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JFK - 50 years *gruesome photos*

Si Dread

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 29, 2002
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3,226
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UK
Morning, ya buncha cunts!

I've been facinated by the JFK murder most of my adult life. I'm too young to have been alive when it happened but by the way my mum described it, JFK's assasination was the defining event of it's time, sorta like Sept 11th is for us. A momentous historical event upon which the axis of history turned.

Once I was old enough to understand what I was seeing, I was & still am damned close to 1000% convinced, based purely & entirely on the bullets impact & Kennedys physical position at that moment, that the head shot did not come from the Book Depository in Dallas. It always appeared to me as if he had been hit from another building, from a lower floor & from almost directly behind him. The entry wound is the back of his head &, with gruesome obviousness, the exit wound is in fact on the very side of Kennedys head that faces his supposed assasin. Perhaps I should use the age old Hashashin word, for this particular site. Anyway, Oswald may well have been acting alone, but that does not mean that Kennedy was killed by a lone gunman. Whether some clandestine group or groups knew what was going to happen & added their own assassin to the mix, or some random coincidence brought two assasins to Dealy Plaza that day I have/had no idea. All I knew was that the offical story did not sit right.

I have read & watched a huge amount about that day & I have struggled to find a plausible explanation for the head shot that killed Kennedy, until now. Almost all the theories have to deal with the evidence, both photographic & actual & they always find a hole or two in the story. Why? Because somebody is not telling the truth!

The following points need to be explained.

1) How many shots were fired by Oswald

2) Why did the two rounds that hit Kennedy have such different effects

3) Where did the fatal shot come from & why the cover-up

I think, for the first time, a documentary has explained all the events of the day & I recomend any one interested in this story see it. It was on Channel 5 last week & it's called "JFK's Secret Killer".

So lets deal with this problem number 1. The doc suggests that, as I suspected, Oswald did not fire all three shots that day. The reason everyone THINKS he fired three shots is because three shots were heard, & three cartridges cases were found in Oswalds snipers nest. But Oswald WAS a sniper, & he was a good shot, & he knew what he was doing. The documentary suggests that the first cartridge, the one that fell away from the other two & was found seperated from the other two was in fact an empty that a sniper would keep in the guns breach to prevent dust & other shit & corruption getting into it. He ejected this cartridge well away from the Depository window, loaded the gun with live rounds & took up position. This explains the third cartridge & it's position away from the others. The doc suggests that the third cartridge was more worn, & more scratched that the other two, which if it's true adds to this theory.

Oswald only fired two rounds but what happened to them? It's believed that the first round hit the ground next to the limo in which Kennedy was travelling shattering & throwing bits of metal bullet & tarmac towards Kennedy, who was struck by some peices & exclamed that he had been "hit". He obviously also heard the shot & knew what it was. He leaned forward slightly, probably partly to reduce his size as a target, partly in pain. Oswald fired the next round that went through Kennedy's neck destroying his vocal cords.

The wound in Kennedys throat can be seen here -

images


It's possible this wound would have been fatal anyway. The things is, this round went through Kennedy, through the seat in front of him & seriously wounded Governer Connelly, who was in that seat. Both the rounds that Oswald fired were full-metal-jacket rounds, designed to fly straight through the target. So, how come Kennedys head exploded so dramatically when he was hit by the fatal shot? His head would not have done so if a full-metal-jacket round had hit him, it would have gone straight through leaving two small-ish wounds. No-one ever found the round that hit Kennedy in the head because it shattered, taking a fair bit of Kennedys head with it. Why did this round shatter?

Because it was fired from an AR-15 assault rifle, a predecessor to the M-16, that was carried by the Secret Service security detachment in the car that followed Kennedy. This weapon had been loaded & was apparently 100% "ready to go". It lay on the floor of the following car, at the feet of the Secret Servicemen in th back seat. You can see this weapon being handled in this picture, so there is NO doubt whatsoever that this weapon existed.

images


Gunsmoke was smelled by witnesses on the ground, which would have been impossible if Oswald had been the only one to fire!

So, this theory holds that, upon hearing the first two shots, the secret serviceman grabbed the AR-15 rifle from the floor of the car, swung it towards the Depository building, finger on the trigger, but the car jerked forward as it sped off to follow the presidents limo & the gun went off accidentally. The weapon was loaded with "stopping" rounds not designed to go all the way through a target that might leave the target standing, but to drop the target instantly. It was loaded with Hollow Points, basically, to stop dead in their tracks ANYONE who might threaten the presidents motorcade. Does this not explain the exploded head shot as well as the direction that it came from?

You can see quite clearly from this horrible photograph, how large the exit wound is, & on which side of the head. This shot did NOT come from Oswald, since I was 15 I have known this simply from watching the footage. Anyone with basic knowledge of physics can see this & that is the reason that there are so many people who do not believe the official story & so many conspiracy theories surrounding it.

images


So, the Secret Serviceman who is wielding the AR-15 (his name was Hickey) in the above photographs killed Kennedy by accident, & took the truth to the grave with him back in 2011. Since then the Secrest Service & the rest of the investigative team, the CIA, FBI & EVEYBODY has been lying about what happened that day. Who knows, if the truth had come out back then, perhaps greater controls over guns in America might have been establised a long time ago.

NBC has reported this theory here - http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...eory-alleges-secret-service-agent-fumbled-gun
 
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Great post...

Its embarrassing how much evidence points to the contary of the official line.

I wonder if another 50 years would allow the truth, I doubt it..!

Would anything change if the truth were to come out today?? I doubt that to, everyone would just say " I FUCKIN knew it", then get back to whatever they was doing.

Every agency, secret service etc has been caught with their pants well and truly down, cock in hand and nowt happens other than a fall guy takes the obvious fall then back to business as usual.
 
This shot did NOT come from Oswald, since I was 15 I have known this simply from watching the footage. Anyone with basic knowledge of physics can see this & that is the reason that there are so many people who do not believe the official story & so many conspiracy theories surrounding it.

Said the same thing for years myself, I used to get called a nutcase etc but it's true.


RIP Aldous Huxley who died on the very same day.

Live & learn something new every day, used to really like him but the links to being a "fan" of eugenics kind of put me off him.
 
Live & learn something new every day, used to really like him but the links to being a "fan" of eugenics kind of put me off him.

Oh and a few other things. "Drugs are only for the elite" being one of the main ones.

But he's still Huxley. Still wrote The Doors of Perception, Brave New World and Island. James Brown was a bit of a cunt in his personal life but he's still James Brown.
 
True SHM, Brave New World I rate far above 1984 & Fahrenheit 451 for a dystopian future book.
I still respect him for his mescaline experiment & I am quite sure he took a massive dose of acid as he was on his death bed & actually parted this dimension while tripping his nut off, I gotta give that the due respect.
 
Thanks for comments & reading such a long post. I tried to keep it simple as possible, but it's not something that can be explained briefly.

I meant to add that if anyone finds a hole in this theory I would be very interested to hear it & discuss it. The art of investigation & science generally is to find what didn't happen as much as it is to find what did, so I am very interested in alternative theories. There may well be more than one angle to this, if anyone see's it, post!

Interesting posts about Huxley too!
 
It's certainly very interesting. Why do you say that it's the defining event of that time, though? And I'm not sure September 11th defines current times either, except as something we all talk about and which gets commemorated and leads to tightened security and excuses for wars. I'm not sure the key facts of my life have been affected in any noticeable way by either event (I'm not quite old enough to remember the assassination but it was still getting a lot of media attention late 70s/early 80s which I do remember).

I think the two world wars, globalisation, microelectronics and the transition to a service economy "define my time" far more than any of this stuff!

Not saying it's a shit thread or anything :D Just I'd be wary of getting hung up on the actual importance of JFK getting shot. What's that? Too late, you say? =D
 
How dare you accuse me of a shit thread ;)

I feel that natural catastophies out-do most of the events such as JFK's murder & Sept 11th, personally. But I think as human beings we become enamoured, even obsessed when the actions of single persons or small groups or persons have such lasting effects.

Millions were involved in thw World Wars, only one man (or two if the above theory holds) killed Kennedy. Also, the events on that day & those on Sept 11th were broadcast live (by radio in the case of JFK) & I think that's consitutes part of the hold it has on people.

WWII may have been a defining moment, but it lasted years. If anything, Pearl Harbour is the defining moment of WWII.

Of course Sept 11th defines our time! It affected everyone in the free world by changing the way we travel internationally & by bringing the horrors of terrorism into the homes of real people who might never have got close to anything that awful. I have witnessed terrorism first-hand on more than one ocassion unfortunately, but I wouldn't be surprised if I were one of only a few, if any, other people on BL who have done. So when something like the Sept 11th attacks are broadcast into every home, live on the day, they have a lasting affect on the mindset of many of those who see it! The affects of my own real life experiences of terrorism I have carried with me all my adult life.

All strictly in my own warped opinion, of course ;)
 
Of course, if you have personal experience of these events then they can be devastating and I don't mean to belittle that. People have lost their lives, other people have lost loved ones. And yes the media coverage affects us all in how we think, no doubt.

And I have no argument that these events have a "hold" on people.

But I think that the reason it's correct to call it a "hold" is that, generally, they take a disproportionately significant place in our view of the world compared to their actual significance :) I'm just pointing out that I think it really is quite disproportionate. JFK more than Nov 9th.

Did Nov 9th really change the way we travel? Yeah we have to put liquids in little bottles and take our shoes off and it's annoying but it's really quite a miniscule alteration to the flight plans in the scheme of things :D

edit: I'd be interested in what ways JFK's death has actually affected us. I know we think about it now and again, it gets on TV. And as there is mystery about it, it is intriguing. But we still go to work to do the same kind of jobs, I don't think our healthcare services have been affected, or our education or transport systems, or anything else that we spend 99% of our lives actually experiencing.
 
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Obviously, in real term JFK's death has not affected us in any obvious day to day way! But if we were around in that time, it may have, even if only psychologically. I use the Sept 11th to compare how something that doesnt actually affect us personally can still change our thinking & behaviour. Right now we have this "Keep calm & carry on" propaganda shit which tries to convince us that we are not in danger & we should continue with out lives. This message wouldn't be necessary if the population were not affected by events such as Sept 11th.

Certainly terrorism is psychological, assymetrical warfare & it's aim IS to affect us all & alter our behaviour. If this makes me sound paranoid or just plain scared, bear in mind I have already been close enough to this sort of event to be well aware of how awful it might be to be caught up in another. The media can give the impression that we're all up close & personal to these sorts of events & that alone can have a lasting affect & bring about alterations in our lives that might not have done had we not been exposed to something horrific through the media. These effects might be fairly subtle, but that's because these events are fairly rare. If they become more regular the affects on day to day life of people like us would become more pronounced. That is the very purpose of terrorism! To sow fear & raise awareness of risk!

You might not now be making decisions about your life based on these events, but if terrorist attacks increased & if the places you visit in your day to day life were targetted (say, niteclubs, supermarkets, High streets) you might find yourself changing your behaviour in the hope of making yourself safe(r).

These reactions are indeed disproportionate to the true dangers, but that does not make the fear or awareness of risk any less acute.
 
I posted this in the TV thread 2 days ago but......

More4 tonight 9pm
JFK: News of a Shooting

When JFK was assassinated, reporters chased the President's body to the hospital, battled over the single payphone in reception and struggled to 'get it first, but first get it right'.
George Clooney tells the behind-the-scenes story of the Kennedy assassination from the perspective of these reporters, who relayed the news to a stunned nation.
At the film's centre is a journalist Clooney knew and admired, CBS News presenter Walter Cronkite, who announced Kennedy's death live on US television.
Cronkite was often described as 'the most trusted man in America' and Clooney described him at the time of his death in 2009 as 'the most important voice in our lives for 30 years'. He was the same age as JFK and his rise to CBS anchorman paralleled Kennedy's rise to the presidency.
As well as tracing the minute-by-minute story of the chaos in Dallas, the documentary also paints a broader picture of how television fell in love with JFK and how it sold him to the American people and the world.
In this companion piece to the film Good Night and Good Luck, Clooney presents an elegy for a different age of journalism, and a powerful reminder not to forget its values.
 
Hold on a minute Si!

If the secret serviceman was in a car behind JFK how come his head moved back and to the left with the fatal shot? And how come Jackie was reaching for a peice of his skull on the rear of the car (or she was hauling ass whichever you prefer!)? Wouldn't a shot from behind have propelled him in a different direction?

Is it really likely that at the same time Oswald is shooting from the window, the secret serviceman picks up the gun, accidentally pulls the trigger and it manages to hit JFK plumb in the skull?

I'm still leaning towards a guy on the grassy knoll.
 
His head moved backward because when he was hit from behind the well known equal & opposite reaction caused his head to move violently & very, very quickly forward, but then back more slowly, which makes it more visible. The footage is well old & hard enough to examine by professionals & I suspect that the old cameras may show the backward movement easier than the very rapid forward movement after he was hit by a shattering piece of metal travelling at around 3000 feet per second.

I don't feel that that explanation is technical enough & it could be errrr crap Lol So I thank you for the first possible hole in my story. However, if Kennedy had been hit from the front, by the old Grassy Noll fella, then he would have an entry wound in his face or forehead. There isn't one. The entry was top right of the skull, blowing it all away.

I suspect the Grassy Knoll theory was propagated by the Secret Service through the media to act as misdirection along with all the other theories about DeMaggios, The Mob, Russia, Cuba etc etc

edit- I think 18:30 UK time marks the very moment JFK lost his head. Sorry, I'll get me coat...
 
Ah yeah that's the "Jet effect" that Gerald Posner came up with. Sounds plausible -but it doesn't explain the big peice of skull Jackies reaching for on the back of the car - if he's been hit from behind surely the skull would be blasted out of the car in the opposite direction? Isn't the grassy knoll to his front right? He could've hit JFK furthur back in the head than the forehead.

If the grassy knoll bullet was a dumdum wouldn't that simply explode the moment it hit his head? You wouldn't get a neat entry wound would you?
 
yes, once the bullet has entered THEN the affects of the shatter commence.

This guy Hickey with the AR-15 is, as far as I know, the only footage of ANY weapon immediately following the shots. Surely somone, somewhere woulda seen something that points to a Grassy Knoll assasin if one existed.

The piece of skull may have ended up back of the car because the vehicle was moving forward, perhaps..?

IF the Grassy Knoll was used, why was no evidence of gunshot from that point ever found?

IF the Grassy Knoll hid another shooter, how would such a conspiracy to have TWO people attack Kennedy simultaneously not have been discovered? There would be no reason to cover it up if two people had shot Kennedy. It was clear he'd been assasinated by a lunatic, why cover up the existance of another shooter if it wasn't some Secret Service dude who's job was to PROTECT the bloody president? THAT is an excellent reason to cover it up, don't you think?

There was a guy, well away from the motorcade near to the bridge, who was hit by shrapnel. HIS experience is one that I have trouble fitting into my theory, but it's possible he was hit by the same shrapnel that came from Oswalds first shot that hit the tarmac. He was a fair way away, but I'm sure teeny bits of bullet & tarmac would travel a fair distance at something less than 3000 feet per second.
 
But arn't there photos of dozens of people running up the grassy knoll because that's where they thought the shots came from? What about the ex-army guy who laid down and heard the bullet going over the top of him from the direction of the grassy knoll? Didn't Zapruder himself say that the shots came from the grassy knoll?

Do you think Oswald was involved at all? I can never understand why he'd say he was a patsy if the whole point of it was to get famous.
 
Good questions.

Witnesses are unreliable. Facts are not!

I have almost no doubt that Oswald fired at Kennedy. The trajectory of the round that went straight through Kennedy starts from the Book Depository & the recovered round was matched to his weapon. Too many people would need to be in on the conspiracy for it not to have come out if indeed Oswald was a patsy. I cannot explain why he might say something like that other than that he must have been fucking nuts & wasn't making sense. I dunno, there's another hole. What Oswald says & what the evidence suggests, are two different things. I'm not certain Oswald acted to become famous, I suspect as a devout communist, he acted out of politics.

Those running towards the Grassy Knoll may have been confused by echos, or may have been trying to escape further fire.

Anyone who heard rounds flying around above them might have heard shrapnel flying around. A piece of tarmac or bullet fragment travelling at the speed of sound might whizz by sounding no different to a bullet.
 
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