I'ld like to hear from anyone who uses an opioid to fight depression.

[LucidSDreamr]

In general you are absolutely right. But there's always exception that proves the rule.

It will work. For a while; until it doesn’t.

I get that some ppl stay on methadone or bupe forever….but are they fighting naked clinical depression or depression that’s just part of PAWS?

I don’t know, like you said there is room for nuance but in general this is a bad idea I would say.

 

[Man67]

It will work. For a while; until it doesn’t.

I get that some ppl stay on methadone or bupe forever….but are they fighting naked clinical depression or depression that’s just part of PAWS?

I don’t know, like you said there is room for nuance but in general this is a bad idea I would say.

I'm aware of that but just tell me what's the alternative?

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I'm aware of that but just tell me what's the alternative?

I don’t know. Have you tried all the SSRIs and TCAs (outdated tricyclic antidepressants)?

I don’t have depression; but I’ve taken TCAs for pain and they seem like they are almost recreational to me. Like I feel really up beat and manic on them. No physical high though.

Then there’s atypical antidepressants like Wellbutrin that are pretty much a stimulant.

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

It's just not smart in this legal climate.

 

[Man67]

I don’t know. Have you tried all the SSRIs and TCAs (outdated tricyclic antidepressants)?

I don’t have depression; but I’ve taken TCAs for pain and they seem like they are almost recreational to me. Like I feel really up beat and manic on them. No physical high though.

Then there’s atypical antidepressants like Wellbutrin that are pretty much a stimulant.

I am still taking 150mg Amitriptyline for sleep (of the label). It doesn’t work for depression at all. As l said I tried at least top 3 antidepressants from every group without any success. Last year I didn't take any painkillers (chronic pain ) for 6 months. Result? Splitting headache 24/7 and clinical depression. I spent 90% of my time in bed. I really don't see any point in suffering?

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I am still taking 150mg Amitriptyline for sleep (of the label). It doesn’t work for depression at all. As l said I tried at least top 3 antidepressants from every group without any success. Last year I didn't take any painkillers (chronic pain ) for 6 months. Result? Splitting headache 24/7 and clinical depression. I spent 90% of my time in bed. I really don't see any point in suffering?

Before I respond, side note. 150 mg of Amitriptyline? Wow that’s a lot although normal for depression for pain only 10 to 50 mg are given. But I have to ask you….does Amitriptyline wreck your stomache and GI tract? Bad cramps, diahrresa uet feeling constipated pain after eating; tons of indigestion and gas? The drug works well for my pain but after month of being on 40 mg it wrecks my GI function worse than the pain I’m even taking for. And it stays fucked for months after even stopping Ami.

Did u get the GI problems/effects? Do you know how to cointeract them so you can stay on the drug….bc it works for what I take it for )pain) but causes even worse problems that I always have to stop and get scared to it.


Sorry to hear that not sure what you meant by “I don’t see any point in suffering" but if you meant that taking opiates is all you can find that works at this point; I would say go for it. Only you know what works for you and suffering for no reason is wrong. But please continue to explore other avenues besides opioids imo.

Sorry if I missed this; but which opioids do you use? If you have addiction proclivities and something like bupe or methadone cuts if for you; if it were me I would stick with those. Because they aren’t recreational too much. If you’re like me don’t make the mistake to trust yourself with a bottle of dilaided if you get what I’m saying. I just know what I would end up doing,,, especially while suffering. Bupe and methadone aren’t that euphoric and very long lasting so I think the possibility for abuse and mor often resdosong can lead to problems.

Best of luck I hope you figure out a regimen that offers you some long term stability.

 

[Man67]

Before I respond, side note. 150 mg of Amitriptyline? Wow that’s a lot although normal for depression for pain only 10 to 50 mg are given. But I have to ask you….does Amitriptyline wreck your stomache and GI tract? Bad cramps, diahrresa uet feeling constipated pain after eating; tons of indigestion and gas? The drug works well for my pain but after month of being on 40 mg it wrecks my GI function worse than the pain I’m even taking for. And it stays fucked for months after even stopping Ami.

Did u get the GI problems/effects? Do you know how to cointeract them so you can stay on the drug….bc it works for what I take it for )pain) but causes even worse problems that I always have to stop and get scared to it.


Sorry to hear that not sure what you meant by “I don’t see any point in suffering" but if you meant that taking opiates is all you can find that works at this point; I would say go for it. Only you know what works for you and suffering for no reason is wrong. But please continue to explore other avenues besides opioids imo.

Sorry if I missed this; but which opioids do you use? If you have addiction proclivities and something like bupe or methadone cuts if for you; if it were me I would stick with those. Because they aren’t recreational too much. If you’re like me don’t make the mistake to trust yourself with a bottle of dilaided if you get what I’m saying. I just know what I would end up doing,,, especially while suffering. Bupe and methadone aren’t that euphoric and very long lasting so I think the possibility for abuse and mor often resdosong can lead to problems.

Best of luck I hope you figure out a regimen that offers you some long term stability.

I am taking 150mg Amitriptyline (max. dose) because my Dr., Psychiatrist and Neurologist told me the same thing. "Don't stop & don't reduce the dosage". Apparently it's very hard to tapper it down but I suspect there's something else as well? As I said it doesn't work as antidepressant or a pain killer. But it helps me with insomnia (combined with 3mg Lexotan and 10mg Stilnox).

Regarding side effects l have none. Maybe a bit of urinary retention and that's all. By the way when I started 10 years ago there were some side effects but they ceased after few months.

For TRD i only take 10mg Endone first thing in the morning. I literally CAN'T afford to take more because in that case I must skip tomorrow's dose. And I really can't afford that.

After everything I've been through last year I am happy to be alive. After that i become responsible and very disciplined. You can give me a 100 pills to keep but I won't take more than 2. When people take them recreationally it's a completely different story. When you take them in order to survive there's no such a thing as "let's take more to feel good". Every night I cut 2 pills from the box and put it in my pocket. That's the tomorrow's dose and I have no desire or cravings to take more. That's it my friend.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I am taking 150mg Amitriptyline (max. dose) because my Dr., Psychiatrist and Neurologist told me the same thing. "Don't stop & don't reduce the dosage". Apparently it's very hard to tapper it down but I suspect there's something else as well? As I said it doesn't work as antidepressant or a pain killer. But it helps me with insomnia (combined with 3mg Lexotan and 10mg Stilnox).

Regarding side effects l have none. Maybe a bit of urinary retention and that's all. By the way when I started 10 years ago there were some side effects but they ceased after few months.

For TRD i only take 10mg Endone first thing in the morning. I literally CAN'T afford to take more because in that case I must skip tomorrow's dose. And I really can't afford that.

After everything I've been through last year I am happy to be alive. After that i become responsible and very disciplined. You can give me a 100 pills to keep but I won't take more than 2. When people take them recreationally it's a completely different story. When you take them in order to survive there's no such a thing as "let's take more to feel good". Every night I cut 2 pills from the box and put it in my pocket. That's the tomorrow's dose and I have no desire or cravings to take more. That's it my friend.

I’ve gotten slight withdrawals from tapering and stopping at 75mg. Nausea and some headache but nothing bad at all where I couldn’t function.

For me it’s prescribed for a specific pain issue and works well for it. I don’t have depression but I definitely feel happier and manic on the drug; I would consider it slightly recreational even once you’ve been on it for 2 weeks+

But we are different minds and different bodies

 

[Man67]

I’ve gotten slight withdrawals from tapering and stopping at 75mg. Nausea and some headache but nothing bad at all where I couldn’t function.

For me it’s prescribed for a specific pain issue and works well for it. I don’t have depression but I definitely feel happier and manic on the drug; I would consider it slightly recreational even once you’ve been on it for 2 weeks+

But we are different minds and different bodies

At one stage l was convinced that Amitriptyline was the main reason for most of my problems (mentally and physically). Apparently it's not. After tapering it down to 50mg and raising the dose to 200mg a few months later I didn't see any changes. My Psychiatrist told me that I will need at least a couple of years in order to recover from all medication l was taking in the past (antidepressants, benzos, paracetamol, sleeping pills...) It's been 6 month since than and I am still waiting.

 

[Bmwm8]

I feel like we all do it. Prob
Is you need more and more to get any relief. Eventually it makes things worse for me atleast.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

At one stage l was convinced that Amitriptyline was the main reason for most of my problems (mentally and physically). Apparently it's not. After tapering it down to 50mg and raising the dose to 200mg a few months later I didn't see any changes. My Psychiatrist told me that I will need at least a couple of years in order to recover from all medication l was taking in the past (antidepressants, benzos, paracetamol, sleeping pills...) It's been 6 month since than and I am still waiting.

Good luck man drugs are the solution to our pain and annguish and also our down fall that worsens them; I don’t know what the answer is but I hope you find yours.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

At one stage l was convinced that Amitriptyline was the main reason for most of my problems (mentally and physically). Apparently it's not. After tapering it down to 50mg and raising the dose to 200mg a few months later I didn't see any changes. My Psychiatrist told me that I will need at least a couple of years in order to recover from all medication l was taking in the past (antidepressants, benzos, paracetamol, sleeping pills...) It's been 6 month since than and I am still waiting.

What physical problems were you blaming on Ami?

 

[Man67]

What physical problems were you blaming on Ami?

Mostly suic. thoughts, confusion, loss of memory and apathy.

 

[Man67]

Good luck man drugs are the solution to our pain and annguish and also our down fall that worsens them; I don’t know what the answer is but I hope you find yours.

Thanks mate.

 

[DesertHarp]

Here's the fruit of my experience for anyone who might care to listen . . . and might benefit. Amitriptyline is very constipating. Add an opioid to that, and the gut slows way down. The result is constipation and belly pain.

There is a solution. Take an osmotic laxative, as often as needed, to make sure you poop every day. Otherwise you can damage your colon and end up with diverticulitis. (Happened to me.) Stimulant laxatives - like senna - irritate the lining of your gut. They're not the best choice. Osmotic laxatives - like Miralax or milk of magnesia - are the absolute best choice. Taking a dose of either one every day will not harm you. Miralax is great stuff. (The store generic knockoff is cheaper and is exactly the same stuff.). You can even take several doses in one day, if badly blocked up. (This is the same stuff they give you to clean out before getting a colonoscopy.)

The only caveat is this: Don't take any laxative, if your problem could possibly be appendicitis. You'll just get sicker. An X-Ray at the ER can pinpoint the problem for you, if you're not sure.

One more caveat: Don't swallow anything, if you feel very nauseated. Otherwise you might throw up and accidentally inhale your own vomit. That can be life-threatening.

Normal poop is not hard or painful to pass. Anyone who is passing hard poop should be taking an osmotic laxative, as often as needed to maintain soft stools. Doing that faithfully can stave off some really bad problems and the misery that goes with them.

 

[Man67]

Here's the fruit of my experience for anyone who might care to listen . . . and might benefit. Amitriptyline is very constipating. Add an opioid to that, and the gut slows way down. The result is constipation and belly pain.

There is a solution. Take an osmotic laxative, as often as needed, to make sure you poop every day. Otherwise you can damage your colon and end up with diverticulitis. (Happened to me.) Stimulant laxatives - like senna - irritate the lining of your gut. They're not the best choice. Osmotic laxatives - like Miralax or milk of magnesia - are the absolute best choice. Taking a dose of either one every day will not harm you. Miralax is great stuff. (The store generic knockoff is cheaper and is exactly the same stuff.). You can even take several doses in one day, if badly blocked up. (This is the same stuff they give you to clean out before getting a colonoscopy.)

The only caveat is this: Don't take any laxative, if your problem could possibly be appendicitis. You'll just get sicker. An X-Ray at the ER can pinpoint the problem for you, if you're not sure.

One more caveat: Don't swallow anything, if you feel very nauseated. Otherwise you might throw up and accidentally inhale your own vomit. That can be life-threatening.

Normal poop is not hard or painful to pass. Anyone who is passing hard poop should be taking an osmotic laxative, as often as needed to maintain soft stools. Doing that faithfully can stave off some really bad problems and the misery that goes with them.

Thanks for the advice mate. If I may, just one suggestion. Prunes. They have plenty of fibre but don't work immediately. Soak several prunes in the glass of water and eat it (drink the water as well) after dinner. It works miracles in the morning. If its a more severe case of constipation repeat the process for 2-3 days in a row.

 

[LifeQuitter]

Yea me. Was a one way ticket into disaster though, don’t recommend. If you use it for mental pain you need to take more and more and more. I ten-folded my dose within 4-8 weeks.
And then on substitution and tapering everything you pushed aside comes back a million times worse.

So overall don’t recommend. Works wonders short term but will instantly have you hooked and it’s a one way ticket to hell from there.

So please believe me. I was stupid enough to had to have it learned the hard way. I must admit though I suffer from extreme depression and suicidality so yea. I do think though that if you just use it occasionally when feeling a bit down, it will also have you hooked, just over a longer period of time / slower than in my case.

 

[Man67]

Yea me. Was a one way ticket into disaster though, don’t recommend. If you use it for mental pain you need to take more and more and more. I ten-folded my dose within 4-8 weeks.
And then on substitution and tapering everything you pushed aside comes back a million times worse.

So overall don’t recommend. Works wonders short term but will instantly have you hooked and it’s a one way ticket to hell from there.

So please believe me. I was stupid enough to had to have it learned the hard way. I must admit though I suffer from extreme depression and suicidality so yea. I do think though that if you just use it occasionally when feeling a bit down, it will also have you hooked, just over a longer period of time / slower than in my case.

It gets me out of bed for the last 10 months. Never took more than 10mg in the morning, never will. I don’t feel anything and there's no "happy" period but suic. thoughts disappear after 15-20 minutes. That's all I'm asking for.

I must clarify this a bit. I NEVER bought or tried illegal street drugs. Never smoked weed. I was a bit "high" only in hospital after the surgery. Of course that I was thinking about double dose (20mg) but in that case I wouldn't have anything for tomorrow. I really can't afford that. I was down in the dark hole for more than a year and during that period I realised that only one thing matters: "How to stay alive?"

Your comment makes sense for someone who was talking a large quantity of drugs recreationally. I take (legally prescribed) minimal dose of Endone because nothing else works for my TRD and PTSD. If you know of any other effective (legal) treatment, please let me know.

 

[LifeQuitter]

It gets me out of bed for the last 10 months. Never took more than 10mg in the morning, never will. I don’t feel anything and there's no "happy" period but suic. thoughts disappear after 15-20 minutes. That's all I'm asking for.

I must clarify this a bit. I NEVER bought or tried illegal street drugs. Never smoked weed. I was a bit "high" only in hospital after the surgery. Of course that I was thinking about double dose (20mg) but in that case I wouldn't have anything for tomorrow. I really can't afford that. I was down in the dark hole for more than a year and during that period I realised that only one thing matters: "How to stay alive?"

Your comment makes sense for someone who was talking a large quantity of drugs recreationally. I take (legally prescribed) minimal dose of Endone because nothing else works for my TRD and PTSD. If you know of any other effective (legal) treatment, please let me know.

That's interesting, what substance are you taking 10mg of? If it's a long-acting/ delayed release opioid then I am pretty pretty sure that your suicidal thoughts in the morning are pushed by waking up with slight WDs (they don't have to be physical, in my experience the emotional effects of WD are there before the physical ones and stronger too).

I must say I never took any drug "for fun" or "recreational" use. I suffer from extreme pain, extreme depression and also trauma. It's a mixture of all of this, the pain manifests in my stomach after what happened to me, you can call it psychosomatic but believe me it's the worst pain I ever had and I had a major surgery with insane physical pain back in 2022 that left me on crutches and on opiates for 6 months (tilidine 100mg half of the time then 50mg). I never became an opiate addict. I took it as long as I had to to fully recover, then I could stop them within a week of a quick taper without ANY withdrawals whatsoever. I was surprised but after that I never had the intent to take opiates again for other reasons such as having had an accident or surgery or being a terminal cancer patient.

The shit that happened to me in March rendered me a severe fiend, sad but true. It's MISuse of the substance class which left me as an opiate addict.

What I want to add is that even if you have a tolerance, you still get pain reduction and slight increase of mood (depending on the opiate) even if you take a low dose for a looong time and never up the antics.

To elaborate about my experience before I got into the program; I became a daily user almost immediately bc I needed pain suppression daily, the first few days I took the same dose, I liked the nod but preferred the pain reduction over the euphoria so I thought "I had it under control" but my pain was so intense that I had to up the antic, I never looked for a good nod but I just had to go further and further to survive each day. If I look from day one to the last day I used illicit opiates from the internet, I must say it's probably around 15x of the initial dose. So a very very rapid decline.

Beware of that. If you get along with a low dose of OXY (which I guess it is if you say 10mg). Perfect, prescriped by the doctors? perfect bro I am fucking jealous. I wish I could trade shoes with you ANY DAY.
I can only enforce your use then, trust me, you will have no cognitive long term effects, my 6 months tilidine phase left me with 000000 side effects except for slightly diminished libido that quickly resolved after jumping off (my T levels came back to above normal for my age) - and at that time I was glad that I wasn't plagued by it (libido is one of my biggest mental struggles as I can't live it out and gives me even more PTSD and flashbacks of the girl I loved so so much and lost me... it's like a horror haunting every day, so I am glad that's still low on substitution now but ngl I am afraid what the future holds for me once I am off it completely ... for now I try to convince the doctors to give me a little bit more time each step to postpone it.
If you do care about libido and relationship emotional binding: that's the only long-term effect of your use, congnitively you will have no neurotxic affect AT ALL. In fact, straight after my 6 months tilidine use (not abuse) I studied 12h a day for half a year and passed one of Europes hardest entrance test to a med school with a very very remarkable 100% on the big "memory subtest", which left me top 1-2% of all participants. (that's btw why I don't believe the myth of opiates causing memory issues long term... definitely not in my case by ANY means)

So yea long story short; it's different but I am jealous of you fr. Just be careful that you don't ramp up the antics like me, but as you see I am very troubled young guy that is in the worst hell on Earth, been through it all, still suffer in it all day. It's awful.

All the best bro cheers

edit: oh didn't read Endone, had to look it up, yep it's Oxy as you said. If you stay at 10 and do good in life! all the best, sounds good to me!

 

[Man67]

That's interesting, what substance are you taking 10mg of? If it's a long-acting/ delayed release opioid then I am pretty pretty sure that your suicidal thoughts in the morning are pushed by waking up with slight WDs (they don't have to be physical, in my experience the emotional effects of WD are there before the physical ones and stronger too).

I must say I never took any drug "for fun" or "recreational" use. I suffer from extreme pain, extreme depression and also trauma. It's a mixture of all of this, the pain manifests in my stomach after what happened to me, you can call it psychosomatic but believe me it's the worst pain I ever had and I had a major surgery with insane physical pain back in 2022 that left me on crutches and on opiates for 6 months (tilidine 100mg half of the time then 50mg). I never became an opiate addict. I took it as long as I had to to fully recover, then I could stop them within a week of a quick taper without ANY withdrawals whatsoever. I was surprised but after that I never had the intent to take opiates again for other reasons such as having had an accident or surgery or being a terminal cancer patient.

The shit that happened to me in March rendered me a severe fiend, sad but true. It's MISuse of the substance class which left me as an opiate addict.

What I want to add is that even if you have a tolerance, you still get pain reduction and slight increase of mood (depending on the opiate) even if you take a low dose for a looong time and never up the antics.

To elaborate about my experience before I got into the program; I became a daily user almost immediately bc I needed pain suppression daily, the first few days I took the same dose, I liked the nod but preferred the pain reduction over the euphoria so I thought "I had it under control" but my pain was so intense that I had to up the antic, I never looked for a good nod but I just had to go further and further to survive each day. If I look from day one to the last day I used illicit opiates from the internet, I must say it's probably around 15x of the initial dose. So a very very rapid decline.

Beware of that. If you get along with a low dose of OXY (which I guess it is if you say 10mg). Perfect, prescriped by the doctors? perfect bro I am fucking jealous. I wish I could trade shoes with you ANY DAY.
I can only enforce your use then, trust me, you will have no cognitive long term effects, my 6 months tilidine phase left me with 000000 side effects except for slightly diminished libido that quickly resolved after jumping off (my T levels came back to above normal for my age) - and at that time I was glad that I wasn't plagued by it (libido is one of my biggest mental struggles as I can't live it out and gives me even more PTSD and flashbacks of the girl I loved so so much and lost me... it's like a horror haunting every day, so I am glad that's still low on substitution now but ngl I am afraid what the future holds for me once I am off it completely ... for now I try to convince the doctors to give me a little bit more time each step to postpone it.
If you do care about libido and relationship emotional binding: that's the only long-term effect of your use, congnitively you will have no neurotxic affect AT ALL. In fact, straight after my 6 months tilidine use (not abuse) I studied 12h a day for half a year and passed one of Europes hardest entrance test to a med school with a very very remarkable 100% on the big "memory subtest", which left me top 1-2% of all participants. (that's btw why I don't believe the myth of opiates causing memory issues long term... definitely not in my case by ANY means)

So yea long story short; it's different but I am jealous of you fr. Just be careful that you don't ramp up the antics like me, but as you see I am very troubled young guy that is in the worst hell on Earth, been through it all, still suffer in it all day. It's awful.

All the best bro cheers

edit: oh didn't read Endone, had to look it up, yep it's Oxy as you said. If you stay at 10 and do good in life! all the best, sounds good to me!

Excellent post and I'm sorry to hear about your struggle with opiates. But trust me mate, you have nothing to be jealous about. This is not a life, this is just a fight for survival. Endone is a immediate release oxy and I really don't have any "happy" effects. But it does the job and gets me out of bed in the morning. Not everything is perfect because a day has 24 hours. But morning depression is the worst so I have to be grateful because there's no cure for TRD and PTSD.

I asked my Psychiatrist about tolerance and he said it shouldn't be a problem at such a small dose. The only problem is that I feel like a criminal as my Dr. just reapplied for another year of Endone therapy. My life literally depends on Governments Health Department decision because they are only interested in pain management as Oxy is not officially approved for TRD. So I am still waiting and hoping because I don't have a plan B.