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Hydergine/4-ACO-dmt - question for the experts

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EntheoDjinn

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I was really wondering if any of the chemists out there knew (or could hypothesise) whether there could be a chemical reaction between these two substances which might result in a toxic substance (see beneath)

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A friend of mine was recently given a small amount (approx 4mls @ 10mg/ml concentration) of 4-aco-dmt which had been placed in a bottle which contained a tiny amount of Hydergine (the Hydergine bottle was emptied but not rinsed out). Any of you chemistry buffs out there know if there could be any reaction/interaction that might prove harmful?

Thanks in anticipation :)
 
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Despite the fact that hydergine has been used in the treatment of dementia for many years, its mechanism of action is still not clear. It stimulates dopaminergic and serotonergic receptors and blocks alpha-adrenoreceptors. It is a nootropic. Current studies imply that the major effect of hydergine may be the modulation of synaptic neurotransmission rather than solely increasing blood flow as was once thought. A prominent feature that accompanies aging is an increase in monoamine oxidase (MAO) levels which results in decreased availability of catecholamines in the synaptic cleft. In one study, an interaction between age and hydergine treatment was observed in the hypothalamus, hippocampus and cerebellum. The hydergine effect was more pronounced in the aged group in the hypothalamus and cerebellum, and more pronounced in the adult in the hippocampus. These findings imply that increased brain MAO activity in aging can be modified by hydergine treatment in some brain regions.

the above is off wiki, i would guess if it affects the experience it will probably make the the trip stronger, if it decreases the mao enzymes effect through inhibition which is not conclusive above then that possibility would lead to stronger tripping as mao inhibitors and trips make for stronger trips. try using less of the mixture than you would 4aco-dmt on its own, i find 4aco-dmt can be overwhelming if you have a greedy dose.
 
pofacedhoe said:
.......... try using less of the mixture than you would 4aco-dmt on its own, i find 4aco-dmt can be overwhelming if you have a greedy dose.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that :)

I was thinking of 20mg for a first time. I've had lots of experience (35 years) of Mushies, Acid and Changa, so I'm thinking that it should not be overwhelming - it's only the addition of a tiny amount of Hydergine that makes me slightly wary.

But I would bow to experience of those more experienced with 4-ac0-dmt.

Z
 
Just wanted to bump this once - it kinda got lost without many replies which address my concerns. It may be that they are not worth addressing, or that no one can speculate, but then again being summer I thought maybe the chemists were all on holiday and missed it ;)
 
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Certain nootropics such as piracetam and modafinil do seem to potentiate 5HT2A agonist psychedelics (and some other drugs too). Not sure if this would apply to hydergine as the mechanism of action is not clearly defined, but even if it is a potentiator there probably wouldn't be enough in there to have any noticable effect if the bottle has been emptied out and reused, and you are only taking very small portions of the 4-AcO-DMT at a time.
 
Thanks for that mad_scientist :)

I wasn't really worried so much about the synergistic effects of the two materials - more the possibility that they might react together to form something nasty. Not being a chemist I just wondered..... :(
 
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