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  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

Jeremy Corbyn: A very old fashioned breath of fresh air?

David Cameron, October 4th 2015 - "Russian attacks on opponents of Assad will only serve to further radicalisation and terrorism"

David Cameron, December 2015 - "To oppose air strikes on (opponents of Assad) is to be a terrorist sympathiser"

Daily Mail editorial one week ago - "Two years ago David Cameron wanted to go to war with the Syrian regime. Today, he wants to go to war to aid the Syrian regime. We cannot agree with such inconsistency"
 
Superficially it may seem that for once the Daily Mail may have a point. My knowledge of events 2 years ago is pretty vague to say the least. I can't really comment on that.

But I do know that the events of the past few weeks have changed everything. What may have applied before the Paris attacks may not neccesarilly apply now. Events and alliances and allegiences have been extremely fluid and fast moving.

I'd be much more worried if Cameron had not changed any of his foreign policies in the light of recent events. Did the Daily Mail expect Cameron to carry on as if the Paris attacks had not happened:?
 
Go jezza! BBC in full downplay/distract mode - "democracy's wasted on these plebs!"

On syria, seems the French government cries of 'they hate our way of life' quickly morph into 'so lets change our way of life in fundamental ways; that'll show 'em!'. This report confirms the wsws report i posted in the other thread. I fear our states way more than i fear the ragtag islamic state (who'd disappear if we cut off their funding/support from our allies) - our states could so easily slip into actual facsism if they thought their power was threatened - states of emergency are one tell-tale sign; as is a big ever-present enemy of untermenschen threatening our very existence (with kitchen knives in our case).

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/paris-attacks-france-extend-state-emergency-indefinitely-reports-1531665

The French government is looking to extend the state of emergency for six months or even "indefinitely", according to new reports.

Government sources told AFP that a draft law of the bill includes plans to change the constitution to carry on with the state of emergency way beyond the three-month limit.

The legal framework will be submitted to ministers on 23 December. The state of emergency, which went into effect after the November 13 attacks on Paris that killed 130 and wounded more than 350, gives security forces extra powers to investigate and combat terrorists. It allows authorities to ban public demonstrations and conduct several arrests across the country.

A total of 276 people have been placed under house arrest since the powers came into effect, and more than 1,000 addresses searched by police.

French authorities, meanwhile, have stepped up efforts to fight radicalisation with sorties over IS-held territory in Syria and France has been named as a target by IS militants.

However, rights groups and activists have accused the government of abusing their powers after dozens of environmental activists were placed under house arrest before the COP21 international climate talks, that run from 30 November until 11 December.

The Greens have accused the government of exploiting the terrorist threat to curb the right to protest. "That's enough. Environmentalists are not terrorists," David Cormand, the deputy head of Europe Écologie Les Verts (Europe Ecology – The Greens), tweeted to Prime Minister Manuel Valls and Interior Minister Bernard Cazeneuve.

After the first environmental activist was detained, the Human Rights League (LDH) urged the French government to rethink its approach. "If we needed a confirmation that the state of emergency is a threat to civil liberties, the measure would prove so, as it reveals that the fight against terrorism is only a pretext to ban all discordant voices", the group said in a statement. "As we feared, the state of emergency is accompanied by increasingly arbitrary measures."
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Speaking of democracy I think they're idiots for going at MPs for how they voted. Yes I don't agree with bombing Suria but why let people vote n they're going to go mad n try getting them sacked for not voting a particular way? It doesn't make sense. You can't have a democracy n then play ell when people have not voted particular way. It's ludicrous :)

Evey
 
Eveleivibe said:
Speaking of democracy I think they're idiots for going at MPs for how they voted. Yes I don't agree with bombing Suria but why let people vote n they're going to go mad n try getting them sacked for not voting a particular way? It doesn't make sense. You can't have a democracy n then play ell when people have not voted particular way. It's ludicrous :)

Evey
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It would have been a democratic process had we all been able to vote, rather than just 650 people, many of whom have other interests beyond the humanitarian one.
 
Reminds me of that old line by Mr Franklin - “They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”

<3
 
Eveleivibe said:
Speaking of democracy I think they're idiots for going at MPs for how they voted..... It's ludicrous :)

Evey
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No, this is ludicrous.

TORY MP CAUGHT MAKING UP DEATH THREAT

Lucy Allan, MP for Telford, has been caught out adding her own death threat to an email she received. The email, asking her to consider not voting for war, ended with the words "There is no hope". To which she added, when she placed it on her FB page,

UNTIL YOU DIE

The original email came to light when the writer came forward with his copy.

Lucy Allan has claimed it is her own selective editing and "it's my Facebook page, I can write what I want"

Which, it seems, includes lying and making up threats that don't exist.

http://order-order.com/2015/12/02/tory-mp-doctors-constituents-email-adding-death-threat/

There is now a petition calling for her resignation.
 
"It's my Facebook page, I can write what I want" is the kinda shit I'd expect from a 14 year old girl raging at her mother, not a constitutional representative.
 
Absolutely disgusting behaviour revealing the true nature of these fuckers.

StoneHappyMonday said:
No, this is ludicrous.

TORY MP CAUGHT MAKING UP DEATH THREAT

Lucy Allan, MP for Telford, has been caught out adding her own death threat to an email she received. The email, asking her to consider not voting for war, ended with the words "There is no hope". To which she added, when she placed it on her FB page,

UNTIL YOU DIE

The original email came to light when the writer came forward with his copy.

Lucy Allan has claimed it is her own selective editing and "it's my Facebook page, I can write what I want"

Which, it seems, includes lying and making up threats that don't exist.

http://order-order.com/2015/12/02/tory-mp-doctors-constituents-email-adding-death-threat/

There is now a petition calling for her resignation.
Click to expand...
 
Surely for lying about what those representing her saying her career as an MP is now almost certainly over?
 
Well i wouldn't go that far - maybe just turn her heating up a bit more than is comfortable

...

I just read that if the swing in oldham was replicated in a general election (like they usually do in the studio with peter snow but didn't do this time), labour would form a government. Now obviously, it's just a by-election and you can't extrapolate from it (though they usually do), but there it is.
 
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That election result shows that there is hope yet. Despite the tabloid onslaught to ridicule, undermine and misrepresent Corbyn a healthy proportion of voters are able to see through all that BS and think for themselves and form their own conclusions and opinions. I sometimes despair when you see "Joe Public" being interviewed on the news and obviously parroting what the DM has told him to 'think'.

Despite all the talk of "lowest poll ratings ever" I can see Corbyn's new way of doing politics gradually turning things around for the Labour party given time and if his own MPs and cabinet work with him, not against him, and give him a chance. Even those who most strongly disagree or despair at Corbyn's approach have to admit that they cannot help but respect the guy for always having the courage of his convictions no matter how unpopular or controversial they may be; a great example of this saw him recently standing by his pacifist beliefs and standing against the bombing of Syria at a time when such opinions will generally be very unpopular where everyone else seems to be baying for ISIS blood.
 
Part of the problem is the sly and dishonest way the media and politicians use polling - ie 'push-polling': releasing a biased poll to make everyone think 'everyone thinks this', to try and herd them into a perceived consensus. This shit works, but it's getting less effective over time i think. The other really irritating one is the way the BBC and others gather together a 'focus group' of 8 people carefully selected to give a certain impression, and then talk to them as if they represent the whole country - this bullshit is straight out of advertising, and like advertising it's as much about influencing people's views as analysing them (and even when it's 'honest' it's only really suited for choosing washing powder logos, not deciding our politics).

If you actually look at all the polls, while labour is behind, they're position has been pretty much constant despite the best/worst the media establishment can throw (and is even creeping up in some). I reckon this could be a tortoise/hare thing: slow and steady wins the race. And as far as the labour members are concerned, they're still massively behind him, even according to Yougov (who i don't necessarily trust).

...

In WW3 news: Mission creep has kicked in already - According to Syria, 'Coalition Planes bomb Syrian Army Position, killing syrian troops' [ie effectively supporting ISIS]. Is it time to start painting the windows and propping a door up against the wall...

https://www.rt.com/news/324940-syrian-army-coalition-strike/
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-35024408

And the lamescream-media (yeah, you sheeples!) don't seem to have noticed the turkish army entering iraq without permission.

http://rudaw.net/english/middleeast/iraq/05122015
 
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The Dubliners - Protect And Survive
Well the government's made a document
To help prevent embarrassment
And in the event of an accident
Catching us with our trousers down
It's no use to you when you're dead
Nor even when alive
And the name of this piece of paper is
Protect and survive

So when the nukes come raining down
It's great to be alive, well
World War Three can be such fun
If you protect and survive
Protect and survive

Well a nuclear strike can be recognised
It would stand out in a crowd
There's a flash, then a bang, then a blast of heat
Then a bloody great mushroom cloud
So if you happen to see one at the end of your street
Would you please pick up the telephone
And inform your local police

So when the nukes come raining down
It's great to be alive, well
World War Three can be such fun
If you protect and survive
Protect and survive

Put sticky tape on your windows
Block your ears and close your eyes
But it won't make a blind bit of difference
You won't have to watch yourself fry
If you find yourself in the target zone
And you haven't got a shelter
Take a spade into the garden
And dig like merry hell, sir

So when the nukes come raining down
It's great to be alive, well
World War Three can be such fun
If you protect and survive
Protect and survive

They've got strategic ICBM's
Both theatre and tactical
With independently targeted
Multiple re-entry vehicles
Backfire bombers, Polaris sub's, cruise missiles
And the boys who hang around the Pentagon
Can't wait to use these toys

So when the nukes come raining down
It's great to be alive, well
World War Three can be such fun
If you protect and survive
Protect and survive

When Armageddon gets underway
And the rockets come pouring down
All the bloody politicians who started it
Will scuttle off underground
And when they finally re-emerge
With no life to be found
They can administrate the rubble
And they can order each other around

So when the nukes come raining down
It's great to be alive, well
World War Three can be such fun
If you protect and survive
Protect and survive

For they give us a four-minute warning
When the rockets are on their way
To give us time to panic and Christians time to pray
So when you hear the siren's going
Place your head between your thighs
Whilst maintaining this posture
You can make a final gesture
And with a little muscular pressure
You can kiss your arse goodbye

So when the nukes come raining down
It's great to be alive, well
World War Three can be such fun
If you protect and survive
Protect and survive
Protect and...
 
More signs that it's the end times: another Daily Mail Article on Syria (and Corbyn) that makes sense (although this is Peter Obourne who nearly always does)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...inner-Syria-vote-wasn-t-Dave-Hilary-Benn.html

...But I believe that only one politician deserves to emerge with an enhanced reputation as a result of the week’s events. That figure is Jeremy Corbyn.

Whether or not you like Mr Corbyn (and I profoundly disagree with many of his policies), there is no denying that he emerged from the arguments over Syria as a man of moral courage, integrity and principle.

Indeed, how interesting that after months of denigrating Corbyn, the Blairite tendency — together with those excitable inhabitants of the Westminster bubble — have been made to look silly in their prediction that Labour would lose the Oldham by-election.

In the real world, it seems the voters have more time for the Labour leader than the metropolitan commentariat.

Faced with bitter hostility from his own side on Wednesday, Mr Corbyn stood his ground. Courteously, he set out his honest doubts about the wisdom of bombing raids on Syria.(ctd.)
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