Is there such thing as MD without the MA?

[Inds]

Is there a drug that doesn't have the amphetamines part so you won't have to deal with the stupid speedy effects and paranoia? MD without the MA would be great.

 

[Tranced]

It's nowhere near as simple as you seem to expect, but the amphetamine part is the part which defines the substance as an active (phenethylamine) chemical;
take away that phenethylamine backbone and you basically wouldn't have a drug.

It's worth noting that not all phenethylamines are speedy, per se, and that MDMA shouldn't really be causing you paranoia.

 

[Inds]

Stimulants do cause paranoia, it's a known fact. Anything that speeds your system up makes you more susceptible to panic attacks and paranoia. I realize it's not so simple, tho. I don't have a background in chemistry but I do know that it's a huge puzzle game where you have to find the exact right molecular structure which will bind to the proper receptors in the body which will then indirectly release the desired chemicals thru complicated interactions with many different others. It makes my head explode thinking about it.

But basically I was trying to brainstorm similar drugs that have the MD effects without the amphetamine effects. Syntocinon is one drug that stimulates release of oxytocin for the loved-up effects but probably without the serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine. I shot up oxytocin but I only felt vaguely more empathy and social confidence, nothing near an mdma roll.

 

[opiatekrzy]

I believe this would be the methylenedioxy ring (md) ? I once thought I had a compound that was just that once, but who knows im.not a chemist. It felt like I was coming up on a roll only to drop to baseline. I remember yawning, like mdma makes me at first, felt a bit emotional, then drop off.to zero
I probablyprobably wrong, but I couldn't help but wonder if it was some sort of MD base I took..however I'm probably wrrong.

 

[martainnn]

IME, MDE was quite stoning in comparison but came with decreased feelings of being 'loved up'. When I was about 18, there was a substantial time (around a year or so) where MDE seemed to be in pills more often than not, so I did it quite a bit. Its not as warming as MDMA and I found myself quite lazy on it, almost to the point of sitting still all night. It made for a sociable house party drug for when people just wanted to chill. I dont think its that common these days though.

 

[sekio]

It's nowhere near as simple as you seem to expect, but the amphetamine part is the part which defines the substance as an active (phenethylamine) chemical;
take away that phenethylamine backbone and you basically wouldn't have a drug.

This.

There have been selective serotonin releasing agents developed (MDAI, 5-IAI etc) but none of them have had very promising reports by humans in comparison to triple monoamine releasers like MDx. There have been studies showing how MDMA needs not only serotonin release but also norepinephrine and dopamine release to feel "euphoric". So there's not really a way to seperate the empathogenic effects from the stimulant ones, they go hand in hand.

The better answer is, alter your set, setting, dose or frequency of use if you don't like the effects you're getting. Properly dosed, MDMA shouldn't be that stimulating, if you're taking more than 200mg you are probably doing too much.

 

[Inds]

Thanks guys for the info, but isn't MDA also an amphetamine? It's not as stimulating probably because it's without the methylated component that better absorbs in the blood. But without the amphetamine base at all I wonder what it might be like.

sekio, what about all those chemicals released except for serotonin? Screwing with that hormone is the source of the majority of neurotoxic issues with drugs. If we dropped the messing with serotonin, how different would the experience be theoretically?

So there's not really a way to seperate the empathogenic effects from the stimulant ones, they go hand in hand.

That's not true tho, oxytocin is not a stimulant, right? And it produces loved up feelings. Without the euphoria and the urge to dance like MDMA, of course.

The better answer is, alter your set, setting, dose or frequency of use if you don't like the effects you're getting. Properly dosed, MDMA shouldn't be that stimulating, if you're taking more than 200mg you are probably doing too much.

I did fuck up when I took 250mg so I took a much lower dose the second time and I did have a nice time but the panic attacks still happened, I was simply able to get a grip on them this time but the fact that they happened at all on even a 100mg dose just reminded me that no matter what a beautiful, lovey drug molly is, it is still a stimulant and always will be a relative of her ugly, homicidal methamphetamine sister.
I'm not being delusional enough to think that I'll get my hands on some obscure derivative of molly in my town, it was merely a thought experiment. I do realize that if I wanna rehabilitate myself and enjoy ecstasy to the fullest that I need to get a grip on myself and stop thinking negative thoughts all the time like I normally do. I'm very cynical and misanthropic so it's difficult. Like, I really love puppies and kittens for example but whenever I'm watching videos of them, I can't help but imagine how easily some asshole could crush or torture them and my initial sunny feelings of happiness get mixed with hatred and disgust.
Ecstasy seems to sharpen both my positive and negative emotions. I love feeling extra happy and cuddly but it takes only the tiniest negative stimuli to send me into a downward spiral where I have a heart attack. Scary as hell.

 

[Itsgoneundertheboa]

If your getting speedy and paranoid off MDMA then likely it's
A) not for you,
B) you have overdone it
C) haven't got MDMA

Did you not post you are also diagnosed schizophrenic a few weeks ago? Apologies if not but as I think I said back then probably going to be A) if you have now retried and find that your getting bad side effects.

Stay safe

 

[noror]

I think that 5mapb lacks the speedy felling of Md

 

[Wiserthanearlier]

I agree mdea is a much slower version of mdma. Less of some effects, and also much more relaxing!
Dose is higher tho. Needs around 160mg vs around 120mg.

But no change to internal thoughts- specifically, if you sffer paranoia from mdma i dont think it will lesson with mdea.
I miss mdea!

 

[Inds]

If your getting speedy and paranoid off MDMA then likely it's
A) not for you,
B) you have overdone it
C) haven't got MDMA

I do have schizophrenia, yes. That's why it's tricky. But this is the only drug that made me truly happy so I have no other choice. I only wish that it wasn't an amphetamine. But I'm not complaining, just searching and brainstorming for 'the one'. Molly only lets me do her once every 6-8 weeks and she's too wild sometimes. I did my heroine back in the day but I abused her so she left me.
Until I find a better one than molly, she'll have to do. I'm trying to learn how to stay out of her way and just let it happen when she's trying to make me feel good.

I have only overdone it the first time, i did a lower dose the second time. Panic attacks happened but I got them under control and most of the roll was quite nice. I loved the afterglow the next 2 days too, I wish they would last way longer. I do know that I have pure MDMA because I tested it with 6 different reagents like someone recommended over a month ago.

I think that 5mapb lacks the speedy felling of Md

Thanks, I will research this. Anyone on here tried it?

 

[LaGaFàNi]

5-apb is even less stimulating, but the downside is that it lasts +-3h longer than MDMA, and after a while of air contact it reeks of vomit.

 

[Dresden]

Yes, MDAI.

 

[Sir Ron Pib]

Yeah I was thinking MDAI but in truth most don't think it very exciting without adding a stim. I've never tried it without even. 5MAPB was boring but with a stim it was similarly good. stims can on occasion cause paranoia but unless you over dose or are super nervous it's usually a good feeling and the serotonin release on top makes the amphetamine effects mellow and content on the whole. With something like MDAI there is little drive to do anything or communicate with no stim effects (& you don't need to be totally speeding your tit's off, just have positive energy.

 

[opiatekrzy]

granted its base is amphetamine, but in my opinion, without the amphetamine backbone, you would lack the special sensations and the heightened sense of an emotional lift and amplified sensations
it does not feel like an amphetamine at all by any means but it truly does have its synergistic qualities

 

[noror]

If u are interested in such things I strongly recommend 5mapb since I first posted this someone even replied"its boring without a stim" but thst's exactly what u want right?
Additionaly together with 6apb it's ranked amongst bedt emphayogens there are with a significant amount of e-tards ranking it even higher than the original M.
To encourage u even more into research the drug-designer and inventor of mephedron Dr. Zee described it as pure bliss

 

[Inds]

I doubt I'll be able to get my hands on it but I appreciate the info. My hope is it'll become popular and more dealers in my town will sell it. Yes, I'm looking for the best empathogen out there and one that I can take all the time, not once every 2 months like ecstasy. Did you say 5-APB mixed with 6-APB is the best empathogen ever or they both equally are? I looked up mephedrone and it says it's similar to MDMA but the effects are significantly shorter-lasting.
Pure bliss is certainly what I'm looking for but not only for an hour.

 

[noror]

I mentioned that his an inventor of mephedrone but I didn't advised u to take it god forbid! Its a VERY strong stimulant!
Additionaly note that I was talking about 5mapb not 5apb (teo diffrent compounds)
The other one is 6apb(not 6mapb)

They are both one of the best drugs in the emphatogen class with 6apb beeing longer lasting and more psychedelic than mdma and 5mapb being more sedated and with more pronounced empathy than mdma.

All of those drugs have to be spaced though 2-3 months i you want to be REALLY a safe responsible user.

There is but one drug that can be taken all the time with emphatogenic properties. It also is significantly less stimulating than MDMA it's called 2c-b and its a psychedelic similar in it's chemical structure to meskaline so maybe u would want to look into that one.

Enjoy!

 

[noror]

You might want to check out www.psychonautwiki.org there is a class of drugs called emphatogens listed there with all the discriptions. They also have a page desicated to 2c-b

 

[Inds]

Thanks very much noror for all the info, I will look into it. But knowing me I will take forever with my bad attention span, lol. I've read 2 trip reports on that site and they both sound fake but I will indeed look into the technical info.