at low doses, great for mood enhancement or general anti anxiety.
Also mixes great with K, took some memantine in the morning then got a gram of K later in the day.
Really enhanced the Ket high and every bump felt stronger and lasted longer then by itself.

 

[Asante]

Ashwagandha is great herbal medicine, as is Bacopa monnieri, but all in the right dose and measure.

 

[scabbard]

Hmmm, memantine, sounds interesting, though it seems kind of weird to be taking a drug that's used for the treatment of symptoms of Alzheimer's disease. I wonder how you even get a prescription for that.

Also didn't know how potentially potent Ashwaganda could be. I had always thought of it as one of those natural supplements that was relatively mild in its effects.

If ketamine has the potential for serious physical side effects with frequent use, how do the clinics that administer it for depression treatments deal with this? ChatGPT says that the entire treatment protocol can be 8-10 infusions over the period of just a couple weeks, and then potentially more afterward as a kind of maintenance treatment after the initial higher dosing. Wouldn't there be serious risk for bladder damage?

 

[chris_p]

Hmmm, memantine, sounds interesting, though it seems kind of weird to be taking a drug that's used for the treatment of symptoms of Alzheimer's disease. I wonder how you even get a prescription for that.

Also didn't know how potentially potent Ashwaganda could be. I had always thought of it as one of those natural supplements that was relatively mild in its effects.

If ketamine has the potential for serious physical side effects with frequent use, how do the clinics that administer it for depression treatments deal with this? ChatGPT says that the entire treatment protocol can be 8-10 infusions over the period of just a couple weeks, and then potentially more afterward as a kind of maintenance treatment after the initial higher dosing. Wouldn't there be serious risk for bladder damage?

It's legal and doesnt require prescription at least where I am. Compared to ketamine though memantine was a much different experience for me. The visuals were far more intense and it had a much 'darker' theme to it and I was in a full hole-like state for near 10 hours, but what makes it great is when it starts to wear off the next day. I wouldn't really compare it to ketamine. Since it's not something that's easy to use often or abuse I would say its much safer on the bladder but I have no evidence to back this. I mostly enjoy the mania it produces after it wears off

 

[Bitchniggaz]

Hmmm, memantine, sounds interesting, though it seems kind of weird to be taking a drug that's used for the treatment of symptoms of Alzheimer's disease. I wonder how you even get a prescription for that.

Also didn't know how potentially potent Ashwaganda could be. I had always thought of it as one of those natural supplements that was relatively mild in its effects.

If ketamine has the potential for serious physical side effects with frequent use, how do the clinics that administer it for depression treatments deal with this? ChatGPT says that the entire treatment protocol can be 8-10 infusions over the period of just a couple weeks, and then potentially more afterward as a kind of maintenance treatment after the initial higher dosing. Wouldn't there be serious risk for bladder damage?

Longterm permanent damage is usually something you get with longterm heavy daily use.
Sure you can get some bladder symptoms or other temporary side effects from a heavy period.
But in most cases it goes away in a few days or weeks at most.

The people who really get messed up are the ones who takes several grams per day for months on end.

Ive done Ket for well over 15years, ive had months where ive done +10grams etc.
Even some weekends where ive done well over 5grams in 2days.

But mostly i keep it to less then 1g a month with long periods with nothing.
Cant say i have any permanent bladder problems, however if i have a heavy period i will feel it abit.
Mostly in the form of frequent urination for a little while afterwards.

 

[scabbard]

Longterm permanent damage is usually something you get with longterm heavy daily use.
Sure you can get some bladder symptoms or other temporary side effects from a heavy period.
But in most cases it goes away in a few days or weeks at most.

The people who really get messed up are the ones who takes several grams per day for months on end.

Ive done Ket for well over 15years, ive had months where ive done +10grams etc.
Even some weekends where ive done well over 5grams in 2days.

But mostly i keep it to less then 1g a month with long periods with nothing.
Cant say i have any permanent bladder problems, however if i have a heavy period i will feel it abit.
Mostly in the form of frequent urination for a little while afterwards.

OK that's good to know. Your dosage frequency is far higher than that of the clinics, and the clinics are higher than what I'd be using K for. I'm hoping that a light dose is sufficient for just calming my body, I was thinking 20-30mg. I'll have to see if that's sufficient but I'm not planning on holing.

 

[Generation *DMT*]

No personal attacks.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

OK that's good to know. Your dosage frequency is far higher than that of the clinics, and the clinics are higher than what I'd be using K for. I'm hoping that a light dose is sufficient for just calming my body, I was thinking 20-30mg. I'll have to see if that's sufficient but I'm not planning on holing.

You will be fine with that kind of protocol for sure.
I also prefer subhole doses nowadays but i like to make a longer session out of it.
So i usually do 50mg shots once or tvice per hour for an evening or sometimes longer.
Love binging movies or series while being at that medium level Ket state.

I switched to IM about 10years ago, that also helps to keep the doses lower and more exact.

Since you are planing on doing light doses i would recomend making nasal spray.
You can buy empty bottles made for it and then just mix the Ket with some water contaning sodium.
Not sure how long it will be sterile in solution though.
But you could probably make smaller batches and store it in the fridge.

The nasal spray will be more effective then snorting pure powder.
Also easier to get a more even dose.

 

[scabbard]

Actually I have the nasal spray bottles, and I have simple saline solution as well. Does ketamine dissolve easily in simple saline?

In the past I've actually done a test to determine how much each spray dispensed (I weighed the sprayer before and after each spray). Over 20 trials or so, I think it ranged from 100 - 180mg per spray. So not super consistent.

As far as dosing goes, what do you think I could expect to experience with 25mg of ketamine (I'm 145 lbs)? And if that's not enough, what is the protocol for re-dosing (e.g. with something like acid, I know the tolerance builds extremely quickly - based on your description it doesn't sound like that's an issue with ketamine)? Is ketamine dosage fairly linear, or is it like 2C-B, where each additional mg is more potent?

 

[Mjäll]

Ket has a way more forgiving use frequency limit than MDMA

It's not more dangerous than MDMA. However, the potential dangers are very different. It affects your bladder negatively rather than your mood and brain health.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

Actually I have the nasal spray bottles, and I have simple saline solution as well. Does ketamine dissolve easily in simple saline?

In the past I've actually done a test to determine how much each spray dispensed (I weighed the sprayer before and after each spray). Over 20 trials or so, I think it ranged from 100 - 180mg per spray. So not super consistent.

As far as dosing goes, what do you think I could expect to experience with 25mg of ketamine (I'm 145 lbs)? And if that's not enough, what is the protocol for re-dosing (e.g. with something like acid, I know the tolerance builds extremely quickly - based on your description it doesn't sound like that's an issue with ketamine)? Is ketamine dosage fairly linear, or is it like 2C-B, where each additional mg is more potent?

Ket tolerance builds slow but then lasts a longtime once you have it.
So redosing works very well and you can easily build up to whatever level of high you want.
I always start slow with a 30-50mg dose and then refill about every 20-60mins depending on how high i want to be atm.
However i have some tolerance so my dosage is suited for me.

Saline solution is perfect for mixing btw, thats what i meant but didnt remember the term.
Ket will mix well up to 50mg per ml in cold water.
You can probably get in 100mg per ml if you warm it up.
If it crashes out of the solution you can just add more saline solution after.

 

[scabbard]

I guess 100mg/mL would be ok, that would be about 14mg of K per spray. For low doses it'd be fine, but for higher doses you'd need to blast it many times to reach the level you'd want. Nose might get a bit sore.

 

[pixies+]

I guess 100mg/mL would be ok, that would be about 14mg of K per spray. For low doses it'd be fine, but for higher doses you'd need to blast it many times to reach the level you'd want. Nose might get a bit sore.

It will be more sore if you snort it

 

[Bitchniggaz]

It will be more sore if you snort it

Also ime it absorbs better in nasal spray form so potency per mg is higher.

 

[scabbard]

You will be fine with that kind of protocol for sure.
I also prefer subhole doses nowadays but i like to make a longer session out of it.
So i usually do 50mg shots once or tvice per hour for an evening or sometimes longer.
Love binging movies or series while being at that medium level Ket state.

I switched to IM about 10years ago, that also helps to keep the doses lower and more exact.

Since you are planing on doing light doses i would recomend making nasal spray.
You can buy empty bottles made for it and then just mix the Ket with some water contaning sodium.
Not sure how long it will be sterile in solution though.
But you could probably make smaller batches and store it in the fridge.

The nasal spray will be more effective then snorting pure powder.
Also easier to get a more even dose.

What's your protocol for an IM ketamine injection? What do you dissolve it in, and where/how do you inject it?

 

[Bitchniggaz]

What's your protocol for an IM ketamine injection? What do you dissolve it in, and where/how do you inject it?

Either saline solution or BAC water if i have it avaiable.
I have good sources for very pure Ket though.

However in the spirit of harm reduction i would recomend anyone wanting to inject to buy syringe wheel filters.
They are very cheap and is a great way to make sure whatever you inject is free from any bacteria etc.

I usually inject it around my shoulders, triceps or pecs.
If i use insulin syringes i barely feel anything while injecting.
Then in about 5mins or so the Ket hits like a brick.

 

[pixies+]

Either saline solution or BAC water if i have it avaiable.
I have good sources for very pure Ket though.

However in the spirit of harm reduction i would recomend anyone wanting to inject to buy syringe wheel filters.
They are very cheap and is a great way to make sure whatever you inject is free from any bacteria etc.

I usually inject it around my shoulders, triceps or pecs.
If i use insulin syringes i barely feel anything while injecting.
Then in about 5mins or so the Ket hits like a brick.

Out of curiosity, how far into the muscle should you go?
The first time I ever used ket was many years ago and it was IM. I was on many other substances at the time and I don’t remember feeling anything significant…but I don’t remember much about the entire situation. All I know is that my ‘friend’ passed it to me and I did it. I don’t know how much I used, what ‘kind’ it was, or anything like that.

What would a recommended dose be for someone who’s snorted several grams before but no real experience other than that?

Sorry if it’s been said already