Opioids How can you tell if it's safe to fall asleep?

[Oxy8_8]

I usually take a higher dose of Oxy (with promethazine) at night because I suffer severe insomnia and it's pretty much the only way I'll sleep (well, some sort of medication).

I've seen so many posts on here of people saying when they get tired enough to "nod" they go for a walk or whatever so they don't fall asleep and stop breathing.

How can you tell at what point falling asleep would be dangerous? Like so you've taken enough to feel very warm and sleepy and nod off to sleep, but not so much that you don't wake up?

Starting this discussion for other people as well as myself as obviously this is a big safety issue.

 

[The Lone Deranger]

I would say this is practically impossable to answer accurately, As from person to person its differant, due to various differant types of opioids, tolerances, medical conditions, theres way too many variables, you could only generalise on the subject, but that would'nt be very helpful, or deffinative .

 

[orgone]

Personally if I'm actively nodding off I make sure I don't fall asleep. I'll actively walk around until I stop nodding. Obviously I've also nodded off so hard that I wake up 4 hours later having tipped out the back of a chair with my ass asleep. Wouldn't wish that on anyone.

 

[i are spectre]

you might want to wait until your coming down, past your peak, at least...

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Nobody is going to give you a concrete answer. You know your body better than we do.

For me at least, I can tell when I'm just normal nodding and when I'm nodding so hard I can't even control myself. So I can gauge when It's just a normal thing and no big deal and when laying down/going to sleep wouldn't be wise. But that just comes with experience.

You need to be aware of your own high. A safe bet though is if you're even debating your own safety, wait a while before going to sleep.

 

[BlueHues]

Chances are if you reach a dangerous level with it you probably won't really be aware or even care...If you're so fucked up that you're nodding while standing up and can't stay conscious no matter how hard you try, you need to get your blood pumping and avoid sitting down....

Almost everyone who is on the verge of ODing thinks that they're just high and wants to be left alone, if you're around normal people who don't know what to look for, they may just listen to you and leave you there on the couch by yourself to OD...

Once you've seen someone slip into an OD, it's not something you ever forget....I get really nervous being around people in a deep nod and I'm probably hyper-vigilant when it comes to checking on them....I've just seen it so many times, how quick it comes on....It's very scary to witness!

If you're walking around and just slightly catching a few light nods here and there while fucking around on your computer, you're not in OD territory...

Honestly, if you're throwing up and can't stop nodding, those are some strong signs that you're on the edge!

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Chances are if you reach a dangerous level with it you probably won't really be aware or even care...If you're so fucked up that you're nodding while standing up and can't stay conscious no matter how hard you try, you need to get your blood pumping and avoid sitting down....

Almost everyone who is on the verge of ODing thinks that they're just high and wants to be left alone, if you're around normal people who don't know what to look for, they may just listen to you and leave you there on the couch by yourself to OD...

Once you've seen someone slip into an OD, it's not something you ever forget....I get really nervous being around people in a deep nod and I'm probably hyper-vigilant when it comes to checking on them....I've just seen it so many times, how quick it comes on....It's very scary to witness!

If you're walking around and just slightly catching a few light nods here and there while fucking around on your computer, you're not in OD territory...

Honestly, if you're throwing up and can't stop nodding, those are some strong signs that you're on the edge!

Hues makes a good point. If you're at the point where you're still consciously worrying and thinking about your own safety, you're probably fine. Opiate OD's don't come with being aware. The user simply just passes out. So if you're that far gone, you won't be able to do much about it. Though, staying up and active if you are nodding extra hard can be enough to keep you from crossing that threshold

 

[Oxy8_8]

Hues makes a good point. If you're at the point where you're still consciously worrying and thinking about your own safety, you're probably fine. Opiate OD's don't come with being aware. The user simply just passes out. So if you're that far gone, you won't be able to do much about it. Though, staying up and active if you are nodding extra hard can be enough to keep you from crossing that threshold

Oh, that's good than. I never get into that kind of state. just get to where my eyelids are a bit droopy and I really want to sleep.
I never throw up or even get nauseous and I have fine balance when I walk.
When I say I "nod" I just mean feel really sleepy and find it hard to keep my eyes open/focuses. Not like people on "Intervention" where they literally nod off in the middle of conversations or sort of drift in and out of awareness.
I usually wait at least 30 minutes after my last insufflated dose so I know I've reach a peak and am not gonna get any more intoxicated.

 

[anythingbutsober]

Nobody is going to give you a concrete answer. You know your body better than we do.

For me at least, I can tell when I'm just normal nodding and when I'm nodding so hard I can't even control myself. So I can gauge when It's just a normal thing and no big deal and when laying down/going to sleep wouldn't be wise. But that just comes with experience.

You need to be aware of your own high. A safe bet though is if you're even debating your own safety, wait a while before going to sleep.

seconded. whenever i'm nodding normally, if i drift off to sleep it's not usually a big deal because i can sense my body's just ready for sleep.
but i can tell when i'm supernodding & that's when i get up, do something active. or i just make a strong cup of coffee or drink something else caffeinated to slightly counteract it. but that's just my strategy-- it might not work for others. my opiate of choice is hydrocodone, so it's not all that strong

 

[Oxy8_8]

seconded. whenever i'm nodding normally, if i drift off to sleep it's not usually a big deal because i can sense my body's just ready for sleep.
but i can tell when i'm supernodding & that's when i get up, do something active. or i just make a strong cup of coffee or drink something else caffeinated to slightly counteract it. but that's just my strategy-- it might not work for others. my opiate of choice is hydrocodone, so it's not all that strong

Same. I have Rocket Fuel (coffee with double caffeine-potency plus ginseng and taurine) and caffeine pills just in case, to help me stay awake.

It's more in your tolerance and weight than the potency, really. Well, to an extent. Obviously 50mg of codeine and 50mg fentanyl are gonna be VERY different, no matter what your tolerance.
For example, someone who weighs 100lb and has never taken an opiate in their life could probably OD on 100mg morphine, whereas a 300lb heavy user could probably handle 200mg Oxy no problem.

Personally, I'm around 105-110lb and 80-100mg Oxy gives me a warm buzz.

I think I'm safe to sleep then. I'm normally in a very warm-happy-sleepy feeling and can't get my eyes to stay open and focused very well (especially reading). Plus I'm usually in bed on my laptop, so I just put the laptop on the floor and lie back when I feel ready to sleep.

^^That sounds pretty safe right? It's pretty much what I've done every night for the last several months (the perfect insomnia cure...I even feel happy and refreshed when I wake up)

How does hydrocodone feel in comparison to Oxy? And in comparison to morphine? I've just started watching "House" (yeah, 9 years too late, lol) and I have a strong desire to try Vicodin.

 

[anythingbutsober]

^^That sounds pretty safe right? It's pretty much what I've done every night for the last several months (the perfect insomnia cure...I even feel happy and refreshed when I wake up)

How does hydrocodone feel in comparison to Oxy? And in comparison to morphine? I've just started watching "House" (yeah, 9 years too late, lol) and I have a strong desire to try Vicodin.

you obviously know your body better than any of us on BL, but that's a similar feeling to what i get when i am comfortably nodding & ready to go to sleep

i don't know much about how hydrocodone feels compared to morphine, because i've only had morphine twice-- in the hospital, after having ovarian cysts removed (twice). both hospital stays post-surgery were a week, but i was so doped up on morphine that i don't remember any of it. of course, i was 16 & 20 those times with NO tolerance at all, having never had painkillers, so i was unable to keep my eyes open at all & slept the whole time.

that being said, i've dabbled in oxycodone but find that it gives me a stronger nod that is harder to hide in day-to-day life with my family, boyfriend, friends... for me, it also makes me more hyper & active for the first few hours, so if i'm not doing something like cleaning or working, i become easily agitated because i have too much energy it seems. hydrocodone for me is more mellow & i find that i can relax much more easily.

does that make sense or do i sound atypical & crazy? :D

 

[Oxy8_8]

you obviously know your body better than any of us on BL, but that's a similar feeling to what i get when i am comfortably nodding & ready to go to sleep

i don't know much about how hydrocodone feels compared to morphine, because i've only had morphine twice-- in the hospital, after having ovarian cysts removed (twice). both hospital stays post-surgery were a week, but i was so doped up on morphine that i don't remember any of it. of course, i was 16 & 20 those times with NO tolerance at all, having never had painkillers, so i was unable to keep my eyes open at all & slept the whole time.

that being said, i've dabbled in oxycodone but find that it gives me a stronger nod that is harder to hide in day-to-day life with my family, boyfriend, friends... for me, it also makes me more hyper & active for the first few hours, so if i'm not doing something like cleaning or working, i become easily agitated because i have too much energy it seems. hydrocodone for me is more mellow & i find that i can relax much more easily.

does that make sense or do i sound atypical & crazy? :D

Haha no, that spounds about right. Where's morphine is immediately sedating, I do find oxy mildly stimulating and I get jobs done faster and have more energy. That's just at low doses, though. And it wears off after a couple hours and instead I get the more calm sedated feeling more typical of morphine etc. Moderate-high doses of Oxy only cause very brief energy rise, if any.

 

[down508]

I suggest trying to not rely on oxycodone for sleep. if you must take a drug for sleep, try benzos.

 

[anythingbutsober]

Haha no, that spounds about right. Where's morphine is immediately sedating, I do find oxy mildly stimulating and I get jobs done faster and have more energy. That's just at low doses, though. And it wears off after a couple hours and instead I get the more calm sedated feeling more typical of morphine etc. Moderate-high doses of Oxy only cause very brief energy rise, if any.

okay good, i was worried i was not normal :D

if you try hydrocodone, you'll probably find it to be weaker than oxycodone. there's an opioid conversion chart somewhere on here & i think 5 mgs of oxycodone is about 7.5-10mgs of hydrocodone. you probably have oxycodone pills without any apap, so don't forget to CWE if you're going to take more than a couple pills at a time (you probably know that already, but for HR purposes, i just felt like i should throw that out there)

BL was actually where i learned the CWE process. i've been lurking around here for a few years but only joined recently.

 

[adrandell116]

^^ Why would one CWE if they have Oxy WITHOUT APAP? Haha, backwards...

 

[Oxy8_8]

^^ Why would one CWE if they have Oxy WITHOUT APAP? Haha, backwards...

I think she meant that I am used to taking APAP-free Oxycodone/OxyContin so don't forget to do a CWE is I do try Vicodin (which I had previously mentioned wanted to try due to "House" lol).

 

[Morphling]

The question is, when did you last dose, and is your breathing depressed? Normal respiratory rate in adults is considered to be 12-24 breaths per minute. I wouldn't go to sleep if it isn't in the normal range, and you have taken an ER pill.

 

[Oxy8_8]

The question is, when did you last dose, and is your breathing depressed? Normal respiratory rate in adults is considered to be 12-24 breaths per minute. I wouldn't go to sleep if it isn't in the normal range, and you have taken an ER pill.

I don't take ER pills (well I do but I crush them; I get the OC OxyContins). My breathing is always normal. I've never times it, but it feels normal. It's not difficult to breath and I'm not out of breath or breathing shallowly.

 

[Morphling]

You're likely okay to go to sleep then. But watch it with the benzos, and careful with the fent patches!

 

[Oxy8_8]

You're likely okay to go to sleep then. But watch it with the benzos, and careful with the fent patches!

Thanks

I'll be using the patch on it's own (no other opiates or any benzos) just for those times when you don't wanna be high (or you just want a slight buzz, so you feel good but can still function normally) but want to stay out of withdrawal.

I plan to start off my alprazolam dose at 0.25mg with 1/3 my usual Oxy dose. Should be safe enough, right? I'll make sure I'm not home alone, too.