Supplements How can I recover faster naturally?

[thujone]

Is there any supplement(s) I can take that could knock a day off recovery time without side effects?

Performance feels solid but recovery takes four days -

Day 1 some soreness, day 2-3 heavy DOMS, day 4 feel strength coming back.

Eating more isn't possible, I'm already consuming as much I can and diet is optimal.

Sleep could always be better but I get 8 hours and feel rested mentally.

Currently I take 5G creatine + 5G glutamine in the morning, vit B, C, D at lunch and and in the evening a dose of whey protein with BCAAs.

 

[Serotonin101]

Recover in what way, and from what? You talking just the day in and day out beat down from the physical side of things? If so, it sounds like you're optimized from a natural stance. The bcaa's don't really do anything unless you just like the way they taste.

 

[Foreigner]

To better answer your question, I'd need to know: type of training (I'm assuming resistance), your age, and how long you've been training.

For DOMS I usually recommend active recovery. This looks like stretching, light cardio, swimming, and other types of light exercise on your off days, especially days 2-3 when you start getting DOMS. The reason is that DOMS is usually related to accumulation of waste products and not actual muscle injury. You need to circulate out the wastes with movement. If you're simply newer to training, then it's going to take time for your body to get efficient at moving out those wastes.

Zinc and magnesium are key nutrients for waste product removal from muscles. You could also try increasing B1 along with the zinc and mag. B1 is needed in glycolysis, which is the cellular breakdown of glucose into energy within the cell. If B1 isn't optimal (as well as magnesium), the cell switches some of its energy production to the lactic acid cycle. Then you get more lactic acid build up from exercise.

However, I think the first thing you should be trying is active recovery.

This is all assuming that you aren't simply working out too hard. If it's only soreness, then I'd say it's DOMS. If it's soreness + exhaustion + feeling run down/maybe getting sick more easily, then it might mean you're going too hard.

 

[thujone]

sorry guys, i didn't see the notification of new posts

Recover in what way, and from what? You talking just the day in and day out beat down from the physical side of things? If so, it sounds like you're optimized from a natural stance. The bcaa's don't really do anything unless you just like the way they taste.

yeah just feeling beat down, i want to get back into the gym a day earlier but still feel like i can't give it 100% if i don't take the extra rest.

the BCAAs are mixed in with the protein powder I take, tbh I don't know about the value of most of them but I do feel a big impact on endurance.

I suspect it's mostly the Arginine... I'm thinking of scaling back on the protein powder in general, but maybe it's worth supplementing just with Arginine pre-workout?

To better answer your question, I'd need to know: type of training (I'm assuming resistance), your age, and how long you've been training.

Closing in on 40 and been training on and off for two years (gained 20 lbs because I've just gotten skinnier since high-school) and I've been more disciplined since summer and just want to optimize and see how much I can gain in a year.

For DOMS I usually recommend active recovery. This looks like stretching, light cardio, swimming, and other types of light exercise on your off days, especially days 2-3 when you start getting DOMS. The reason is that DOMS is usually related to accumulation of waste products and not actual muscle injury. You need to circulate out the wastes with movement. If you're simply newer to training, then it's going to take time for your body to get efficient at moving out those wastes.

yeah I do stretch well after workout to deal with lactic acid and that seems to help the most in reducing the severity of soreness.

the severity of soreness has improved a lot but the duration hasn't... not sure if that's just from hitting the weights harder or if there's possibility to reduce it.

Zinc and magnesium are key nutrients for waste product removal from muscles. You could also try increasing B1 along with the zinc and mag. B1 is needed in glycolysis, which is the cellular breakdown of glucose into energy within the cell. If B1 isn't optimal (as well as magnesium), the cell switches some of its energy production to the lactic acid cycle. Then you get more lactic acid build up from exercise.

interesting... I do actually supplement with those daily but I was taking it mainly for immune health, didn't know it has muscle health benefits too

However, I think the first thing you should be trying is active recovery.

This is all assuming that you aren't simply working out too hard. If it's only soreness, then I'd say it's DOMS. If it's soreness + exhaustion + feeling run down/maybe getting sick more easily, then it might mean you're going too hard.

I feel run down sometimes but I think that's more due to going hard at gym and then having stress and sleep issues while trying to recover. This past week I've tried replacing protein with more carbs and that seems to help a lot with sleep quality.

I hope cutting protein isn't sabotaging gains but right now it feels like better sleep + more gym is more productive than more protein + less gym...

 

[NY2soFlo]

Eating Better (or in most probability more)
Looking at your calorie, and specifically protein intake throughout the day. If your eating in a couple big meals, drink some protein in between to give a more steady supply of amino acids.

Supplement wise, IMO theres no point to most OTC supplements outside of protein, creatine, multi-V, and PWO (unless you need something specifically for your own health). The only other supp I've come to love is HMB. Free acid or HMB Calcium. Its cheap. It's a "better" version of Leucine, when you take it it helps shift your body out of a catabolic state. So, theres no point in taking right around food, but first thing on wakeup, right before or after a workout, or in between meals is best. One of the few OTC supps worth spending money on IMO.

 

[Foreigner]

I feel run down sometimes but I think that's more due to going hard at gym and then having stress and sleep issues while trying to recover. This past week I've tried replacing protein with more carbs and that seems to help a lot with sleep quality.

I hope cutting protein isn't sabotaging gains but right now it feels like better sleep + more gym is more productive than more protein + less gym...

If you feel run down from working out then you're going too hard or too often. Another really important factor that most guys who heavy-lift don't know about is that every 8 weeks or so, you need to do a de-loading phase that lasts for a couple of weeks. In the de-loading phase, you reduce lifting weight by 20%. This is how you take a break without fully stopping. You won't lose strength within a couple of weeks, but it gives the body time for deeper recovery. In your case, it would also let you gauge if workout intensity is responsible for your DOMS and feeling run down. Many guys never de-load so the only time they truly end up getting a break is when their body finally gets sick (cold/flu) and forces them to stop. But stopping completely feels stagnating and isn't great either.

Cutting protein during heavy lifting periods is not a good idea. Consider that protein breaks down into amino acids, and amino acids feed neurotransmitters. So the body is trying to repair muscle tissue + still perform regular neurological functions, but now you've reduced protein. Also cortisol jacks up to deal with inflammation. Those two things affect sleep.

Macros need to be kept relatively high during heavy lifting, especially if you're feeling rundown. If you have a hard time eating to keep up with that and your digestion is sluggish, that's a further sign of overtraining. You're approaching 40... you're not old by any means, but you won't have the same recovery capacity as a 30 year old.

Your OP asked about introducing testosterone. T would decrease recovery time, but you still can't avoid the need for de-loading. In our age group, we need to protect our joints especially, so please consider de-loading and see if that helps.

 

[thujone]

Eating Better (or in most probability more)
Looking at your calorie, and specifically protein intake throughout the day. If your eating in a couple big meals, drink some protein in between to give a more steady supply of amino acids.

Supplement wise, IMO theres no point to most OTC supplements outside of protein, creatine, multi-V, and PWO (unless you need something specifically for your own health). The only other supp I've come to love is HMB. Free acid or HMB Calcium. Its cheap. It's a "better" version of Leucine, when you take it it helps shift your body out of a catabolic state. So, theres no point in taking right around food, but first thing on wakeup, right before or after a workout, or in between meals is best. One of the few OTC supps worth spending money on IMO.

thanks! HMB sounds promising, I will give it a try.

recovery mode = catabolic? I know anabolic = gains but not rly sure about the relationship between these two or like how that affects muscle growth.

If you feel run down from working out then you're going too hard or too often. Another really important factor that most guys who heavy-lift don't know about is that every 8 weeks or so, you need to do a de-loading phase that lasts for a couple of weeks. In the de-loading phase, you reduce lifting weight by 20%. This is how you take a break without fully stopping. You won't lose strength within a couple of weeks, but it gives the body time for deeper recovery. In your case, it would also let you gauge if workout intensity is responsible for your DOMS and feeling run down. Many guys never de-load so the only time they truly end up getting a break is when their body finally gets sick (cold/flu) and forces them to stop. But stopping completely feels stagnating and isn't great either.

interesting... I could try that, I definitely try and go hard when I go, sometimes I feel burned out but I assume it's mental because I feel better after a good pump but then sometimes I almost feel sick in the days after.

Cutting protein during heavy lifting periods is not a good idea. Consider that protein breaks down into amino acids, and amino acids feed neurotransmitters. So the body is trying to repair muscle tissue + still perform regular neurological functions, but now you've reduced protein. Also cortisol jacks up to deal with inflammation. Those two things affect sleep.

Macros need to be kept relatively high during heavy lifting, especially if you're feeling rundown. If you have a hard time eating to keep up with that and your digestion is sluggish, that's a further sign of overtraining. You're approaching 40... you're not old by any means, but you won't have the same recovery capacity as a 30 year old.

Unfortunately, my digestion has always been fucked, which is mainly why I didn't seriously attempt to gain mass when I was younger.

I only cut back on protein because it was necessary to bring macro ratios back into balance. I was at a plateau where I was losing weight getting leaner rather than gaining muscle mass. By rebalancing to more carbs, I'm sleeping better now and finally starting to gain (muscle) again.

I don't know if I can optimize any more on the protein front, already most of my protein is easily digestible lean ground beef and whey powder.

Your OP asked about introducing testosterone. T would decrease recovery time, but you still can't avoid the need for de-loading. In our age group, we need to protect our joints especially, so please consider de-loading and see if that helps.

I think this was probably someone else... I still have high T so that's why I'm trying to make the most of it before it starts to fade

 

[thujone]

I appreciate all the advice so far, already thinking of ways to incorporate bodyweight routine for active recovery, also want to get started on swimming (haven't done that in decades) and looking into this HMB stuff

 

[Foreigner]

thanks! HMB sounds promising, I will give it a try.

recovery mode = catabolic? I know anabolic = gains but not rly sure about the relationship between these two or like how that affects muscle growth.



interesting... I could try that, I definitely try and go hard when I go, sometimes I feel burned out but I assume it's mental because I feel better after a good pump but then sometimes I almost feel sick in the days after.



Unfortunately, my digestion has always been fucked, which is mainly why I didn't seriously attempt to gain mass when I was younger.

I only cut back on protein because it was necessary to bring macro ratios back into balance. I was at a plateau where I was losing weight getting leaner rather than gaining muscle mass. By rebalancing to more carbs, I'm sleeping better now and finally starting to gain (muscle) again.

I don't know if I can optimize any more on the protein front, already most of my protein is easily digestible lean ground beef and whey powder.



I think this was probably someone else... I still have high T so that's why I'm trying to make the most of it before it starts to fade

Oops sorry for the confusion, I was going on memory.

Just wanted to say, you usually feel good right after working out because of the endorphin rush... which is actually good for your health. But if you feel run down in the days after, your workout was too intense or nutrition is lacking, or some combo of the two.

 

[thujone]

Bump for progress, finally pushed through the plateau and gained 8lbs in 2 months

 

[Allylbenzene]

Currently I take 5G creatine + 5G glutamine in the morning, vit B, C, D at lunch

Have a look at some of the items I mentioned in this thread.

 

[cnnka]

Best you can do is high protein and lots of rest and sleep , also days off are always beneficial , I’ve seen plenty of gains the times I’ve taken 1-2 weeks off.

 

[thujone]

Have a look at some of the items I mentioned in this thread.

thanks, that's interesting stuff. i haven't heard of those ATP supporting acids, I'll check if there's a supplement with a few of those

I think I get most of the B vitamins in B-complex multivitamin.. used to supplement with taurine and did find that helpful for overall energy.

Best you can do is high protein and lots of rest and sleep , also days off are always beneficial , I’ve seen plenty of gains the times I’ve taken 1-2 weeks off.

i used to think i rested plenty but i think the long gym sessions were just frying me. i've since scaled back to lifting less and heavier -- everyone seemed to be saying 6-8 reps so i targeted that but i couldn't push through the plateau until i switched to heavy as possible for 2-3 reps

 

[cnnka]

thanks, that's interesting stuff. i haven't heard of those ATP supporting acids, I'll check if there's a supplement with a few of those

I think I get most of the B vitamins in B-complex multivitamin.. used to supplement with taurine and did find that helpful for overall energy.



i used to think i rested plenty but i think the long gym sessions were just frying me. i've since scaled back to lifting less and heavier -- everyone seemed to be saying 6-8 reps so i targeted that but i couldn't push through the plateau until i switched to heavy as possible for 2-3 reps

Good move! If you haven’t looked into it, check out Doggcrapp (DC) training and Blood & Guts to get a sense of how low-volume, high-intensity training plays out.

I’ve personally been training like that for years and have seen better gains in both size and strength, along with better recovery. I don’t train more than 45 minutes at most I get in, get the job done, and go home. I don’t have much time, I just need to get it done, if you get me.

 

[thujone]

oh yea i've heard of blood & guts, i've heard dorian yates speak a few times and he seems legit, i'll check it out.