I'm the mom of a son in recovery and would appreciate any/all advice. Thank you.

MomCares

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No idea if I'm doing this correctly... here goes: My son is in recovery. He used Imodium to get through initially, and is in counseling. He is scheduled with a medical doc for suboxone. He says the initial part is over (about six weeks) but he still feels sick and "beat up" and he explained and I have read a lot on line about suboxone. I think this is a good idea for a short term assist? But I don't want him to become dependent upon that next! Any thoughts? Also, I know I am naive but can anyone tell me how long it takes before the cravings are gone and before he will feel "normal" again? At what point in the future do we "trust" him? Right now he is working part time but I am having him give all of his salary to me and I dole it out like a teenager's allowance. Or I have him use a credit card for most expenses and I see the bill so I know where the money goes. And NO cash advances allowed. Is my doing this helping or hurting? We want to be a supportive family but really don't understand fully what we should do, how much we should do, etc. He is in his 20s and has a recent college degree, so his future is there, waiting for him. We want him to succeed, and he seems genuine that he wants to be well and succeed. I would appreciate any/all advice anyone wants to share. Thank you.
 
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hi hope you're doing okay coping with it..my advice would be for him to just get over the addiction he has and I'd advise not to go on suboxone yes it keeps you off the other stuff but it's just a substitute for another drug you know..I'm 25 years old and personally for me the best thing I've ever done was go to an aa or na meetings..they change your life and make you a better person I swear by them..and remember to tell him drinking is a drug once us addicts use drugs we can't drink because the drink turns into the drug..if he is hurting or withdrawing maybe using suboxone for a week at the MOST two weeks so he doesn't become physically dependent..I wish you the best and will pray for you and your son!
 
and what drug was he using because I am an addict of every kind so I kind of no a lot about the withdrawal process and time line..
 
and also..if he's been off whatever for 6 weeks he shouldn't be physically withdrawing unless he was using a strong drug such as methadone..or has been using for a very very long time..
 
^
I would give him more time to get back on his feet. We don't know why he was using and it may have been a coping mechanism for dealing with stress. Throwing him into a stressful situation when he is already saying that he still doesn't feel back to normal yet is a recipe for relapse.

Another run back on dope and he might be in his late 20's with severe debt and maybe an arrest record before he gets back to this point again.


To MomCares, the more info you provide us will give us better answers. What drugs was he using? How long was he using them for? Do you know how much he was using on a daily basis?

No one here is going to be able to tell you when you'll be able to trust him again. He might do really well for a while, but there is always going to be a chance for relapse. The more time away from using is important. In the time away he has to try to rebuild his life so that he has things that he wouldn't want to lose, but would lose, if he started using again. Get a job he likes, get into a relationship (eventually, wouldn't rush into one so close to getting off drugs), have caring friends who aren't drug users, etc.

If he's in his early 20's and has been using for a few years it's probable that he may not really know who is yet. This could be a time where he grows an identity and figures out who he is and what he wants out of this life.

I also suggest maybe getting this thread movied to The Dark Side or you should try posting in the Dark Side.


BTW, I think it's great that you're trying to learn more about this and are seeking out answers from people who have gone through addiction.
 
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He should really just start getting exercise, etc to have natural endorphins. Taking suboxone at this point would just be prolonging the difficulty (if it's true he's been clean for 6 weeks).
 
At 6 weeks he is over the worst of his physical withdrawals. Suboxone will be a serious step backwards in his recovery. If you lurk around here you will find more than our fair share of suboxone addicts who started using with every intention of tapering off quickly, yet now struggle to make that final leap. Don't be disappointed if he slips up, it happens to many trying to recover.

The lethargy and sickness will not last forever. Soon 6 weeks will be 12. 6 months will arrive in a flash. By introducing suboxone you are only delaying the day when he can look back and feel free again. The best you can do is keep him occupied and keep him away from temptation. Controlling his finances is a good idea, if nothing else so he has to be accountable for his actions until he himself feels in control again
 
If your son thinks he needs suboxone to stay off the street drugs than you should support him. Just make sure he has his eyes wide open to the downsides of suboxone. The withdrawals last 20-30 days and can be quite intense. The idea of a short stay on suboxone is pretty unlikely as physical addiction will set in very quickly. Suboxone is a long term choice in someone in his situation.
 
This is really so sweet! I know my mom would never think to find a harm reduction forum like bluelight to ask questions like this if I ever slipped into addiction.

Anyways, its hard to give a definite answer to questions like "when will he feel normal again?" and "when can we trust him again?" since its obviously dependant on how long he has abusing drugs for, what he was abusing, and of course his personality. Six weeks clean is fantastic news and a great start to recovery, but its just the beginning. It can take people months or years to fully recover from a drug addiction and there's only so much you can do to speed up the process.

I avoid contradicting with the advice or opinions of a medical professional, since everything I know about drugs is anecdotal/personal experience, but like others have said the suboxone might cause more trouble than its worth.

It sounds like you're doing everything you can as a parent to help him without "babying" him too much, so props to you! The most important thing for him is to have a supportive friend/family group that wants to help him through his addiction rather than alienate him for it.
 
if it's heroin or any short acting opiate you're fine after a week or two ..experienced at this been through it I think he needs to work a program such as aa or na hard to stay sober yourself...and no don't cut him off yet give him a chance but trust issues depend on if he's trying to get help or what..could be atleast a month of him stable enough to have cash because I've had cash early in recovery and kind of was a trigger for me. just my experience.
 
I can't believe so many replied so soon. Thank you. This is all new to me, and perhaps I didn't explain properly. He is not actually detoxing anymore, but is having what his therapist says is PAWS. He is an IOP program, has therapy. I'm being educated about "triggers" and how suboxone might help him. But as I said, the doc I spoke to is very conservative and can put him on a two to four week sub program. The IOP supports this treatment plan. Other than that, I have to become a bit more familiar with the site before I feel confident enough to share more details. I'm going to do a lot of reading on this site. Perhaps I'll find answers to my questions without having to actually post more details about my family's situation specifically. At least so far, it seems like most everyone who responds is very well intended. To the person who said to cut him off: no. Family stands with family. We will stand by him and do everything his doc and therapist tell us to do. He is aware that if he uses again we will not have him in the house, but we will not put him on the street, either. In that case he would have to check himself into a hospital to detox and be placed in an inpatient rehab after that. I would rather pay for his therapy and possible inpatient rehab than pay for his funeral.
 
MomCares, so good to see a mom who is doind what she can and helping. Wow, I could write a short book for you. My bro got into meth at age 19 and my parents finally offered to pay for his rehab, but other than that, they acted like nothing was going on. My bro stole from all of us and was a huge sponge. I lost track of how many times my parents let him move back in with them...and not pay any rent or anything! Yes, your son is family and you would do anything for him, but really ask yourself if you are helping or are you making it easier for him to keep his habit going? My "family user" always threatened suicide, and it worked on my parents every time. He knew it would work.

LONG story short is that youre both in a rough situation. I had the same 'felt like I got neat up' feelings. And I hate to say it, but the mental part is horrible. I mean physical detox is insanely horrible too, but I got big time anxiety, and I would want to reach for my meds to prepare a dose despite not having the meds anymore! It is so weird. Maybe the worst is when you're sitting around bored and you are stir crazy,so you just want to get that high again soooo badly! It is all you think about at times, and it is hard as hell to fight it and win. That is why the relapse percentage for most drugs is SO high. It is a nasty thing to fight. As far as you, keep up the good work with support. I felt great when somebody would tell me how good I was doing, or tell me to keep kicking ass. Remind your son that thingsWILL get so much better. Also, he will get his normal functioning receptors back....basically he will once again have the ability to be happy, get excited, be interested in things etc as his brain adjusts back.

Things I would deter you from doing would be giving him money, let him sponge off of you, let him live at your house for as long as he wants and/or whenever he wants, and any stealing = bye bye. You absolutely must bust out tough love. Remember, you are saving his his life. Worst thing he can do when he is done would be to sit at your house and do nothing. That total boredom and depression turn to "i want to get high". Please unxertand that I love that you are doing all of this research and being there for him etc! Hopefully he is one of the few that wont relapse, so you wont have to worry about going down that nightmare road with him.
 
First, youre a great mom!

I think what youre doing is absolutely correct. Cutting off or throwing out an addict is often a 50-50 shot or worse. Its so much easier to get through such things with family and people you can talk to and lean on. Feeling rejected and sad, an addict will quickly turn back to drugs to lift his spirits if hes thrown out. It doesnt matter if he has no money, at least for a while, one always finds some. If its an illegal source, then that might mean getting a record which just ruins so many future options. Hard love can pay off sure but it is an extremely sensitive and circumstantial thing to pursue with an addict and unless youre absolutely certain about what youre doing I wouldnt try it. Especially in your case at this stage.
About money, I agree with you. Its necessary you dole out his money and check expenses. But dont (as with most things) or at least try not to do it with an angry, nonconditional approach. What I mean is, talk to him about it so he knows youre doing it because you care and you want to find the best solution for him together with him and his suggestions (and in general, one of the most important things with addicts is to be NONjudgemental, the moment he feels like youre looking at him sideways or constantly judging him whether he is good or bad etc.. he will feel the need to hide things from you, omit things in conversation etc.. Drugs are so prevalent in todays society, it can happen to our loved ones so fast, you never know how bad its gonna be and trust me that he doesnt really want to be an addict). This might not work with many kids, if theyre rebelious or unexperienced or angry etc.. But your kid is a college educated kid, I assume he will comprehend how this is best for him and listen to reason. So make him agree with you, this is the best way, ask him whether he has a better option and so on(have arguments prepared). But if you think he might not, that he might behave angry or he might feel trapped and pushed in a corner and you cannot turn it around, them you might need to be a bit more agressive with your suggestions.

Also the thing with subox. or any drug is that after a while, its difficult to function without it. So its great that you have a conservative doc. in that aspect, the best option here is definitely for him to go on a limited program. How long depends a lot on him, until he feels comfortable and doesnt crave (opiates I assume) anymore. One problem I often notice with subox. programs is that doctors have no idea how high a dosage is correct and overprescribe 10x over the dose. But I think with a conservative doc. that wont be the case hopefully.

And also, in my opinion and I think many others, one of the very problematic things is free time with regards to addiction. You need to keep his schedule busy. Free time is great if youre around him or if you know what hes doing. Too much thinking in these early stage too often leads to thinking how great it would feel. Just a little bit. Time can move so slow when youre getting sober. And then the rationalization begins. Try to make him to hang out with friends, the ones that dont use drugs. I know that is difficult to know but moms have a great instinct(Id trust it if I were you) about who is good or bad for their kid. If you dont know them, ask him about it, in these early stages if nothing else, he might still be remorseful enough to tell you with complete honesty about them :) .
Also spend time with him as a family. Have fun together. And like others have said, exercise. Lots and lots of exercise if possible, it works marvels on the brain and getting the brain chemistry back into balance.
And do please come back and ask further questions if you feel the need, its why this is here basically ?


and just love your kid and be nice with him, trust me he will respond better and feel a lot worse if he does sth stupid in comparison if youre angry and judgemental, then he might do it out of spite or anger or it just might serve his rationalization in some way why to relapse.

good luck
 
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P.S. My parents finally worked up the courage to tell him that he wasnt welcome in their house. He was pawning their stuff and taking money etc. It killed them to do it but they had to quit being a tool that actually helped support his habit by letting him stay there. They told him he was welcome to visit anytime and to come eat dinner, but he had to go, even if it was to an open door mission.
 
Hey mom cares and welcome yo BL:D

I'm being educated about "triggers" and how suboxone might help him. But as I said, the doc I spoke to is very conservative and can put him on a two to four week sub program.

This seems like a very misguided idea.

There are three possible outcomes to this.
1) your son gets on suboxone and stays on it for a long time, until he makes the unbelievable committed push to get off it. People who are on suboxone for years can have acute withdrawal that last months and can experience significant long lasting paws.

2) your son gets on suboxone for a reasonable period of a year or two and uses this time to rebuild his life and then has to make the incredible push to get off and go through the acutes and the PAWS.

3) Your son experiences a few weeks of reduced cravings and inability to use. This will be followed by at least a two week acute detox. After this detox he will be the exact same spot physically he was in when he finished the original detox. He will have whatever knowledge he gained in IOP, but as far as physical dependence he will be right back to where he was six weeks ago.

Many people get confused with opiate physical dependence and put far to much emphasis on different opiates. When looking at opiate detoxification we need to remove all opiates from the system and then allow the brain to return to homeostasis.

This is done in two stages.. The acute withdrawal and the PAWS.

Your son is now in the PAWS stage. If you stimulate the opiate receptors with the suboxone he will loose all the time he has struggled so hard to get. He will return to the beginning of the tunnel.

As has been stated the half life of suboxone is very long. To get through acutes our bodies must eliminate the drug from our system and then we wait around four days for the brain to re regulate back homeostasis without the drug. With suboxone this takes at least two weeks.

Once he makes it through that he will find himself back at the beginning of the PAWS.

The length of PAWS varies from person to person. There are also many things a person can do to make their time in PAWS shorter and much more bearable.

Here is some great information on PAWS as well as some information on what we can do to make it as short and as enjoyable as possible. A very good average is under eight months... So he already almost 1/5 of the way through. Many people also get out much earlier.

PAWS LINKS
Why We Don’t Get Better Immediately: Post-acute Withdrawal Syndrome (PAWS)
Post Acute Withdrawal (PAW) Excerpted From “Staying Sober” By: Terence T. Gorski
Post-acute-withdrawal syndrome Wiki

Exercise and Brain Neurotransmission
Neurobiology of Exercise
Exercise 4 Health, Mental Health, and Addiction vs. The Endorphin Factory
Exercise 4 Health, Mental Health, and Addiction vs. I worked all that out
exercise and sleep

Chemicals and supplements to recover from opiate addiction
Diet & Neurogenesis


it is a powerful thing to keep our thoughts possitive and here are some threads many of us use to help us do this.
Managing depressive thinking
Good things about being off drugs/getting sober
Share Something Positive from Your Day vs. It's All Around You
Today I Am Thankful For... Ver. 4 Infinite Chances in an Amazing World

Here is the mindfulness thread.
Anhedonia MEGA Thread


He can do this.. he sounds like he is doing pretty good. If he does not plan on doing suboxone maintenance for a period of time then I WOULD NEVER think of going on it for a few weeks.. really thats insanity and i'm very surprised that a physician would even consider doing that. 8(


I hope this information helps and that your son makes a full recovery and leads a peaceful and rewarding life:)
 
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No idea if I'm doing this correctly... here goes: My son is in recovery. He used Imodium to get through initially, and is in counseling. He is scheduled with a medical doc for suboxone. He says the initial part is over (about six weeks) but he still feels sick and "beat up" and he explained and I have read a lot on line about suboxone. I think this is a good idea for a short term assist? But I don't want him to become dependent upon that next! Any thoughts? Also, I know I am naive but can anyone tell me how long it takes before the cravings are gone and before he will feel "normal" again? At what point in the future do we "trust" him? Right now he is working part time but I am having him give all of his salary to me and I dole it out like a teenager's allowance. Or I have him use a credit card for most expenses and I see the bill so I know where the money goes. And NO cash advances allowed. Is my doing this helping or hurting? We want to be a supportive family but really don't understand fully what we should do, how much we should do, etc. He is in his 20s and has a recent college degree, so his future is there, waiting for him. We want him to succeed, and he seems genuine that he wants to be well and succeed. I would appreciate any/all advice anyone wants to share. Thank you.

you sound like a very sweet lady... i know i put my mother through hell and she wouldnt give up on me and it prob saved my life... but i just completed my IOP program this past week and it helped me out soooo much, and ive been clean for four weeks this sunday, im over the physical withdraw symptoms but i still have the cravings soo bad and in WVA theres such a shortage of docs who can write scripts for suboxone its not even an option for me, its usually a 5-6 month wait... but like alot of other people have said it can become very addiciting and while i was in detox i saw ppl in there who were addicted to subutex and said that the WDs lasted upto a month... as far as the trust part, its hard to say... everyones different and i guess it just takes time and the will to prove that hes a different person, i know it will take a long time for me to rebuild the trust ive lost... but you seem to be do everything right and the most important thing is to never give up on him, at my IOP they always say a relapse isnt a failure its just a set back and that its very common for ppl in early recovery... anyways its very obvious that you care alot about your son and i hope everything goes well for him and your family, i know the struggle hes going through and its hands down the hardest thing ive ever done... good luck
 
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