I feel like in this war people are accepting arguments that could be considered viable in principle if you stretch reality enough, but that could be easily countered with some common sense.
Israel is under attack
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Cream Gravy?
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Is it? Hamas has built miles upon miles of tunnels underneath Gaza and placed their headquarters under hospitals any time possible so that the ignorant will sympathize with them when anything happens to civilians. There is no overstating the absurdity and callous attitude towards human life that jihadists have throughout the Middle East, let alone in the Gaza strip.
I spent lots of time learning about Islamic culture from its inception in the 700s to the present from one of my Muslim professors in college. He obviously had no intention of convincing me that Islam was inherently violent in its spread and existence, yet that was my takeaway; that Islam cannot exist without violence. It was founded upon the idea that those who are not Islamic should be forced to convert at the point of a sword. And as they say, those who live by the sword die by the sword. So if these extremists want to base their whole identity on killing, raping, and murdering in the name of their nation/faith, then I don't see why anyone should feel an ounce of sympathy for them.
mal3volent
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No man it's totally exaggerated! They built their entire military infrastructure UNDER HOSPITALS. They hide weapons in SCHOOLS AND MOSQUES. They block roads and bridges to prevent people from evacuating.
It's really no big deal to be honest. Completely overblown!
It's really no big deal to be honest. Completely overblown!
But there’s whole areas being flattened. U can’t tell me all those miles upon miles of bombed civilians houses are legitimate targets.
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
Well, I agree somewhat, but you can't judge all actions by the beliefs of some people within a government. Just because this guy exists doesn't mean they shouldn't or don't have the right to eliminate Hamas. I'm sure they would also be taking action even if the entire government was left wing.
People also have their blinders to what Hamas is doing. Leaders on both sides want to eradicate the other with extreme prejudice.
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
New idea:
If you side with Israel, you must end all your posts with #DestroyAllMuslims #KillingCivililansIsFun
If you side with Palestine, you must end all your posts with #JewsMustDie #DecapitatingBabiesIsJustified
Lets put everyone's cards on the table.
If you side with Israel, you must end all your posts with #DestroyAllMuslims #KillingCivililansIsFun
If you side with Palestine, you must end all your posts with #JewsMustDie #DecapitatingBabiesIsJustified
Lets put everyone's cards on the table.
kiely
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nepalnt21
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so they deserve death? and the others that DIDN'T cheer deserve death?
as pointed out, israel has agency. they can CHOOSE to not bomb schools, hospitals, refugee camps, u.n. shelters, etc. etc. etc.
But Israel has a RIGHT to bomb ambulances! Don't worry everyone will believe them when they say Hamas was in them
Israel Bombs Convoy of 30 Ambulances in Gaza
The convoy was attacked by Israeli planes in three places: on Al-Abbas and Al-Rashid streets, at the Ansar roundabout, and at the Al Shifa hospital entrance.
mal3volent
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right. And just let Hamas operate unimpeded. Just send in the "special forces" right, all they gotta do is dodge all the ieds and hordes of terrorists with guns. Infiltrate the tunnels and take out all the high ranking officials. All while avoiding all civilian casualties which should be easy since they look SO much different than the terrorists.
xaddictx
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assclass, I wouldn't even get into a pissing contest with this ignoramis. No sense getting heated over someone like this. You're better than that.
nepalnt21
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dude, what are special forces for if not dangerous situations?
israel keeps gaza under tight watch, heavy surveillance. they seem to always know where a hamas target is, but just can't seem to help but kill hundreds of times more civilians getting to them.
it is VERY obvious to anyone paying attention that this is ethnic cleansing and is wrong.
ffs, even rand paul of all ppl is on our side. (granted, he IS always anti funding other ppls wars, but still...)
israel keeps gaza under tight watch, heavy surveillance. they seem to always know where a hamas target is, but just can't seem to help but kill hundreds of times more civilians getting to them.
it is VERY obvious to anyone paying attention that this is ethnic cleansing and is wrong.
ffs, even rand paul of all ppl is on our side. (granted, he IS always anti funding other ppls wars, but still...)
Just been watching the footage of this. Like a river of blood flowing down the road.But Israel has a RIGHT to bomb ambulances! Don't worry everyone will believe them when they say Hamas was in them
Israel Bombs Convoy of 30 Ambulances in Gaza
The convoy was attacked by Israeli planes in three places: on Al-Abbas and Al-Rashid streets, at the Ansar roundabout, and at the Al Shifa hospital entrance.www.telesurenglish.net
Kids bodies all over the place.
Absolutely zero terrorist threat.
Just more intentional civilian bombing.
swilow
Bluelight Crew
Come on dude, you know he's not saying that.
It's not obvious at all. Israel are not targeting Palestinians because they're Palestinian. They're not targeting civilians at all. They're inadvertently killing civilians because Hamas intentionally hides among them. The net result is still civilians dead and that is bad and Israel need to limit that as much as they can- which they are. But Israel cannot exist with a threat like Hamas looming over their population. You cannot have a stable society with the threat of massacre just beyond the border. They've tried to be hands off with Gaza and Hamas and all they got in return was constant rocket attacks and murder. I don't know why so many expect Israel to just accept this, and knowing the history of the Jews, you have to see how unacceptable it is. They are one of few human groups that have looked genocide in the eyes and seen where it leads. You cannot imagine they will do that again.
This has been said so many times now that it feels utterly futile, but if Israel wanted to "ethnically cleanse" Gaza, they could have demolished it in about 4 hours. They haven't done that, because they don't want to.
Israel bombs whatever targets they want and claims that Hamas is there without offering substantial evidence, then people just excuse the insane amount of civilian casualties because of the nonsense fed to them by the IDF who has been known to lie repeatedly with proof of intentionally misleading including fabrication of evidence
finally something I can agree on
swilow
Bluelight Crew
Given that you seem to believe the figures provided by a terrorist group, what evidence would satisfy you, though?
I'm hearing arguments like Israel are so high tech, they should be able to target Hamas fighters with pinpoint accuracy, to they're fabricating evidence when they do target Hamas fighters. What is true?
How does it benefit Israel to massacre civilians? It does nothing but hinder their cause.
I don't doubt that the IDF have fabricated evidence and done all manner of deceptive fuckery. Theyre not saints, there the fucking military. And I'm sure there are IDF members who are targeting civilians, even while the IDF as a whole explicitly isn't.
But again, and I'm going to paraphrase Charles Manson here because I'm sick of repeating the same thing and none of you guys acknowledging it: "If Israel wanted to kill Palestinians, there'd be none of them left".
Honestly, I hate the term collateral damage. It's a ridiculous euphemism for what we know the truth to be. But intent to destroy a population looks different to inadvertently killing members of that population, and intentions matter.
They are doing exactly that. There is no doubt hundreds/thousands of Palestinian civilians and children are being killed.
Your argument tgat if they wanted to they could just wipe them out is flawed because they need to do it while the whole world is watching snd this is as much as they can get away with. Same result but over a longer time with less risk of other countries getting involved.
'"They have access methodologically to sources of information that nobody else has—access to data from morgues, from hospitals—and that’s ultimately going to be the most reliable way to count casualties,” Omar Shakir, the Israel and Palestine director at Human Rights Watch, says of Palestinian health officials in Gaza. He notes that when Human Rights Watch has conducted its own investigations into individual strikes, “there have been no large discrepancies between those numbers and the numbers produced by the Gaza health ministry.”'
What Experts Say About the Palestinian Death Toll Figures
After U.S. President Joe Biden cast doubt on the Palestinian death toll in Gaza, Palestinian officials released a list.
Their numbers are correct, that's why I believe them. There is zero evidence that Palestine is fabricating evidence but there is a ton of evidence that Israel fabricates evidence that you seem to be conveniently ignoring
swilow
Bluelight Crew
I'm not doubting it. It would be impossible for this to not occur, given the explicit goals of Hamas and the way they shelter among civilians. I do tend to dismiss lost of what Hamas say though.
It's not really working though, is it? Millions of people in the West have been claiming Israel is genocidal, even before this latest conflict. It literally doesn't matter whether Israel are bombing Gaza or simply building a wall around it. The bar for what the world considers genocide when it comes to Israel is so low as to be impossible for them to not contravene.
Geopolitically, if Israel genocided the residents of Gaza, they would be even more outcast then they are. They would be likely to face military action from every one of their neighbours. They would lose the support of their greatest allies. They have everything to lose by wiping out the Palestinians and very little to gain. Israel is many things but they're not insane. They are fighting an explicit existential threat, and this conflict is what that looks like.
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