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idea...trifluoro-propyl-dragonfly

T

toxide

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Mar 21, 2006
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I read that trifluoro-alkyl 2Cs/DOXs are super potent. 2cp seems to be the most potent of the regular 2cXs and DOPr is of as potent as all the other of the most potent DOXs, (2cp is my favorite of all the psychedelic phenethylamines) so does anyone think TFPr-DFly would be a good idea/feesable. Maybe this is another dumb thread just an idea tho;) How potent do u think it might be:)
 
People have tried 2C-TFM and DOTFM. The latter can last for several days. I haven't heard of trifluoroalkyl-fly compounds on the grey or black market, probably because of the combination of high potency and slow pharmacokinetics.
 
Sure, it would be superpotent.. and also a real bitch to make, and probably not even very good - the FLY series don't seem to be able to acheive the same level of effects their non-FLY counterparts can, probably because their EMAX is far lower, even though their receptor affinity is excellent.

I suggest if you're interested in these sorts of compounds it makes more sense to go for the plain 2C ones, such as 4-(2,2,2-trifluoro)ethylthio-2,5-diMeO-PEA. The combination of a strongly electron-withdrawing group (the trifluoro arrangement) on a ethyl chain to provide the optimum position of the electronegativity, in combination with a 4-subbed thio for it's MAO inhibiting properties should make for a real winner in terms of potency and effects.

If you look at 2C-T-21 (the monofluoro derivative of the above), it's the most potent of the 2C-T's afaik, which supports that the triF should be more potent.
The 3,3,3-triF-propylthio derivative should be excellent as well, having similarities to 2C-T-7, but probably being significantly more potent.

Not any harder to make than 2C-T-2 (it's non TF homologue), either, from what I can see.

Oh, and all the above (the discussion of potency) applies equally to their non-thio friends (the 4-alkylated 2C series, 2C-E & 2C-P et al) but I thought i'd mention the 2C-T's because the MAO effects make for some nice empathogenic effects, hehe. They aren't for everyone, though, and make them more dangerous, so you may wanna steer away from em.
 
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IME, 2cT's are unpredictable potency wise unless theyre not taken orally which most people wont want to do and for good reason. dose for dose, no matter who takes them, 2cp blows 2ct7 away. I really enjoyed t7 but it was hard to get the right dose, 2cp was better fx wise IMO anyway.<(same for all 2ce/t2)

DO-TFP maybe... what's the difference between the fluoros being 2 vs 3 positions?
 
Probably not much. The most potent of the 4-halide 2C's is 2C-I, which is the bulkiest, but the I atom is the least electronegative of the common halogens. 2C-P is the most potent of the 4-alkyl 2C's - and the alkyl chain is pretty bulky, maybe twice that of an I atom all up.... but it's not very electronegative at all. See where i'm going with this?

Well, it would appear for high activity, you want bulk & electronegativity.
F atom is a bit smaller than a hydrogen. So, if we have fluorines all over our alkyl substituent at -4, as many as we can get, we should get great potency - and judging by our existing SAR data, a propyl would be our best choice.
AFAIK, these have not been synthesized yet, let alone human bioassayed, unfortunately.

So the answer to your question is - I don't know, but I suspect the 2 position would be best but can't figure out how to explain why :/ - but there's no reason you have to have them all at one position - theoretically, you could have 9 (!) fluoro subs on your propyl sub!

DOTFP would be crazy potent, haha. I for one will not be eating any however :p, I don't like hour and hours and hours of neverending tripping.... but that's me. Each to their own.
3-Bromo-1,1,1-trifluoropropane is avaliable, so upon reaction with 2C-I you should get DO(3,3,3)TFP (all 3 fluoros at the end of the propyl sub)... well, once you seperate out the products, it'll be a messy seperation. That's just an example though, there are others.
 
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I think this might be better in ADD. Mods, do as you wish with it.
 
Extremely potent compound aren't necessary worthwile... i.e. mescaline is a relly good psychedelich but his potency is very low...

The potency rise with the lipophility of the 4-substitued group attached to the 2,5-diMeO-PHE/A . 2C-TFM is extremely potent, and Trifluoropropylated are certainly more potent (2C-P is more potent than 2C-D). More fluorine = more lipohpile = higher potency ... I attribute a special place for the pentyfluorosulfanylated phenethylamines !!!
 
Personally I find that the 4-halogenated/pseudohalogenated PEA psychedelics are neither nowt nor something (a N of England way of saying nothing to get excited about). Some people like 2C-B (or 2C-C/2C-I), but personally I find them uninteresting as they don't seem to give a full psychedelic effect - I much prefer 2C-D/E (2C-P is a bit heavy on the body IME).

Mind you, from people I've talked to who do like them, they rated 2C-TFM as being the best of the bunch, but a benzodifuran amalogue of DOTFM just seems a case of potency for potency's sake & bound to be a disaster just waitying to happen when you see some of the blatently stupid things people have done with much less potent compounds
 
It would be very interesting to compare the potency of the known 4-fluoroalkyl phenethylamines like 2C-TFM and 2C-EF to the other possible derivatives such as the γ-fluoropropyl, β,β,β-trifluoroethyl, γ,γ,γ-trifluoropropyl and pentafluoroethyl compounds, as well as the pentafluorosulfinyl of course.

I wonder how many fluorines you could squeeze onto the 4-position substituent before the group started getting too bulky to fit in the binding site, and would the potency keep going up with increased electron density, or is the trifluoromethyl group already at optimum binding affinity?

Not sure that there would be much advantage in going for the alpha-methyl or benzodifuranyl substitutions as well though, the phenethylamines would be potent already, and these kind of compounds could keep you tripping for days on end which always starts to be a strain after a while!
 
while your on the idea of crazy molecules i would just like to ask if intersecting a phenethylamine and a tryptamine would work. the alpha and beta positions on the phen would be the 4-5 positions on the indole ring. the phen would be on the x-y plane and the tryptamine on the x-z plane to get a beter picture of what im sayin. interesting idea, probably woudnt work at all though. oh and the phene could have a 4-tfp to stay on topic
 
That doesn't make any sense- you'd have an amine where the alpha or beta carbon is (not sure exactly how exactly you'd line things up.

I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about, so I took these two most sensible ways of doing this, but I don't think either would be fruitful.

Indole_pea_IGNVS_1.jpg


hopefully my third edit will make this work. Apparently BL hates BMPs
 
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no,i wasnt but thanks for the link--thats extremly informative

ill draw a picture

acoolchemicalif3.png


its a shit idea realy :/

edit:yeah that thread talks about how things being flat is good. my idea is the oposite of that haha oh well
 
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The way you've located the amine is wrong, it's not a "PEA" if you place it there.

Oh, never mind. I see what you're getting at.

Still unlikely to be active.

Something like this is pointless, it's just an exercise in combining things for no reason.

In my drawing "B" might be active, but it's not even very likely.
 
Oh, actually, A would essentially be the indole derivative of 2-AminoIndan.

could be active, but that extra nitrogen would be a problem.
 
I still don't understand the need for a three axis graph or the way they've been arranged with respect to each other (and this has nothing to do with my theory about overlaying structures*, I honestly can't see the relationship in terms of structure & position in that diagram)

* - Even though I think that's the spatial/receptor relationship between PEAs, tryptamines & ergolines I proposed is the only way that things like the stereochemistry surrounding the carbon with the amine group attached can work w.r.t. the 5HT2a receptor
 
5-HT2 said:
People have tried 2C-TFM and DOTFM. The latter can last for several days. I haven't heard of trifluoroalkyl-fly compounds on the grey or black market, probably because of the combination of high potency and slow pharmacokinetics.
Click to expand...


Care to share a bit more info on the subjective effects of DOTFM, its coming up on my to try list;)

sorry, a bot off topic
 
fastandbulbous said:
I still don't understand the need for a three axis graph or the way they've been arranged with respect to each other (and this has nothing to do with my theory about overlaying structures*, I honestly can't see the relationship in terms of structure & position in that diagram)

* - Even though I think that's the spatial/receptor relationship between PEAs, tryptamines & ergolines I proposed is the only way that things like the stereochemistry surrounding the carbon with the amine group attached can work w.r.t. the 5HT2a receptor
Click to expand...

no need, just a dumb idea:)
 
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