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I'm uncertain if psychedelics would improve my life or not. Advice?

I don't believe the paper at all when it says, "no study has demonstrated changes in personality in healthy adults after an experimentally manipulated discrete event."

I can't fathom to think that is actually true.

I think personality is just a lazy way to explain behaviour, so therefore my personality must be "disagreeable".

It is utterly ridiculous to think for a moment that having a hot meal or being sleep deprived does not alter someone's "personality". If we are somehow only talking about 14 months worth of change, because that is of course what it takes to "really" alter personality, well... have these "researchers" ever heard of a lobotomy or... well, the entire field they are involved in? As a person who took an intro to psychology class, I have to guess they were not really paying any attention.
 
I don't quite get your issue with personality... as I understand it, personality is simply a way to describe the sum total of a person's unique way of interacting with and seeing the world. Yes, a person's personality is fluid depending on many factors, however, to use your example, each person's personality causes them to react a bit differently to having a hot meal, or being sleep deprived.

And something like a lobotomy, or other forms of brain damage, can certainly drastically alter someone's personality forever, due to brain damage. Everything a person is, was, and ever will be is mediated by the brain's circuitry, so to me this is not inconsistent with the idea of a personality. But excluding brain damage or illness (which is, in essence, damage as well), a person will tend to react to a given stimuli in a similar kind of way.
 
If psychology is meant to be a science then it must have objective observation and standards.

These are not easy things to set up an experiment without.

Shyness is considered a personality trait and it is a matter of how we choose to perceive it. It is cultural. It is like us calling a thing a house or calling a thing hot. To define someone as shy, you poll 10,000 people and ask if they think the person is shy.

No matter how impossible it is to make a fine distinction between personalities, you would believe that personality is a standard? No two people will ever have the same personality or trait. One is considered shy because they are ugly, the other is shy because they have a speech impediment, another was abused. How they are shy is different, each overall person is different. There is no set standard by which a thing is called shy, it is merely a label defined by something else. That something else can be objective.

You might give the term an objective definition, find out certain people answer certain questions a certain way, but then it is not personality, as we know it, that you are measuring.

Can you say we've interacted with personality, to say personality is a thing which exists, which changes. It has no material existence, it is not a law. You can't go in and objectively measure personality, it has to constantly change to remain relevant as our understanding changes.

I can't imagine a person objectively grouping people as nerds or jocks. It is just stupid. Just as there are no races. There are no personalities. You can have traits, a person might be dark skinned, does that make him black? Does that make him fit with other black people? Does a shy person fit with other shy people? Personality is just a mish-mash of non-universal beliefs.
 
Well I agree with the problem with labeling. "Nerd, "jock"... these are silly labels, ridiculously simplistic generalizations which seek to categorize a personality, which is infinitely complex in nature, into a finite group of characteristics. To me, "personality" is simply a term used to describe "person-ness". I completely agree that no two people will ever have the same personality, this is because each and every person is a unique individual, and no one will ever be the same as anyone else. People can have similar traits in their personality (shyness for example), but the sum total of these traits creates a unique individual. I don't believe we are even close to having a full understanding of human personality, nor perhaps will we ever. It's one of those things about the brain that remains shrouded in an immense level of complexity. It's determined by neuron structure, hormones, neurotransmitters, memories and any number of other factors. The sum of these factors is what we refer to as a person's personality, which is the way they view and react to the world around them, the way they think, the way they feel... everything that makes them them.
 
Mushrooms in low doses can apparently be helpful for depression and anxiety but high doses could definitely push a person over the edge. I would never take more than 2 grams personally. Acid could make you very emotional, it does with me. That could be good or bad, depending on how it goes. Sometimes crying over repressed sadness can get a lot of pent up emotions out of your system. For instance normally I never cry at all but on acid I sometimes do just thinking back on things from my life. I felt better afterwards though.
 
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Mushrooms in low doses can apparently be helpful for depression and anxiety but high doses could definitely push a person over the edge. I would never take more than 2 grams personally. Acid could make you very emotional, it does with me. That could be good or bad, depending on how it goes. Sometimes crying over repressed sadness can get a lot of pent up emotions out of your system. For instance normally I never cry at all but on acid I sometimes do just thinking back on things from my life. I felt better afterwards though.

When I did some acid a few weeks ago I saw a video on YouTube by a woman who had lost both legs from just below the knees down, when she was in her prime of life and going to college, because a car plowed into her from behind while she was pushing a car. She was relating a near death experience she had during the accident, which was interesting, but you could tell that she was a mess. She was smoking cigarettes while making the video and she had gotten a little chubby. She looked like a person who had a mental breakdown, which I'm sure she did. But watching her video made me so sad that I cried intensely for a good 15-20 minutes, thinking how unfair her life was. It just struck me as so very sad. I had never cried like that in my life. Also, because the acid made me so emotional and loving everyone I commented that I wanted God to take her suffering and put it on me instead and told her i loved her so much. She never replied. I don't know if my sympathy helped her or not, probably on some level. Wow, that video was so sad I still feel bad thinking about it. You could tell she had been so beautiful in her younger days. It was so sad to see what losing her legs had reduced her to. Maybe God did put her emotional suffering on me and that was what made me cry like that. Maybe her suffering was less after that moment and she became normal again mentally. You just never know.

Here, I found the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkM5lWw42-Y&list=UUcYx9ipHs6p93gS1x0-BRvA . It's quite possibly the saddest video ever made. Do NOT watch this video on acid, trust me on this. Sure, she looks kinda skanky but you probably would too if you had her life and were all doped up on prescription meds, which she appears to be, unless she's just drunk.

That's sweet of you that you were moved like that. You might enjoy a career as a caregiver.
 
First, well done spotting the contradiction between the therapeutic use of psychedelics and the adage that one shouldn't take them unless mentally stable.

The less 'stable' your mind, the greater the risks. It's up to you to take stock of your psyche, and decide whether it's worth it. I frequently have suicidal thoughts both in and out of trips, but I've made a very firm decision to stick with it because I feel what I get out of it is worthwhile. It may be that the goal is not happiness, but some deeper level of insight. I cannot say whether this insight would still seem worth it if I suffered from psychotic delusions or bipolar disorder.

Using hallucinogens for healing and for spiritual purposes is not like taking prescriptive medication, it's more like climbing dangerous mountains in the hope that the peak will be worth it. This is a big part of the reason, I feel, why they are not yet accepted by wider society, which prefers to hold fast to illusions of safety like a baby to a pacifier. I don't believe they're for everyone, and I believe sugarcoating this can only lead to bad things. In the end, it's up to you to be as informed as possible, and make the call.

I feel it's worth noting that, since we live in a reality based around survival that is full of suffering, and since we've been born to a very, very sick society, almost no one is truly mentally stable. As such I believe that pretty much everyone will inevitably experience the dark side at some point if they dabble with psychedelics. How this manifests - with what frequency, and intensity, and in what form - will depend on the person in question. The best advice I can give is to embrace it when it does crop up. You'll learn the most from your journeys this way, and you cannot hope to reconcile the shadow side of life without at some point turning to face it. Also, know yourself; hallucinogens are often by far the most unforgiving way you can experience this side of things. If you think it might be more than you can handle, put it aside for something gentler instead, like meditation. Or at least tread very lightly.
 
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Thanks for all the replies.
I am already a very analytical and introspective person, and I'm ready to face my issues and deal with them. If anyone reading has used psychedelics for the same purposes I am, what did you use and what was your experience? Did it help you? Is one or two trips sufficient for lasting effects?
 
Hey man. You are great for coming here and asking these very important questions. You are approaching this journey with the right mindset already. If you have a place in the woods or outside somewhere that you could take this journey that would be the best. I strongly recommend mushrooms over LSD especially if you might have some family history of bi-polar.

I have the same fears about being bi-polar (had to 51-50 my mom a couple years ago, she is bipolar type 1; and i've been tentatively diagnosed as bi-polar type 2) and I've eaten my body weight in mushrooms with no negative effect. However LSD is a different story entirely. There is much more mind-fuck, for me at least, with LSD and it was much harder to handle (then again my set and setting were garbage). Mushrooms have always had a grounding effect and although they certainly make me feel "crazy" ... they also make you feel in touch with our nature.

Eat some mushrooms. Go outside. Enjoy.
 
I am already a very analytical and introspective person, and I'm ready to face my issues and deal with them.

Great way to start.

what did you use and what was your experience?

Mushrooms: a wild card, especially at high doses. Approach with extreme caution and respect.
LSD: very comfortable and lucid substance, great for catharsis and for artistic insight. LSA (morning glory / Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds) is almost identical.
Mescaline: deeply therapeutic and benevolent experiences - it's a very gentle spirit, nothing can go wrong.
Ayahuasca: as profound as it is brutal.
Cannabis: dreamy, creative, weird, and excellent for making the imagination more vivid especially in terms of empathy - very functional and great to join with other hallucinogens.
All of these: changed my life and will forever be part of my spirituality.

Did it help you?

Yes.

Is one or two trips sufficient for lasting effects?

Most likely. Your first experience will probably have a profound effect on you. It's always smart to start with a low dose just in case. I didn't intend for my first trip to be the reality-crushing mind-fucking supernova that it was. I found however that I quickly became accustomed to the surreal nature of the experiences. While none of them have ever been as powerful as the first, this is not to say they too did not have a lasting impact. But if you're asking because you're thinking of only doing it once or twice, well, do that and see how you feel after.

john bishop said:
I've eaten my body weight in mushrooms

Heh. You're a braver man than me.
 
I feel it's worth noting that, since we live in a reality based around survival that is full of suffering, and since we've been born to a very,th sick society, almost no one is truly mentally stable. As such I believe that pretty much everyone will inevitably experience the dark side at some point if they dabble with psychedelics. How this manifests - with what frequency, and intensity, and in what form - will depend on the person in question. The best advice I can give is to embrace it when it does crop up. You'll learn the most from your journeys this way, and you cannot hope to reconcile the shadow side of life without at some point turning to face it. Also, know yourself; hallucinogens are often by far the most unforgiving way you can experience this side of things. If you think it might be more than you can handle, put it aside for something gentler instead, like meditation. Or at least tread very lightly.
We rush so far into things without clear reasons.

The lessons I learned from taking psychedelics are certainly different from what you are taking about.

What I have learned without is such a great number that I never stop to count them really.

I began using psychedelics after alcohol, cigarettes, marijuana (in that order) and then stayed mostly with lsd and mushrooms, but dabbled once or twice with LSA, cocaine, opium, nitrous, duster, DXM.

This time period was the growth of friends and a little independence. I felt happier and there was this hill to climb I could not see ahead of me. School sucked the life out of me, I thought life was like a game and that I would escape this game and gain control over my life. Life was/is a bit like a prison, well at least you can dream in a prison.

I did not keep a journal of my use or read message boards, although my friend made use of erowid for the now defunct LSA extraction, and I had an experienced friend who regularly introduced people to psychedelics. I knew about things like speed and LSD from friends I had known that used. I had been warned a few times as well about taking too much. Anyhow. I was at that point in my life where I didn't know what I wanted but I knew it was something more than what I had.

My friends mostly were marijuana users as well and nobody seemed to have a bad view of drugs who had actually experienced them. Of course, that wasn't entirely true. But you can easily find people who think 100 hits of LSD is just perfect. I was tough and brave, so I did more with each use, but it was not an immediate bad reaction, it was at least a week after I had last used. I was pretty trippy by that point in time.

I was never any good at keeping up with rumours or impressing people. I had trouble making friends, probably not easy going, probably judgemental, not big on personal hobbies. I always felt behind in some regard compared to the way other people would seem to be doing at life. Happier, more money, more friends. I wanted a way out of this maze.

I made a mistake when I chose to try achieving something with psychedelics. Believing they would aid me in meditation and open my mind to some secret knowledge. Again, I did not know what I was heading toward.

I feel now back to normal, how I was years ago before taking that leap. Don't let people tell you there is no such thing as normal. My body and mind found there way back to it.

I see much of what I had for what it was now, and I see the lies I was told for what they are. Nothing changes. I have only learned to accept who I am. I feel years of my life were wasted by drugs. I had never believed anything bad I had heard about them until experiencing it for myself. I did not really believe the mysticism of drug use either, but the idea was compelling and seeing beyond the so-called veil of illusion interested me.

Things did indeed go very very wrong and this is not the thing where, oh you know, that is just what I needed to learn that harsh lesson so I could grow, as some might belief be, no... it was boring and stupid, I couldn't think straight, my memory was shot, I was fucking messed up in the head. So I quit with the drugs and got my head on straight, finally.

I enjoy life about as much as I always had, good days and depressing ones, except I am older and have worked out my interests and my slow approach to life, the care I take with others. I have learned to accept myself and others. The limits all humans are faced with.

Personally I require little bit of yoga, which helps me be aware of my body, and a little meditation, which helps me focus for the remainder of the day. That clears me up as I try to live up to my expectations.

I hope this is not too long or repetitive. I suggest to anyone, learn what evidence based science is all about.
 
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Does evidence based science make you feel as good as mushrooms tho pmose?
 
We are unique but at the same time we are all human.

....

Mushrooms can make me feel a few things, depending on what else is happening, such as intensely whimsical. Evidence based science is not like that; to me it seems that science has accomplished what mysticism dreamed about, regardless of the actual feeling I get from it.

...

Shimmerchasm,

You may want to talk more, but you already listen. Something way more important than talking. Communication is talking, listening, and having something worth sharing. You may not say anything at all but still be communicating better than most.

I hopefully understand your frustration and wish you the best of luck. I think what helped me communicate the most was opening up about what I was feeling without having it turned into a joke of some kind. You might talk more than you realize, or you may not really be missing out on as much as you believe.

Pay attention to any feeling you may have when trying to talk: tight stomach, sweaty palms. That might be an indication you feel threatened or intimidated when speaking. If you feel dizzy, short of breathe, you might be hesitating too much. Whatever it is, just blurting out whatever pops into your head might be a good place to start. Then think about what you said afterwards.
 
@pmoseman: On the contrary, evidence-based science paints a very pretty picture of hallucinogens. This is not to discredit your experience--I believe that it is all too real. But don't jump to the conclusion that just because your opinion and the law are opposed to the use of hallucinogens, the scientific community is as well.
 
pmose; Thanks for sharing your experience(s).

It may be contradictory to what most people on here want to hear as you aren't providing them with confirmation bias by having an opinion similar to their own.

I for one found it insightful and a valid contribution towards debating the OPs original question.
 
Pmose: thanks for sharing your experience. I'm really sorry you went through such a rough time. Everyone has to figure out their own path. I'm not really interested in taking any of these substances often at all or without respect and reverence. From what I have gathered it seems that people run into trouble when they take psychedelics too lightly. They certainly are not for everyone!
 
All kinds of good things happening in this thread :D

set and setting is a real thing.

I tried finding a report of someone who reverently approached a psychedelic journey with respect and paid attention to their set and setting and then had anything less than an amazing experience or at worst a great learning experience. I can't find any negative reports like this.

How many times in Native American (north or south) culture did somebody have a bad or negative journey. Probably never. What an amazing set and setting that must've been. We have to work a bit harder to create ours but you can do it. Highly recommend some form of cacti or mushrooms. :D
 
Evidence based science is not like that; to me it seems that science has accomplished what mysticism dreamed about, regardless of the actual feeling I get from it.

What has taking mushrooms got to do with mysticism? Taking mushrooms is the diametric opposite of mysticism. You arn't trusting the word of a "mystic", the experience is between you and the mushroom. Don't confuse psychedelics with man-made religion.

How many times in Native American (north or south) culture did somebody have a bad or negative journey. Probably never.

I don't think so John. For a start psychedelics wern't used by everyone in the village in the same way we use them - it wasn't like some pre-historic hippie commune. They were pretty much solely used by the "shaman" purely for medical diagnosis. Wasson describes a typical Maria Sabina mushroom session where she is taking mushrooms to find out whether or not a retarded kid is going to die - she takes the mushrooms in front of the kid and his family and then says "Yes, he's going to die" whereupon his family start sobbing and wailing in misery and fear. That sounds like about as bad a setting you could ever imagine to me. Certainly far worse than anything modern users experience.

And there were exactly the same fears and prejudicies about mushroom use among natives - Maria Sabina describes being found by her parents as a child after she'd taken mushrooms and she says "My parents didn't scold me because they knew scolding someone on mushrooms could drive them mad".
 
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Honestly, it's doubtful that psychs would improve your life any. You may be looking for something that psychs just can't supply. The only benefit of a psych trip to me is that it breaks up the monotony of life. Can't say it really helps much beyond that. At first it was pretty amazing, with great visuals and stuff, but now I don't even get those kind of visuals anymore. I think the 25c may have altered my brain chemistry in such a way that I can never get those kind of visuals again, no matter what drug I take. Even quality acid didn't do much for me visually recently. I got high, yeah, but not like in my earlier years pre-RC use.

At your stage in life, it may be rewarding. I can't tell you it wouldn't be. Just be careful to be in non-threatening settings and preferably with as few other people around as possible. When there's a bunch of people around there's a pretty good chance that at least one of them could cause you some anxiety. There's always some wingnut around at the worst possible time it seems. I wouldn't take psychs as a party thing. You don't want to be in hectic environments on them.
 
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