Kanna (Sceletium Tortuosum) - I have used you for everything , you truly are magical

[p-helix]

How on earth could we explain users experiencing both euphoria and dysphoria from this herb?

Psychoactive herbs produce a range of euphoric and dysphoric states in individuals as much as psychoactive drugs.

Psychoactive drugs produce dysphoric as well as euphoric states on occasion and with some people certain drugs react badly.

The people experiencing the psychoactive effects are the individual users.

 

[5HToInfinity]

Psychoactive herbs produce a range of euphoric and dysphoric states in individuals as much as psychoactive drugs.

Psychoactive drugs produce dysphoric as well as euphoric states on occasion and with some people certain drugs react badly.

The people experiencing the psychoactive effects are the individual users.

This is very true for psychedelics especially, but not so much for other substances. All I'm saying is there must be some sort of neuropharmacological reason for this herb to have particularly variable effects. It's not like fluoxetine causes dysphoria in half its users.

 

[Xorkoth]

Actually SSRIs have a huge variance in effects, some people find them very helpful and good while many others find them to be terrible, unpleasant drugs. In some they cause suicidal or homocidal ideation. Since I understand kanna acts as an SSRI, the neuropharmacological reason may be the same or similar.

 

[crOOk]

I had to chuckle at the amphetamine crash you mentioned. Never had one of those. Regular amphetamine gets me tweaked for days, sleep is usually possible 30h after the last dose, but a week of stimulation and massively increased mood follows.

Thanks for the report though, unfortunately I have been nothing but disappointed with Kanna, have never felt anything from it.

In some they cause suicidal or homocidal ideation.

As in urges to kill homosexuals?! Got that's awful, all they do to me is completely inhibit my ability to have an orgasm. I'm so glad to be done with that stuff, lamotrigine and bupropion work a thousand times better than SSRI's and Lithium for me. But everybody is different indeed and SSRI's have saved countless lives. I hate hearing people talk shit about psychopharmaceuticals. Btw SSRI's make me instantly manic unless I am in the deepest of depressive episodes. It did cause suicidal ideation a couple of times, but only with citalopram and I am very prone to those anyway, have been since the tender age of 10.

 

[5HToInfinity]

I guess I must take a further step back to notice that substances acting on the serotonergic system seem to display higher variability in effects than substances acting on say, the dopaminergic, glutamatergic or opioid systems.

 

[plateau_connector]

This is the first time I've heard of this plant. Two questions; any potential of addiction? Someone mentioned anti-addiction qualities, id like to know if anyone has had the opposite experience? Also has anyone tried to grow it, are cutting or seeds attainable in the US. (Not requesting specific sources)

Disregard the cutting/seed question, I found what I needed. Anyone ever lay dmt on on these leaves?

 

[Xorkoth]

I doubt it would be a good idea to put DMT into them, as kanna acts as an SSRI, and those tend to reduce or block the effects of serotonergic psychedelics. A lot of people (myself included) report disliking kanna very much, so I'd give it a try from a vendor before you bother to try to grow it. Also, kanna is a succulent, it doesn't really have leaves, it's more like cactus flesh. Also, it's typically powdered and fermented to concentrate the alkaloids, which is how you'll get it if you order it from a vendor.

 

[plateau_connector]

Thanks for the info Xorkoth. SSRI's are no good for me. Glad I picked up on that before I ordered.

 

[~QuirKyNai~]

Im not totallyconvinved kanna is an SSRI...i say that because i received a 5x extract..and im currently on some rn..amd there is no pupil.dilation,which.i always get on an.ssri...having said that itsnot bad...and.u only needa tiny amount for effects.

 

[motiv311]

it has partial SSRI type effects... just like some drugs act a little bit like MAOIs.....

Kanna actually is one of those really awesome little secrets out there.... its kind of blows me away sometimes, like the euphoria can just creep up on you, , before you know it you're in a social setting and feeling NIIIICE....

mixes great with kratom, kava kava, and marijuana.....

makes adderall like twice as strong if administered at the same time, but can make you a little nauseaous if you're not careful .... .this shit it no joke.... don't fucking try to snort it (bad idea) and don't smoke it.... just swallow or chew it... and get the regular fermented leaf from a good source.

 

[aguythatlikessmoke]

I doubt it would be a good idea to put DMT into them, as kanna acts as an SSRI, and those tend to reduce or block the effects of serotonergic psychedelics. A lot of people (myself included) report disliking kanna very much, so I'd give it a try from a vendor before you bother to try to grow it. Also, kanna is a succulent, it doesn't really have leaves, it's more like cactus flesh. Also, it's typically powdered and fermented to concentrate the alkaloids, which is how you'll get it if you order it from a vendor.

I currently have very good Kanna, Sceletium Tortuosum. I order mine from South Africa , it has a very high alkaloidal content of Mesembrine and Tortuosamine. Kanna is a SRI, Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor, and it also acts as Phosphodiestarase 4 Inhibitor this can contribute to a very rapid Antidepressant effect and A rapid anxiolytic effect. It can also act on Dopamine receptors and Nicotinic receptors possibly as a partial agonist or as a releasing agent.
Effects after intake can include slight feelings of nausea, Stimulation, Transient increase of anxiety that subsides within an hour after intake. These are typically come up effects. It is very reminescent of MDMA, its like a mini natural XTC. These effects give way to a feeling of a calm stimulative nature and Euphoria.
Recently I got very good Kanna from South Africa. It was capsulated I took 4 capsules a day, that is 400mg. Everytime I after i took it i had a one hour come up with a rushy feeling, Euphoria, Stimulation and slight nausea This gives way to a mood Boost. The mood boost on kanna is very very strong, you feel good the whole day, it also boost energy levels, specifically mental energy and decreases appetite.

 

[aguythatlikessmoke]

it has partial SSRI type effects... just like some drugs act a little bit like MAOIs.....

Kanna actually is one of those really awesome little secrets out there.... its kind of blows me away sometimes, like the euphoria can just creep up on you, , before you know it you're in a social setting and feeling NIIIICE....

mixes great with kratom, kava kava, and marijuana.....

makes adderall like twice as strong if administered at the same time, but can make you a little nauseaous if you're not careful .... .this shit it no joke.... don't fucking try to snort it (bad idea) and don't smoke it.... just swallow or chew it... and get the regular fermented leaf from a good source.

I am a Kanna maniac and I am the one who started all these threads about Kanna ages ago, ahahahaha I came back on here today and people are still commenting. I am so happy about that and that kanna attracts curiosity. Kanna is one of those lesser known herbal Psychoactives, Actually I was introduced to Kanna by a local headshop several years ago where I bought powdered kanna, I have never known about it earlier either. I used it for Depression and Anxiety which I suffer from occasionally but I also like to take Kanna for its general feel good effects and its mood boosting effects which can be very strong. Now I order my Kanna capsulated from South Africa and I also still have powdered kanna laying around for occasional usage, lately im not using Kanna cause im taking Afobazole its a Russian pharmaceutical Anxiolytic. But coming back to Kanna the Kanna i got now its straight from south africa< its capsulated but sometimes i open the capsules and use it sublingually>. The colour of Kanna should be from mid brown to mildly yellow and it should have a bitter taste, this indicates good alkaloidal content. This Kanna is amazing that im currently using, It gives me a one hour rushy, feeling, with transient increase in nausea and anxiety, and some bowel movements too, This all indicates its very serotonergic after this at the 30/45 minute mark after taking it a Euphoria over comes me and one day I felt such a strong Euphoria with Kanna and a very content feeling of being Alive like all negative emotions and depressive feelings very lifted and I felt a strong Euphoria for 15 minutes this was comparable to MDMA I would even say it was better but shorter lasting and it was with a strong content feeling. The rest of the day I felt very good and in a good mood, I felt stimulated and energized the whole day but at night time I had some insomnia. Cause i took 4 capsules that day and the prescribers information with the Sceletium recommended only 1 capsule cause its very strong. One more note this thing happened after I used kanna for 1 day this was on the second day and Kanna kind of acts like SSRI but its better and it has a recreational value and euphoric effects, and it makes you better at sex it is an aphrodisiac. It increases tactile sensations. I mean Kanna is one of those life changing things to me. I Will say one thing out of all the herbals I like KANNA the most , the most hands down it beats Kratom any day for me. YOu have to get good kanna, its stimulative, euphoric, energizing, Mood boosting, aphrodisiac, its like Super St.JOHNS wwort.

 

[aguythatlikessmoke]

When I indicated Kanna acts like an SSRI , this is cause just like them Kanna has to be taken maybe for a couple of days to feel full effects usually after 2 to 3 days. It has reverse tolerance however. Kanna is Euphoric as compared to the Conventional pharmaceutical antidepressants, and it makes you feel alive it doesnt numb your emotions, it opens you up makes you feel good and it doesnt impair sexual function rather boosting it. These differences in effects indicates that Kanna doesnt act exactly like SSRI there is no comedown with Kanna and no withdrawal syndrome , I will say there is maybe some slight Psychological dependency but after using Kanna for 2 months its effects decrease and you need to take a 1 month break for tolerance to decrease again, so initially Kanna has reverse tolerance and then after 2 months it gains tolerance and no matter how much you dose the euphoric and mood boosting effects disappear this was the case with me and after taking a break for a month or two the effects reappeared . Kanna seems to act as a nonselective Serotonin reuptake inhibitor, It also acts as Phosphodiesterase 4 Inhibitor , a synthetic phosphodiesterase 4 inhibitor is Rolipram and its used for CNS disorders and inflammation and Neurological diseases . Because of this dual action Kanna has very rapid effects, also Kanna acts on Dopamine, Nicotine receptors and it seems to balance ones Neurotransmitter levels. Its awesome, but a lot of bs is sold out there, if you need a good brand of kanna or some advice ask me.

 

[aguythatlikessmoke]

Im not totallyconvinved kanna is an SSRI...i say that because i received a 5x extract..and im currently on some rn..amd there is no pupil.dilation,which.i always get on an.ssri...having said that itsnot bad...and.u only needa tiny amount for effects.

agreed and KANNA is not a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor but rather its a nonselective serotonin reuptake inhibitor, a phosphodiesterase 4 inhibitor and there are scientific articles supporting this proposed mechanism of action. It also acts on Nicotinic and Dopamine receptors. I know everything about Kanna I have used it on and off for the past 3 years.I have also read articles that people wrote who visited south africa and that tells about all the different uses kanna was used for, Kanna also has Analgesic effects. It was used by the native people during tooth extractions.
Kanna can also act as a sedative as a stimulant, The Kanna I currently have is very stimulating. The effects of kanna aka sceletium Tortuosum seem to depend on the concentration of the different alkaloids it contains and there ratios because different concentrations and ratios exert different effects. The main alkaloids are mesembrine, Mesembrenone, and Tortuosamine.Mesembrine is the SRI and PDE4 inhibitor and it is the compound responsible for Euphoric and stimulative effects. Mesembrenone is a very strong analgesic and sedative and the psychoactive effects of Tortuosamine are unknown possibly involved in the mood boost as well. There are other unknown alkaloids too, Mesembrine is very active in the mg range. Like 1 mg to 5mg will give you effects.
Kanna also has anti addictive effects and appetite suppressive effects.

 

[Xorkoth]

I just ordered some South African kanna to revisit this. I have only ever tried snorting small bits before, which I strongly disliked. I am going to try this orally when it arrives. Sounds like a nice day booster, if it works like it does for you guys.

 

[Xorkoth]

I got some of this, from south africa from a trusted vendor. Yesterday I gave it a shot... I tried 400mg sublingual first, chewed on it for a while and swallowed. I started feeling a warm glow at first, but it didn't progress much after an hour and a half. In truth it wasn't entirely comfortable. No euphoria and a sort of weird hazy feeling. I added 400mg orally, and an hour after that it got stronger. But I didn't really like it. There was no euphoria at any point. No stimulation or sedation either. It just made me feel kind of slow in the head with a somewhat anti-social element to it. I went to hang out and play music with my friend, and we had a really good jam actually, quite innovative, but I was feeling a little clumsy in my fingers. I drank some beer and it improved my situation but it also felt less good than usual and I had much more of a hangover this morning (I usually don't get hangovers at all but this morning I was sore and had a little headache). My girl came over at night and was upset about some stuff (not at me, but just about her life) and I felt like I couldn't adequately be there for her because I felt kind of out of sorts, which was a bummer. Then I had a really unsettling dream that left me shaken upon waking up, and I overslept. I feel a little low today which is very unusual for me, but it could because of a few reasons or a combination of reasons.

This experience was certainly more benign feeling than when I snorted it, but I don't think kanna is for me. I was considering trying it again today to see if the reports of better effects on subsequent days are true, but I would prefer not to feel that way today, or really, ever.

 

[aguythatlikessmoke]

I got some of this, from south africa from a trusted vendor. Yesterday I gave it a shot... I tried 400mg sublingual first, chewed on it for a while and swallowed. I started feeling a warm glow at first, but it didn't progress much after an hour and a half. In truth it wasn't entirely comfortable. No euphoria and a sort of weird hazy feeling. I added 400mg orally, and an hour after that it got stronger. But I didn't really like it. There was no euphoria at any point. No stimulation or sedation either. It just made me feel kind of slow in the head with a somewhat anti-social element to it. I went to hang out and play music with my friend, and we had a really good jam actually, quite innovative, but I was feeling a little clumsy in my fingers. I drank some beer and it improved my situation but it also felt less good than usual and I had much more of a hangover this morning (I usually don't get hangovers at all but this morning I was sore and had a little headache). My girl came over at night and was upset about some stuff (not at me, but just about her life) and I felt like I couldn't adequately be there for her because I felt kind of out of sorts, which was a bummer. Then I had a really unsettling dream that left me shaken upon waking up, and I overslept. I feel a little low today which is very unusual for me, but it could because of a few reasons or a combination of reasons.

This experience was certainly more benign feeling than when I snorted it, but I don't think kanna is for me. I was considering trying it again today to see if the reports of better effects on subsequent days are true, but I would prefer not to feel that way today, or really, ever.

Bro your kanna might not be of good quality but you got it from a trusted vendor so i think its straight but i think you have an increased sensitivity to kanna so you should try lower dosages . So let me give you some advice, I know what im telling you, Take about 50 to 100 mg of kanna orally everyday. But a maximum of 100 mg per day , try 50 mg of oral kanna per day and do this for 2-3 days in a row and then tell me how you feel. The effects will build up and after 3 days you will feel it again. Dont give up on it so easily. So take 50 mg of kanna orally for 3 days and see how it effects you, it has reverse tolerance so effects get stronger each day, you might have a sensitivity and you might haveoverdoses a little.

 

[Ena]

Bro your kanna might not be of good quality but you got it from a trusted vendor so i think its straight but i think you have an increased sensitivity to kanna so you should try lower dosages . So let me give you some advice, I know what im telling you, Take about 50 to 100 mg of kanna orally everyday. But a maximum of 100 mg per day , try 50 mg of oral kanna per day and do this for 2-3 days in a row and then tell me how you feel. The effects will build up and after 3 days you will feel it again. Dont give up on it so easily. So take 50 mg of kanna orally for 3 days and see how it effects you, it has reverse tolerance so effects get stronger each day, you might have a sensitivity and you might haveoverdoses a little.

@ aguythatlikessmoke: if you are still around, I would like to know what you think of this: I need to try kanna for anxiety. Social anxiety, yes, but I am also a fearful flyer. Now: Even if I am lucky enough to be one of the people that kanna works for, there is this issue for me to take into consideration: the tendency to cause bowel movements. Since an airplane is not the best place to have bowel movements, how early would you suggest that I take my kanna before a flight, in order to maximize my chances of feeling good and zen the whole day (which would pretty much mean throughout the flight)?

I know, I know: I need to experiment for myself, long before any planned flight, start with small amounts of kanna, and increase progressively until I find my limits in the privacy of my home.

I guess I just need to know what your take would be on that issue, since you appear to be an expert on that subject. Of course, I'd be happy to get everybody else's expert advice on that touchy issue. Any help I can get would greatly facilitate my kanna journey, so thanks for your help, you all.

 

[HeadHigh]

Ena, Ive been using kanna for depression for the past month, and i have never had an issue with bowel movements. Taking kanna never made me have to use the bathroom anymore than i usually would, but it does help with most anxiety. I would advise (just like the rest of the people on this thread) to take it for at least two days at a dosage around 250mg before you plan on flying, and the same for the day you fly.

 

[Ena]

Thanks, HeadHigh. This is reassuring. I am going to try that prior to flying, of course, but it really helps to know that kanna is not necessarily going to cause a a bowel movement (I was a little concerned about that because aguythatlikessmoke and someone else seem to have run into that problem. But perhaps they used more of it than I am planning to ever use.....