I suggest a description of enlightenment

[Dedbeet]

I came up with this, and thought it covered a much-misunderstood thingie pretty nicely... this is my own experience, fwiw, and I assure ya it's nothing special ...

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>
> In reality
> You can ask to have it seduced  !

Sexual desire is still free to arise, still felt as always, etc.

That's love, too, a pleasurable sort of variation on it.

That's why I said the 'mental view' is neutrality. There is still variation, just no
comparison. What is happening this moment, now, in the here and now, is
absolute. There is nothing else. Think of it as losing oneself totally in
moment-to-moment life.

 

[Dedbeet]

My view of "spiritual enlightenment"

I often use the words "beyond the mind", being clear on the fact that they don't
say anything, so I thought I'd attempt a description.

"Beyond the mind", the here and now is 'absolute'. There is nowhere else.

Think of it as losing yourself totally in moment-to-moment life (no-self).

One is so involved in the present moment that the "universe out there" doesn't
exist.

It is total, unconditional involvement. There is nothing else but This, at any
time.

This is why words don't say anything about it...

 

[Psyduck]

Sorry, you don't provide any rational basis for discussion.

Try to take some more time in putting together and formulating your thoughts. Read some books, pay attention how writers structure their text and communicate their ideas. Preferably, start studying the history of philosophy, and come to the conclusion that what you're saying is (probably) not new at all, but has been discussed many times. This way you learn also an acceptable philosophical vocubulary which allows you to communicate your thoughts intelligibly.

If you want people to listen to you, you should really adapt your style. Maybe you really have something relevant to say, but as long as you give us the impression that it's just some gibberish, people will not take the time to read your posts properly.

 

[Dedbeet]

Hi Psy,

Sorry, you don't provide any rational basis for discussion.

True... how can 'what is beyond words' be discussed?

Spiritual awakening is not really discussable, can only be indicated or hinted at.

That creates an issue: Only one that is there can indicate or hint at it. Making it look (from a social standpoint) like they are bragging or something, perhaps. Yet it is all beyond words, and everyone is "there" from time to time.

People go to the movies for temporary awakening experiences -- to be absorbed. And they enjoy the movies most that absorb them the most. In other words, when the self is not there.

It has something to do with looking out of your eyes (instead of being looked at) and then flowing with what is seen, rather than keeping time.

It's incredibly simple, really. Do that for a long time, all the time, and the self will dissolve. It's merely the 'being looked at, being seen by others' nonsense that keeps it around.

That one little thing -- "Being looked at, being seen by others" -- is the basis for the separate self and all of mankind's troubles.

 

[Dedbeet]

My posts being cryptic...

I've heard too many claims of my posts being cryptic and undiscussable... probably cuz I hardly ever ask questions or engage in self/other dialogue. Fwiw, I tend more to do self/other talk 'in person', as I enjoy it more, but the cryptic-ness thing is silly, imo... I feel I'm very clear in what I say.

Except that the emotional psyche can't absorb it, because it doesn't have the appropriate social cracks to fall through. I just speak straight to the mind, and IMO it can't get through the self's web of social niceties and be heard.

I'll just drop a final example, then go. This is only an example, but could actually happen.

"The self is not the thinker..."
----------------------------

"Choose a thought, then think it".

Seems easy, right?

Q: OK, pick a thought, and think it.

A: "I choose the word 'bear'.

Q: You chose the word "I?"

A: No, bear!

Q: You chose the word "bear", but the first thought out of your mouth was "I".

P.S. what produced the word "I"?

One side of the psyche, the self or "noun" aspect.

What produced the word "bear?"

The other side of the psyche, its object or verbal (doership) aspect.

All of it occurs automatically. No choice occurred at all. No thinker.

Subject - object, all rolled up in one, running on automatic.

Peace...

 

[-=SS=-]

A lot of what is considered "spirituality" is rationalization.. people have fantasy ideas about Enlightenment and superiority from spiritual power.

If anyone really understood what awakening was, no one would want it. Enlightenment is about “alone”. - http://www.searchwithin.org/download/alone.pdf

 

[Thorns Have Roses]

^I fail to see how that makes it any less desirable. It's not that I particularlyly disagree with the article, just that some of the thoughts could be framed alternatively. There is unnecessary absolutism and presumption it.

I wonder how the author would reply when probed with the great question "So what?"

 

[qwe]

when i did a heroic dose of lucy, it unified everything in my consciousness. everything became one. that's what i call enlightenment. ever since then, i've been able to use my brain/body in ways i never thought possible.

i then had to (and am still) rebuild everything about myself, and re-separate things in my perception, which is not an easy process, and a highly personal and emotional one. enlightenment is never an end, it's always also a beginning.

the great question "So what?"

so, there is more to life than material reality. there is more to explore than school tells us. there is more to us than our churches and leaders tell us.

so what? so we need to stop obsessing over money games. and most other games we play. our culture has lost some of the wisdom it gained earlier (i believe that cultures can grow; the fact that languages evolve over time supports my case, as well as ideas like Moore's Law).

at least, those are my current thoughts from my peak experience one month ago.

 

[Thorns Have Roses]

I'll have the window southward,
A piece of land will I have
To dig and weed with a hoe.

I'll never be lured by clouds.
I'll enjoy free bird songs.
When the corns are ripe,
Come and share them on my table.

When someone asks why I live,
I just smile.

("I'll Have the Window Southward" by Sang-Yong Kim)