I'm a veteran user of dissociatives. Could you relate LSD/Shrooms to me?

[phew]

I've done:
- DXM (MANY, MANY TIMES.)
- Nitrous (alone & w/dxm)
- MJ (alone & w/dxm)
- JWH-018 (w/dxm)
- LSA (alone & w/dxm)
- Salvia (alone & w/dxm)
- E (low dose w/dxm)
- Diphenhydramine (alone & w/dxm)

I understand tripping. I've had many experiences ranging from the bizarre to the profound. CEV, OEV, OOBE, you name it. I've experienced a wide variation of trips.

My creativity when tripping is through the roof. I sing, I act, I write, I draw.

Now, am I to believe that even with such a deep understanding of tripping (I have even broken through on Salvia), I still won't be able to "get" what tripping on LSD/Shrooms is like?

I've read erowid and I have a faint idea, but is there anyone here who's familiar with DXM and LSD/Shrooms who can relate them? Erowid's trip reports don't explain it directly, more like impressions. I'd like to understand what it's like compared to what I've experienced. What would LSD be like in terms of DXM?


For instance:
DXM and Salvia share the phenomenon of creating vivid, realistic environments when the eyes are closed and they both are capable of producing out of body experiences. The difference is that with DXM, you're aware that you're tripping. With Salvia, there is intense confusion.

DXM usually has an "alien" feel to it. Salvia has an "other dimension" type of feel.

 

[phew]

I just saw this video and people are saying "This is what it's like to be on acid."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSMCRD35ch4

Is that true, or just exaggeration? His videos are quite trippy. I'm wondering what drug high they most resemble.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FavUpD_IjVY (Cows... trippy in a WTF sense)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0Xa4bHcJu8 (Teddy bears... REALLY trippy)

The teddy bears video makes me think of diphenhydramine+DXM CEVs or the dreams you get after tripping on Diph. Random and nonsensical. I also want to say I get a Salvia vibe from the teddy video... but I don't know why...

DXM isn't as mathematical as any of these videos, for me.

I've seen one video where a guy was looking in a mirror and seeing his face get distorted, That seemed legit, because I've had something similar happen on DXM (but my head was shrinking and distorting).

 

[rollingstoned!]

One way to explain LSD is that my mind works always at 1000 thoughts a second. However, I only consciously know 2 or 3 of these thoughts a second, because the other 997 thoughts are met with expected results as a result of being conditioned. On a high dose of LSD, my mind begins to "unravel". The 1000 thoughts a second begins to "slow" down to 1 thought (Not a second though! Time has no meaning on cid. That's why slow is in quotes, because in "real" time my mind is probably working faster than normal. Kind of confusing, I know).

Anyway, LSD destroys the expected results from being conditioned causing one to suddenly think in ways that were not previously possible. You also hallucinate and get distortions, but this is a secondary effect IMO.

 

[wtblife]

Hard to say, shrooms usually takes me away more than acid. Shrooms seem to distort stuff more while acid colors stuff in and makes more major hallucinations grow from it for the most part, but there is still some shroom-like stuff and you can lose reality still. I once tore my arm off on acid, but my arm was still there and I was just holding a third arm that I had fun hitting stuff with like a club, I also kept imagining myself in a different place than I was and I could switch between the two areas.

I don't know how to relate it to dxm though, I've only done it a few times :-\

 

[rpm]

In answer to the original poster, it's very hard to compare psychadelics to dissasociatives. To me they seem to make things more high resolution. They can also be confusing and make change the way you percieve the world. On high doses they can be quite earth shattering, without the mental fuzzyness that goes along with dissasociatives.

I'd genneraly say mushrooms are more of a "teacher". They tend to take you places. I also find them more three dimensional and textured than acid.

Acid I find gives me more energy, and the hullucinations are more detailed (such as seeing peopel jump out of pictures ect). I'd recomend acouple of hits for a concert or some such. On higher doses I find them more crazy than mushrooms, delusions, strange occurances and lack of control (or what seems like control at the time but looking back on it not) are all common for me.

Hope this helps and happy triping

 

[Jesusgreen]

Imo it's impossible to really relate psychedelics to dissociatives. Take diphenhydramine and DXM for example, diphenhydramine is a deliriant, it's effects are EXTREMELY different from those of DXM, so comparing it wouldn't really work - the same goes for say Mushrooms and DXM.

A quick run up of hallucinogens:

- Deliriants = No "ecstatic" euphoria, visuals are very realistic - people/objects appearing, audio hallucinations are also quite realistic, voices, etc - however they are usually not consistent, one dose could one time have you in a room with 20 people that aren't really there, then the same dose a few weeks later could simply make you tired. About the one good thing I've found with deliriants is they seem to have zero effect on the ability to get an erection and to achieve orgasm - orgasm is also very pleasant on them even though they have no real euphoria of their own. In my opinion these aren't spiritually or recreationally useful - but they're something you should try, interesting to say the least.

- Dissociatives = Some euphoria, mainly a mental high rather than a body high. Emotions and physical sensation are numbed, causing you to have a neutral perception of the world. OEVs usually aren't very noticeable, however there are some remarkable OEVs such as objects appearing to change size or colour, "films" of memories/future events appearing in front of your eyes, and at very high doses some dissociatives can give full OOBEs where it appears you have even left this world behind. CEVs are there for some people and not others, seemingly not very consistent, but interesting. Not particularly visual drugs though - it is mainly the headspace and physical sensations that make these interesting, they are both recreationally and spiritually useful - as they both teach, and provide classic "ecstatic" feelings of euphoria - though not quite as intense as psychedelics or stimulants if you prefer a body high. Regarding the sexual side of things, I've never had so much as the slightest hint of sexual desire on dissociatives, maybe it's just me but they seem to take my mind off sex entirely and the numbness would wake it very difficult to say the least.

- Psychedelics = Intense body high, interesting visuals which differ a lot from chemical to chemical. OEVs can range from things appearing different in size, colour, texture, etc - or things moving/waving/morphing, among many other different OEVs that can occur. CEVs are usually intense and consistent from trip to trip - with some chemicals having more vivid CEVs than others, the nature of the CEVs varies from drug to drug and from trip to trip, and in my experience the CEVs dramatically every few seconds - which I don't find the case with dissociatives usually. All your senses are heightened, you will be able to see detail you previously never noticed, hear background noises you never knew were there, taste additional flavours in food, feel increased tactile sensations like with MDMA and other entactogens, etc. You will usually have an increased empathy for others, though some psychedelic drugs do not work well around other people and may cause you to get paranoid and scared - the empathy is usually still there though, you'd just rather be alone. I find psychedelics to be very sexual in their nature - at least when tripping alone, just listening to music can increase sexual desire tenfold, and while getting and maintaining an erection isn't usually too difficult - reaching orgasm can take what seems like forever, which, as you can imagine, while tripping, is quite frustrating. A very useful class of drugs for spiritual uses, recreational uses, enhancing creativity, introspection, and many other things.

I place Dissociatives and Psychedelics on about an equal level but each is better at different things. For pure introspection I would probably prefer a nice dose of Ketamine to psychedelics, but for creativity or a spiritual learning experience I would definitely go with Psychedelics - plus, in my experience, they're a lot more euphoric, as the body high is utterly amazing.

 

[phew]

Excellent post, but I respectfully disagree with your assessment of deliriants vs dissociatives.

Diphenhydramine and DXM do have some similarities. These are only realized after repeated experiences of various doses for each drug.

Both DPH and DXM elicit bizarre, unusual behavior. It becomes highly amusing to "act out."

Both DPH and DXM have strong music enhancement (I'm told that neither compare to LSD/Shrooms even on their best day -- truth?). They also increase musical creativity. DPH more so than DXM! DPH makes you burst out into song--FREQUENTLY. Excessively. Also, your ideas are extremely unusual. DXM makes you really get into the music and improvising on it is great.

Time dilation can be extreme on both. (Once again, I'm told that this doesn't compare to LSD/Shroom time dilation).

As for differences... DXM is definitely more psychedelic than DPH. The visuals from DPH become fantasy based once you've become accustomed to the drug. At that point, they become art-like. But not psychedelic. Think courage the cowardly dog, but with real people. That's DPH for me.

I prefer high dose tripping on DXM to DPH, but it's not practical, unfortunately. DXM + Nitrous is godly.

I can't wait to see how creative I am on LSD/Shrooms vs DXM/DPH. I wonder if it will be a different kind of creativity or a better kind of creativity.

 

[Jesusgreen]

I agree that they do have similarities, but I think they have more differences than similarities. If you found deliriants to be creative, well I think you have a pleasant surprise in store when you try psychedelics. Don't be disappointed if the creativity isn't there your first time though, my first couple of experiences didn't have that as I was too taken aback by the magic of the drugs to even think about doing anything creative - however now I find psychedelics to be an AMAZING tool in that department.

It's interesting you mention time dilation, I find psychedelics to have much more time dilation than deliriants, however I find high dose Ketamine slows down time much more - with minutes seeming like hundreds of years in extreme cases - however, then again, I have yet to explore high dose psychedelics in the same amounts as I have high dose Ketamine, and in my couple of truly high dose psychedelic experiences the time dilation did equal that of Ketamine - in fact, one high dose 4-AcO-DMT experience led to me believing time had stopped altogether.

I never refer to deliriants or dissociatives as psychedelic, simply because there are three classes for a reason, psychedelics, dissociatives, and deliriants. While I understand the comparison, I too made the same comparison and having now had experience with psychedelics I find comparing them to be a waste of time, each of the three classes has their good points and their bad points, but they're all unique.

Also, in addition, I've used two deliriants - neither of which were diphenhydramine, so diphenhydramine could be much more like dissociatives in it's nature. For example the first deliriant I did, I did in quite high doses, never experienced any euphoria or increased music appreciation whatsoever - wasn't very fun, the second deliriant I did was quite enjoyable but there was little/nothing in the way of hallucinations, just a lot of lapses in memory. So don't take my comparisons between the two as 100% exact, my dissociative/psychedelic comparisons are much more accurate.

Hope this helps, also, I'm glad you listed Salvia as a dissociative, I don't know if I'm the only one but it really annoys me when people mistakenly refer to it as a psychedelic rather than a dissociative.