Bupe IV Suboxone - half-life

[alleyezonme3]

As you may know from my previous threads, I make an IVable solution out of my suboxone (I know the dangers/risks, but I eliminate most of them with my method of bupe extraction), and proceed to IV my bupe.

I am one of the many users that uses dope occasionally, and the bupe for maintenance in between dope sessions. As we all know, bupe loves to stick around in your system for days and block all the good opiate effects.

BUT, since I am IV user, I am wondering if I can go ahead and maybe IV dope sooner than people who take their subs SL because I can only assume it gets in my system faster, it leaves my system faster.

I have tried to search, and found some information that supports my theory, and says the half-life for bupe IV might be as low as 2.2 hours(!!!) or as high as 6 hours. This was very exciting information for me (and it also made me think twice about my ROA for maintenance, since it seems like I would have to use just as much bupe IV as I would SL just to keep it in my system (maybe this isn't such a bad thing though, and would actually speed up recovery and not have my receptors saturated 24/7).

From my experience, I believe this is true. I seem to have to do my IV bupe quite often to get effects. I definitely feel like the effects of it clear up fairly quickly (some might linger, but it feels like 80% of the dose is gone within 2 - 3 hours).

What does anyone with more knowledge and information on this topic think? I think this could be very interesting for a lot of people, and definitely very good to know information!

Thanks everyone for reading / helping!

 

[alleyezonme3]

Oh and just some more information, I do seem have an incredibly fast metabolism when it comes to chemicals. Even SL bupe, I can take my morning dose and that afternoon or night, I can feel dope (effects might be diminished, but they are definitely still there). Many people like to tell me this is not possible, but I promise you, I know what dope feels like.

Within 24 hours, even if I take some ridiculous 16mg dose SL, I can feel dope.

 

[Lorne???]

Yes, the half-life of IV buprenorphine ranges from 1.5-7h, with a mean of roughly 3.5h.

However, although it can be 6h, that is extremely rare, and in most cases it appears to be 2-4h

Trust me, I have done A LOT of research into this. And yes, you don't have to wait all that long to do other opioids.

But be warned: Duration of action and half-life ARE NOT one in the same. Large doses of buprenorphine will still last 6-12 hours, so best to wait till your feeling rough to do any dope.

Not to mention, bupe sends your tolerance higher than you might think...

 

[Lorne???]

BTW, as I have explained in other threads, low doses of buprenorphine appear to have little effect. I've shot morphine within 3-4h of a 200microgram dose, no problem. It's always best to wait till your in mild dt's, simply because opioids(with the exception of methadone) are always more effective in a state of abstinence, but really the whole "blockade effect" has been exaggerated...

(You can even mix low doses of bupe with other opioids freely, as they're I'd no blockade, though I wouldn't suggest that unless your in pain. But they do use morphine for breakthrough for patients receiving low dose buprenorphine keep that in mind...

 

[Effect]

I always thought ROA does not change the elimination half life, but shortens the duration that the effects of the drug last.

Even though IVing causes one to feel withdrawal faster due to shortened duration, it is not eliminated any faster by the body.

That's what I was always told and it made sense to me, but apparently everyone is reading and hearing differently and I don't know what the deal is at this point.

 

[burn out]

I always thought ROA does not change the elimination half life, but shortens the duration that the effects of the drug last.

Even though IVing causes one to feel withdrawal faster due to shortened duration, it is not eliminated any faster by the body.

That's what I was always told and it made sense to me, but apparently everyone is reading and hearing differently and I don't know what the deal is at this point.

Thats what I heard at first also, but I now believe the other theory based on my own experience. If the half life was the same, how could you explain the drug getting out of your system much faster when you IV it? Why would the duration differ significantly if the half life was unchanged? The half life is the time it takes for half the drug to leave your system. WHen you IV sub or even heroin in my experience, half of it gets out of your system much faster than other ROAs. That must mean the half life changes.

Anyway, I just wanted to say I love IV bupe and even thought the half life is shorter if strething your bupe is important to you, IV is still the best way to go. Why? Because you can get away with such low doses that way. I can feel .05 mg of bupe IV, in fact my preferred dose is about .1 or .2 mg, shooting more does not really lead to better effects and causes you not to feel the next dose as much. The key to enjoying bupe is keeping the dose as low as possible. Just triitate down until you find your sweet spot.

 

[The Doc.]

I thought the same thing as effect that's just what I was informed of when it came to half life of bupe. But I guess it makes sense cause the half life for other ROAs such as smoking heroin seem to be a lot shorter than snorting or IV

 

[cjh1221]

The shortened half-life referred to in the medical studies and medication handouts (mean 2.2 hours) refers to doses under 2 mg., mostly doses in the mcg. range. This is different because there is not enough bupe in that small of a dose to fully saturate the receptors like there is in doses above the mcg. range. In doses greater than 1-2 mg., the half life remains the same whether it's 2 mg. or 16 mgs. There is enough bupe in doses that high to fully saturate the receptor sites and block opiates from being able to bind. Plus, when discussing Suboxone as opposed to Subutex, there is also the factor of Naloxone to consider on top of the Bupe.
So, to sum it up, in doses above 2 mgs., regardless of ROA, the half-life remains the same....approx. 37 hours. That means if one dosed 2 mg, no matter ROA, the amount of bupe/Naloxone still active in the body 37 hours later would be 1mg. Bupe/.5 mgs. of Naloxone. Remember, that is REGARDLESS of ROA.
I'm sorry to come off sounding condescending but I have seen this question so many times and have YET to see anyone answer it correctly. I'm also sorry for reviving an old thread but in the interest of harm reduction, I felt it was necessary for anyone else who came across this thread to have the correct information instead of just shooting bag after bag and having the H not work, a waste of money, but also possibly overdose from the respiratory depressant qualities of the drugs while trying to achieve the high they are looking for. Save your dope man, it's a waste of money to even bother until at least the 24 hour mark. 36 is better but I have seen someone catch a good rush after only 18 hours. Even then it took a higher dose than normal.
Your mileage may vary slightly, but only VERY slightly. Please be safe and play smart.

 

[Chemist4Hire]

The shortened half-life referred to in the medical studies and medication handouts (mean 2.2 hours) refers to doses under 2 mg., mostly doses in the mcg. range. This is different because there is not enough bupe in that small of a dose to fully saturate the receptors like there is in doses above the mcg. range. In doses greater than 1-2 mg., the half life remains the same whether it's 2 mg. or 16 mgs. There is enough bupe in doses that high to fully saturate the receptor sites and block opiates from being able to bind. Plus, when discussing Suboxone as opposed to Subutex, there is also the factor of Naloxone to consider on top of the Bupe.
So, to sum it up, in doses above 2 mgs., regardless of ROA, the half-life remains the same....approx. 37 hours. That means if one dosed 2 mg, no matter ROA, the amount of bupe/Naloxone still active in the body 37 hours later would be 1mg. Bupe/.5 mgs. of Naloxone. Remember, that is REGARDLESS of ROA.
I'm sorry to come off sounding condescending but I have seen this question so many times and have YET to see anyone answer it correctly. I'm also sorry for reviving an old thread but in the interest of harm reduction, I felt it was necessary for anyone else who came across this thread to have the correct information instead of just shooting bag after bag and having the H not work, a waste of money, but also possibly overdose from the respiratory depressant qualities of the drugs while trying to achieve the high they are looking for. Save your dope man, it's a waste of money to even bother until at least the 24 hour mark. 36 is better but I have seen someone catch a good rush after only 18 hours. Even then it took a higher dose than normal.
Your mileage may vary slightly, but only VERY slightly. Please be safe and play smart.

Hey not to be picky but you said 1mg buprenorphine/0.5mg naloxone?

I was under the impression that the ratio is 4:1 buprenorphine 4 x as much as naloxone. And you have it showing 2:1 just doubled?

Im sure norbupe/bupes affinity over naloxone would not cause that change and niether would naloxone having 1/30th of the duration of bupe.

Do you care to explaine this. And to be clear im just asking a question aside from op and replies just pertaining to what you said. Just seen thus tgread and what you stated caught my eye.

 

[Lorne???]

The shortened half-life referred to in the medical studies and medication handouts (mean 2.2 hours) refers to doses under 2 mg., mostly doses in the mcg. range. This is different because there is not enough bupe in that small of a dose to fully saturate the receptors like there is in doses above the mcg. range. In doses greater than 1-2 mg., the half life remains the same whether it's 2 mg. or 16 mgs. There is enough bupe in doses that high to fully saturate the receptor sites and block opiates from being able to bind. Plus, when discussing Suboxone as opposed to Subutex, there is also the factor of Naloxone to consider on top of the Bupe.
So, to sum it up, in doses above 2 mgs., regardless of ROA, the half-life remains the same....approx. 37 hours. That means if one dosed 2 mg, no matter ROA, the amount of bupe/Naloxone still active in the body 37 hours later would be 1mg. Bupe/.5 mgs. of Naloxone. Remember, that is REGARDLESS of ROA.
I'm sorry to come off sounding condescending but I have seen this question so many times and have YET to see anyone answer it correctly. I'm also sorry for reviving an old thread but in the interest of harm reduction, I felt it was necessary for anyone else who came across this thread to have the correct information instead of just shooting bag after bag and having the H not work, a waste of money, but also possibly overdose from the respiratory depressant qualities of the drugs while trying to achieve the high they are looking for. Save your dope man, it's a waste of money to even bother until at least the 24 hour mark. 36 is better but I have seen someone catch a good rush after only 18 hours. Even then it took a higher dose than normal.
Your mileage may vary slightly, but only VERY slightly. Please be safe and play smart.

No it doesn't. Iv T1/2 remains the same, at the starting analgesic dose of ~0.5, or at 2mg.

1.7-7hrs, mean 3-4(IIRC same as oxycodone, basically.

Sq has an extended T1/2 because it is gradually released and absorbed, and they theorize a shallow depot effect.

Low doses sublingual could have reduced t1/2, due to no depot effect,(we are talking like the 400mcg Bupe sublingual tablets they give out, rarely) though otherwise, 12-40(estimate) for SQ, and aforementioned figures for IV stand

Duration of action is dose dependent, though, compare, say 25mg morphine w/ 100mg...
(And morphine is only like 1.5-5hrs, mean 2-3 or something like that)

 

[Animoe]

ok I must be trippin crazy cause i can do a shot of dope in the morning then start feeling like I need another like waaaaaay later that night. I am definitely good from my morning shot for at least 12 hours..

 

[Båtmannen]

No it doesn't. Iv T1/2 remains the same, at the starting analgesic dose of ~0.5, or at 2mg.

1.7-7hrs, mean 3-4(IIRC same as oxycodone, basically.

Sq has an extended T1/2 because it is gradually released and absorbed, and they theorize a shallow depot effect.

Low doses sublingual could have reduced t1/2, due to no depot effect,(we are talking like the 400mcg Bupe sublingual tablets they give out, rarely) though otherwise, 12-40(estimate) for SQ, and aforementioned figures for IV stand

Duration of action is dose dependent, though, compare, say 25mg morphine w/ 100mg...
(And morphine is only like 1.5-5hrs, mean 2-3 or something like that)

ok I must be trippin crazy cause i can do a shot of dope in the morning then start feeling like I need another like waaaaaay later that night. I am definitely good from my morning shot for at least 12 hours..

I agree with this. There's no way my 24 mg of bupe has a half-life of 7 h or less, even though I've read the actual study and have seen the results and the much lower half-life.

 

[Lorne???]

I agree with this. There's no way my 24 mg of bupe has a half-life of 7 h or less, even though I've read the actual study and have seen the results and the much lower half-life.

T1/2 and duration of action ARE MOT THE SAME THING.

IDK Why people are so stuck on a drugs half-life. Just take diazepam; it has a t1/2 of 20-50 hours, similar to clonazepam.

Yet, you have to take it 3-4 times per day, for anticonvulsant, or to maintain anxyiolsis, among other indications. Occasionally, 5 doses per day. Yet, clonazepam is typically given twice(BID), or 3 times per day w/ lower doses, and studies have found a single large dose to be sufficient(though for average people, this increases side effects)

Point is, t1/2 and duration of action often have no correlation, whatsoever.

Buprenorphine has an extended duration, becuAse of a long receptor binding half-life(supposedly, 30-40 minutes, vs just a matter of seconds compared to morphine, though this seems questionable)

More to the point l, hype has an extremely high binding affinity, and it penetrates the cans more slowly than your typical opioid.

This is why(in part) no rush from buprenorphine, and it also means that it exits the cns more slowly, allowing it to bind more tightly, and have longer access to its targets, and each molecule can hit multiple targets.

Similar to why H/morphine can have a surprisingly long duration, albeit with a large dose(which is not recommended)

At the bottom of previous post, mentioned that duration was dose dependent, btw.

In severe pain, the reduced t1/2 is more apparent...

 

[Lorne???]

I agree with this. There's no way my 24 mg of bupe has a half-life of 7 h or less, even though I've read the actual study and have seen the results and the much lower half-life.

Are you injecting 24 f'in mg? That is way above the ceiling, and would be more antagonistic that anything(lilekly)

Btw, nalaxone is rapidly eliminated , t1/2 averages like ? minutes.

You didn't mention that, though some guy posting woefully incorrect information did.

For SQ, t1/2 ranges, I think from 12-48hrs?

Though it can be less, in any case, anecdotelly, I do can get by on 2-3 shots, and since it is freakin 5-10x as potent, still use less.

Sorry for double post; btw, anyone experienced with buccaneers buprenorphine ? Like Bunavail, for example

 

[Animoe]

Are you injecting 24 f'in mg?

I'm guessing this HAS to be a typo.. There would LITERALLY be no point.

 

[Jabberwocky]

^some people do indeed inject huge doses like 24mg. Not common, but hardly unheard of. Not saying it's a good idea, safe, or even particularly effective, but I'm sure there are people out there who do it. Then again, some people also huff gasoline to get high...

 

[Lorne???]

^LOL

Thank you for that

People also take nutmeg