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I need to STOP...

N

Newquiter

Greenlighter
Joined
Feb 6, 2012
Messages
24
This is the first time I have ever really 'outloud' admitted my problem. I've known for sometime that I do have an opiate addiction.
I have to deal with it pretty -*+-&% soon or I don't know physically what will happen.
Let me introduce my self and situation. Then maybe I can get some advise from the forum?

I run a small construction company. For the last few months I have been able to simply make 'appearances' to make sure things are running smoothly. After these appearances I can barely make it a mile away before I almost robotically pop an oxy.
My problem is that I have found a pretty reliable source of 30mg oxycodone. I have a prescription for 750 mg Vicodin/ibuprofen for a legitamate lower back disk hemorrhage. That also qualifies me for a prescription of SOMA. On top of these I have a reliable source of zanax.
My regimine:
Lately:
30 mg oxy at 10 am. 30 more oxy around 1 or 2 pm. 30-45 more oxy at 5ish. At around 6-7 pm i take 2 mg zaxax and then an hour after that usually before i eat (first meal aside from coffee) I take 2 soma's. Then a few hits of weed.
I used to be able to keep the oxys to no more than 15-20 mg/day after work. But always fearing 'running out of perks
I bought a few hundred of them. Prior to getting this 30 mg source I also hourded a bunch of 5's, 750's 10's of percocets.

Problem(if not already obvious)- I need to stop this *&%* BS.
Next problem - I'm happily married with 4 kids and a successful business.
I cannot let anyone know! Not my wife. Not my Doctor. Not my clients. NO ONE!

I need some advise. I told the 30 mg source I won't buy anymore and I have 30 or so left... and a bottle full of assorted mg perks.
I'm afraid of the serious physical affects of going cold turkey. I'm 42.
I also see the BS I'm telling myself every Sunday 'Tomorrow I will start cutting down.'
I know the solution is obvious. But maybe someone can help me with specifics. I need to detox 'quietly'.
I quit alcohol 2 years ago cold turkey. And cigarettes the same ten years ago. I truely want and need to quit. Just as I did alcohol and tobacco.
Help?
I'm probably what you could call a barely 'funtioning' opiate addict. Yes. I said it. And That seems to be the easy part.
The problem is that the opiates are beginning to take away my functionality. I won't take perks at work but that's what I use the Vicodin for. Lately, when I do have to work the full day...I can barely think ..by 4 pm.
I wake up hateing what I'm doing to myself each day. No ...I'm not suicidal or that type.
I'm just very angry its gone this far.
I'm going to cut back the zanax by one pill this week. I'm at 2. ( I used a 1/2 during the few weeks I stopped drinking)
I will cut the SOMA to 1 1/2 at night ( they are actually the only things that make me feel better)
As I think I'm planning to substitute these and a bit of pot for when? I hopefully? Quit?

Any help out there for me? No Doctors. No confessions. No NA.
Am I just being a baby? And should drop the oxy's cold?
Advise?
 
Well, the only thing I can say is that this will make it so much easier on you if you're open with your family about it, at least your spouse. She might be shocked at first if she doesn't exactly understand the concept of drugs and addiction, but hopefully by talking to her and admitting your problem that she will be willing to stand by you and help. If anything, do you have any good friends that you can trust knowing that you have an addiction? It's very good that you notice that you have a problem and you're out loud saying it, even if you're only saying it on a forum. Being able to physically admit that you have a problem is a huge step and you should be very proud of yourself.

I suppose if you don't want to tell anybody about it, you need to be very strict. The hardest part of quitting for many people is actually bringing themselves to quit. A good strategy is to fin the reasons that it's worth quitting opiates and benzos for, write out how it will benefit you and your life overall. Next you basically have 3 roads to take. Cold turkey, tapering or methadone. Since you don't want any doctors to know about this, it will basically come down to cold turkey or tapering. It is important that you do not give yourself "one more day" because that will almost never work. You either cut your dosage down now or you stop now. The thing is there is a chance you will fail. DO NOT GIVE UP. Failure is a natural part of anything you're really working hard for, and you cannot let failure get you down. The only thing you can do when you fall is to stand right back up. Also if you're not looking to go any support groups, it's definitely worth looking over the methods that many of them use to help quit, and you can practice that on your own. Bluelight is also a good source for you to connect with other addicts, basically giving you what NA or AA would.

Best of luck with quitting :)
 
Ok, if you want to stay functional I would do a slow taper. Since Oxys Hydros have a quite short half life it is more suitable to do this with a long-acting opioid, I'd strongly recommend suboxone. To change your Oxy to Sub, you need to stop taking Oxy and wait until you are in withdrawal, 36 hours seem to be suitable, however the longer the wait the better. This is important because when you take the Sub earlier, it will kick the Oxy from your opioid receptors and send you into immediate full withdrawal. Then you take 1 mg every hour until the withdrawals are gone. Remember you take the Sub only to avoid withdrawals and to taper, not for recreation. Therefore the dose should be as small as possible. With ~ 100 mg Oxy a day, you should be fine with a dose around 4 mg, but everyone is different. When you have maintained a stable dose, you can begin to taper, at your own speed. Their are many taper plans, many of them are helpful, but it is most important that you go your own speed. You won't feel great while tapering but you should find a reduction speed that keeps you functional. It is important to slow down the lower your dose is. It is absolutely legitimate to drop only 0.1 mg at a time when you've reached a dose of 1 mg and even maintain a dose of 0.1 mg for a longer time before you jump off.

How long do you take xanax and soma? If you took them for a longer time, it is better to taper them, too, either before or after you quit the opiates.

However, that is only the technical part. It may sound like bad news to you, but I find it almost impossible to recover from a substantial habit without telling anyone. You have made the first step and admitted to yourself that you have a problem and that takes a whole man. I have tried it several times, I know many people who tried it and we all failed. There might be very very few that are able to do it on their own, but I'd guess this are considerably under 1% of the users who manage to get and stay sober. I can absolutely empathise how hard it is to admit to your wife that you have a problem, especially because you kept it going for so long in the secret. At least it was for me, I felt incredibly weak, guilty and worthless. But in the end it was so liberating to finally tell the truth, painful but good at the same time. Anyway, in most cases our partners sensed for a long time that something is wrong with us, even if they can't point the finger at it. If you aren't yet ready to do this, it might be helpful to go to na or something. It is, as the name said, anonymous, you have no commitment and you can leave whenever you want. They won't accuse or look down at you, but instead encourage and help you to recover, they have all been at the point where you are, so there's no reason to be ashamed.

I know you don't want any of this, and I respect that, but I just wanted to emphazise that I find it crucial to get all the support you can get. I repeat myself, to be honest is nothing to be ashamed about, it shows incredible strength!
 
I'll be blunt: you won't be able to do it without the support of your family. IMO, you need to go to rehab. You are taking a lot of drugs, and you are a polydrug user, so it's not just a matter of quitting the opiates. If you don't want to go to rehab, why can't you go to NA? PLENTY of people get clean in NA, (the far majority) and if you're concerned about seeing someone in your community, then go to the next town over.

I'm a doctor. Talk about being known in the community. I had patients to worry about. I became dependent upon opiates. I had a medical license to protect. My dependency affected the care I provided to my patients. I did 90 days inpatient--yes, I was worried about how the world was going to function w/o my godly presence, but somehow it did. I go to NA/AA in my community. I tried it your way first and it didn't work. Take it or leave it.
 
I fully understand that telling my wife is essential. But I just can't . I would be nice to have someone to dole out the doses as I 'taper'. ( I'm sorry but just cant). And that phrase 'polydrug' user is sticking in my head.

In my 'best possible scenario' I would like to taper off the oxys, with the aide of the zanax and soma , then pick off those after. Maybe I'm being stubborn. In all ways around.... but I honestly HAVE to do this alone.
I need advise to prepare. I've never attempted this and I HAVE to go to work.
The 30's are not doing much anymore and I'm pretty sickish by midday. I feel much better as soon as I pop one on the way home.
I may consider just dropping to 15 mg at noon (at work,hrrrmm)then 30 at home at 5.
I use 750 Vic in the am then wait til 5 for 30 mg which quickly turns to 45 mg. The whole day sucks that way.
I'm worried that if I 'taper' too long its just stretching the agony. Will my body adjust to the lower mg?
Damn! this is all so stupid.
But what's the proper way to taper? You should assume that I have the absolute desire to quit.
This may sound like a silly question...
Is it a month long process? A week? 'Depending current supply'? Ect?
I have enough 30's to break into halfs for maybe 30-40 days then I have the 750's and 5's.

Or should I gooble up those nasty 30's and use the bottle of the big acetaminophen bombs to taper?
In that case I'm afraid I won't have enough to taper down from the 30's.
How pathetic a problem, eh?

Is that too long? Not long enough? I'm not foolish enough to think i can flush what I have.
But those blue devils got me feeling like I'm reaching my 'max'. 'Like butter spread to thin across dry toast'
Can I taper with oxys? When I get to the mathematical point I know there will be no more?
There will be a slow point in my work project in two weeks where I could "come down with the flu" starting on a Thursday....where I stop oxys on Wednesday. Thurs,Fri, Sat, Sun, sick still Monday? Back to work by Tuesday?
I have no clue.
I've never attempted this before.

I can't see my doc for Subs.

Understand -
I would love dearly to confess to my wife. (and you are right VanWeyden, I know she 'senses' something). I just CANT tell her. Please.... can we just consider I have to go this alone..
That's why I'm here... I think... to do this quietly. Alone.
 
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Given the number and amount of drugs that you are taking, it would be irresponsible for one of "us" to provide you with an effective taper schedule. Also it's unlikely that your own physician can provide you with Suboxone, as these doctors need to have a special certification to do so. www.suboxone.com is where you would find a physician.

You haven't provided a compelling reason why you HAVE to do it alone. You'll find that this forum is littered with stories of people who just HAD to do it alone, only to find that it simply wasn't possible, because quitting the drug is just the beginning.
 
Why can't you tell anyone? Admitting to be an addict is nasty, you have to conquer your pride and risk to be looked down on, but thats the case for everyone.
 
Wow.

Well 'thanks'... I guess.
I have 'told' my pill sources, 'no more'.
But I'm not naive so I will see how that goes.

I guess this post was not what as helpful as I thought it could be.
Contact with an understanding knowledgeable human was my intent..
Alone it is then. I'm determined to do this.
I began this post for a reason. I have to work today and only brought one pill.
I will take half when I begin to feel too shitty.
'Taper' should be self explanatory. I'll try Google.
A few answers to my specific questions would have been nice.
 
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Hey, don't get me wrong, I treid it that way multiple times, as many others did here did, so intend by no means to judge you. We will support you either way here on tds. That's what this forum is for. We just think that it is really really really helpful to not do this alone.
 
sorry to hear this,
you sound successful.

I think you need some support and help,
You got prescribed pain meds, and unfortunately 'one may lead to another'
or it can turn into pringles 'once you pop you just cant stop'

You will struggle to quit alone, if you want anyone to talk to PM me,
as for telling the family, are you scared your wife will leave you over this?

what is her opinion on drug use?
Support is the most important thing you need atm,

you didnt take these before, so you dont have to keep taking them, you need to taper and come off them
 
I plan on doing this without telling my wife ...or doctor. Period.

But I DO PLAN ON DOING THIS.

You are right. I am 'successful'. Just not feeling that way atm.
Also again you are right... I didn't do these before. The problem really stems from the easy availability of the 30 mg oxy.
In 3 months I let them fester into the core my life. I use the other drugs 'to come down' at night as the oxy's amp me up.

I need help with the technicals of tapering. If I can't do it with the drugs I have right now. Then I WILL tell my wife.
I cannot stop working. And my job site requires me less at the moment. But soon I will be working 40-60 hours a week.
Atm. I fear I have too many oc 30's. Or maybe too few to taper? I have 30 or so and also have a sizable handful of assorted percocets.
Please...
I need info for help.
Its almost noon. No appetite. Should I hold off on 15 mg? Til I'm I'm the dumps at 2ish? Or is it logical to take 15 mg now?
Up until this morning I was taking 30 mg by 9 am. For the past month.
 
OK well for those interested.
I am/used to be quite a healthy individual. But brief Google-ing of my situation has lead me to fear issues of high blood pressure/heart issues related to a quick OC stoppage. Maybe I'm mis informed.

-Anyway... I took 15 mg at noon while I forced down some food. I feel better and not really high. Believe it or not... I'm no longer interested in the high. All I want is OUT!

I'm going to begin this 'blind'.
I do not have the time or money to spend on a rehab clinic for even a week.

I may consider your offer to PM. When I get off work. Thanks for the offer.

First things first. And that's getting off the Oxycodone.
Some experienced technical advise would be greatly appreciated.
 
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In case you have some kind of heart condition I absolutely recommend to do this under medical supervision. You are jeopardising your life with this. For a healthy person opiate withdrawal is nasty but not life-threatening, but your blood pressure will increase considerably during withdrawal. If your heart is already diseased, this can cause you a heart attack, stroke or cerebral haemorrhage. I have seen a man dying because of this!


In any case dropping the dose at noon should be enough for today. Try to stretch the doses out to 8 hours between dosing. How much Vicodin/Percocet do you have? You can use them at the end of the taper and therefore go at lower speed.
 
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Thank you VanWeyden.

Your comments helped more than you know.
I made it home and in the house after taking the other 15 mg. Its strange but after my 6-7pm dose, I don't feel the need like I do during the day.
I'm going to take 1.5 Zanax (.5 less than yesterday) in an hour or so. I'm going to stay with the zanax until im off the oc...but down to one.
I'm also going to get the SOMA down to 1.

Also... I received a call from my perk source. I told her I can't buy any more.--I said my wife caught me.
She's pretty angry as she buys them with her money for me. Leaving her holding the bag should burn that bridge.

I've tried to ween once or twice before and I find the 2nd day pretty miserable. As my body realises that I'm starving it of my usual 100 mg. I don't typically take oc at work so if I take 15 mg at lunch. I might be able to think straight.

Thanks again. I made it. Only 30 mg today.
To answer your question. I have approximately 30 750's with percocet printed on them.
Are they not the same as the 30's? Just containing acetominaphen?
I also have 20ish of oc 5's. Like the 30"s but white.
I will peek in on this thread later tonight.
Really. Thanks for the advise--without forcing me to do it 'your way'.
 
OP -- It hurts me in my heart that you are so adamant about not giving yourself the option, that you refuse to acknowledge this as a new possibility let alone opportunity, to better nurture your social capital (your support group, if you will).

Just say'n. I know though, I know. It is hard to open up. And, even then. Once I was able to come to terms with the fact I was a heroin addict, I still had a lot more work to do. Although I had begun to recognize myself as such, I didn't honestly feel it in my identity. I think, the reason for this was that, well, I was afraid. No one wants to be a heroin addict, ab junkie. I was scared. So I refused to try, but in my refusal I missed an opportunity. I became a contradiction. On the one hand I certainly knew and was able to recognize there was a problem, that I could technically be called a heroin addict, but on the other hand, I refused to accept this fact, rebelling against it. I continued to run away from myself. I continued to suffer, instead of feel, pain.

Of course, the mistake I made then was of the reactionary kind. The thing was, I didn't want to internalize the qualities that most people thing heroin addicts embody - lairs, cheats, theirs, rapists, essentially bad, manipulative, deceptive people. Fuck that shit!!! I'm not like that. I also know how to love, how to care for others. I know what it feels like to empathize with a stranger, what it feels like to hold true to my word.

But I had made mistakes. I had lied. I had stolen. At certain points I acted in manipulative and deceptive ways. Thus, at one point or another during my active addiction to heroin, I was a manipulative, deceptive, essentially bad person.

YET, that was not only what I was, or am, continue to be. I am so much more than someone who has told a lie. So much more than someone who has stolen. So, certainly, it's unfair to label me as such. But the thing is, people who know you already understand that you have done more than use drugs your whole life. People who know and respect you respect you for what you have done, and they will continue to do so. The problem is that, because it is shocking and scary to learn a loved one is an addict, people forget other aspects of your identity. Of course, addiction and everything that comes with it is serious shit. As such it tends to overshadow your accomplishments in another's mind, so that when they think of you they might think, "Addict,!" Instead of, "entrepreneur." And we should expect it to scare those who don't know, because they care for us. What reaction did you think they were gonna have. Yes, this is a big deal.

That being said, you can handle it... You might be an addict, but your still and entrepreneur. It goes the other way too.

It seems you too will miss such an opportunity here. Then again, whatever you will do, do not fret. The opportunity, in different ways and places, will comes knocking again, I am sure.

I don't mean to be such an asshole and tell you how to do things. I just wanted to express my own frustrations here. I, you see, missed so many opportunities in my own life doing what I see you doing her (i.e. refusing to let people in), and in a way I'm still angry at myself because of that. It almost makes me mad, because I didn't HAVE to suffer. I chose to. Thus, it hurts me in my heart when I see other people making this same, unnecessary although extremely instructional, mistake.

Iono... I hope you understand what I mean here.
 
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Newquiter said:
Thank you VanWeyden.

Your comments helped more than you know.
I made it home and in the house after taking the other 15 mg. Its strange but after my 6-7pm dose, I don't feel the need like I do during the day.
I'm going to take 1.5 Zanax (.5 less than yesterday) in an hour or so. I'm going to stay with the zanax until im off the oc...but down to one.
I'm also going to get the SOMA down to 1.

Also... I received a call from my perk source. I told her I can't buy any more.--I said my wife caught me.
She's pretty angry as she buys them with her money for me. Leaving her holding the bag should burn that bridge.

I've tried to ween once or twice before and I find the 2nd day pretty miserable. As my body realises that I'm starving it of my usual 100 mg. I don't typically take oc at work so if I take 15 mg at lunch. I might be able to think straight.

Thanks again. I made it. Only 30 mg today.
To answer your question. I have approximately 30 750's with percocet printed on them.
Are they not the same as the 30's? Just containing acetominaphen?
I also have 20ish of oc 5's. Like the 30"s but white.
I will peek in on this thread later tonight.
Really. Thanks for the advise--without forcing me to do it 'your way'.
Click to expand...

Take it slowly! First the opiates, then the benzos. You should also take your blood pressure daily, best right before you take your medication. I can't say anything about Percs or vikes because I live in Germany and those formulations are not sold over here, only straight oxy or combined with naloxone.

As for the general stuff, I agree with toothpastedog 100%. I literally breaks my heart and although I am a lot younger than you, I see myself so much in that. And I do not understand it entirely. You said that you kicked booze two years ago. Did you do that secretly, too, or was your wife involved back then. I think that you might make it through the withdrawal because you seem to be strong, but the time after getting sober is the hard part actually. I know that I would be lost without support. Period. It is so unbelievably exhausting to hide that shit, but you won't realize how much power it took from you until you start being honest. If you like, I can give you my email, so you can talk about what you fear will happen when you admit it to your wife.
 
^ Agreed. Quitting benzos is actually a lot more dangerous than quitting opiates, and trying to do both at once could further complicate things. Personally, I'd stick with a maintenance dose of the benzos while tapering off the opiates, but as long as you take care and don't go any lower on the benzos you will probably not have any issues in that regard.

While it's not impossible to do this on your own, you are making it a LOT harder for yourself. Most people would have huge difficulty doing that, especially while keeping up appearances. Tapering will help, but you have to understand as well that recovery doesn't necessarily end with the acute detox. PAWS is very real, and is the most common cause of relapse. That is where having the support of your family will help the most.

Regardless, do keep checking in. Who knows, you may be one of the few stoics who are able to kick, sucessfully and permanently, entirely on their own! Here's hoping :)
 
Do some research on kratom. It can help a lot with tapering off and sometimes totally eliminate opiate wd's when going cold turkey. The benzos are a more serious problem than the opiates are. Benzo wd's can be fatal. You need to be very carefull tapering off benzos and be aware that seizures can happen. Good luck and I sincerely mean it. As for your pill questions...Percocet is the same chem that is in oxy (oxycodone) the difference is in the amount per pill. Percs are usually 5mg or 10mg of oxy with the rest being APAP or aspirin or some other OTC pain killer. Oxycontin can be anywhere from 5mg up to 80mg. There were 160mg oxycontin but I think they have been discontinued. Vicodin is hydrocodone and they usually come in 5mg and 10mg pills with the rest being APAP or other OTC pain killer like aspirin or ibuprofin. There are so many different varieties and combinations of hydrocodone and oxycodone it can get confusing. As a rule oxycodone is harder to kick than hydrocodone. It would probably be easier to start the taper with oxy and finish with hydro and use kratom to help with the taper from begining to end. Kratom if used correctly can work miracles if you aren't in too deep. If someone has a $300 a day heroin habit kratom probably wouldn't help much. Just admitting you have a problem and need to do something about it is a big step in the right direction. I got off prescribed opiates after about 7 years of daily use and learned how to control dosage and taper off when I occasionally need to take them for pain. I never went to NA or any type of rehab or 12 step program but that doesn't mean that they aren't any good. If you have a psychological addiction I think some form of therapy or NA would probably be a good idea. My addiction was purely physical and I hated taking opiates for pain and had no problem with psychological cravings. My problems were all physical wd and other side effect related. Good luck. You can do it, it's really a matter of understanding how the drugs work on your physiology and sticking to a taper that works without causing too much discomfort.
 
Newquiter said:
First things first. And that's getting off the Oxycodone.
Some experienced technical advise would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

There is no one here that is qualified to give you that advice, and it's not the purpose of the forum. This isn't to suggest that someone won't offer, but I would be wary. We provide support to those struggling with addiction and issues related to recovery, but it's not a place where someone can cookbook a taper schedule for you. To get of the meds that you are taking both safely and successfully, you really need to do that under the advice of a physician.
 
Well I'm somewhat new to BL, but unfortunately not new to detoxing or kicking a habit. I've been a heroin addict going on around 25 years and honestly I'm still using...It's crazy cause I recently had to voluntarily commit myself to the psych unit in my hospital cause there were no beds available in the detoxes in my area; they're always full so I had to tell them I was suicidal and wanted to slit my wrists or take a syringe full of bleach or anything I could find that would end it for me. So I spent 4 days in there and after I spoke to the doctor and the counselor they got me in a bed at the detox. I was totally commited to stopping and somehow get my life together so I could live a "normal" life. At least that was the plan....After 4 days in the looney bin and 3 days in detox, I left AMA with a somewhat clear head but about the time I got home I was looking for a way to score! Sooooo pissed at myself, but that's the way it goes, I guess....Anyways my point is there's many ways to detox, cold turkey, methadone, suboxone. I found after many, many detoxes I felt that the drug clonidine worked best for me. It's prescribed for people with high blood pressure and they found that it works for opiate withdrawal as well. You could look into this more if you like, I just thought it was something else to try. I really can't tell you much about the benzos cause I didn't use them at all, my DOC was smack and that's all. I sure can identify with you not wanting to tell anyone about your problem; it makes me feel as if after you admit it to someone they look upon you as a "dirty junkie" or someone that's less than human, there's so much stigma attached to it, like you were some junkie robbing, stealing and snatching some old lady's purse and have a criminal record a mile long. I myself am not like that, I worked for my habit, borrowed money, sometimes didn't pay it back and pawned all my stuff till I lost it all. After 25 years of using dope the only thing on my record is a possession charge back in 1997, in which it was continued without a finding for a year provided I stayed clean. Unfortunately I couldn't and I violated my probation and was sentenced to four months in the county jail. I did a month in there, 2 months on the monitoring bracelet(which really sucked big time) but I did it and a month on parole.

I'm sorry if I went way off-topic, but I just wanted to make you understand that you're definitely not alone, and people you think may react with disgust or turn their backs on you may suprise you...my family which I was sure would turn their backs on me and cut me off after all the shit I put them through over the years actually didn't react like I thought; they are still supportive of me and would do anything to help me. I actually cried when I heard that, and the feeling I got was incredible in that it motivated me to quit all over again. To me it's worth being honest to whomever you admit it to...if they react negatively to you then I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, just ignore them and move on. I'm sure there's a lot of people in your circle of friends and family who've been somehow touched by addiction somewhere or sometime in their lives, I mean drug addiction is more prevalent these days, you always hear about this actor, actress, athlete, or some bigwig CEO going into treatment for various addictions; they even have TV shows about it like "Intervention", "Celebrity Rehab" or "Addicted" that wasn't around 10 or 20 years ago. If they can take a touchy subject like drug addiction and base shows on it, then you know it's something that is very common and widespread in our society. So don't worry about what people think about you when they find out; it takes a huge amount of strength to publicly admit you have a weakness and are asking for help...
 
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