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hit rockbottom quicker ?

Ah so you’re dealing with a love one who uses? What is the situation with them?

How to manage your situation will totally depend on the nature of your relationship and what your goals are with it.

One of the most important things to do is focus less on the other person and more on yourself. In other words, finding your own support system is essential. Some people find it in Al-anon, but I’ve had far worse experiences with them helping loved ones than professionals. Getting your own therapist you get along well, while not as simple as it might sound, is definitely worth the effort. There are lots of things you can do to take care of yourself, and that is more important than managing your loved one. That generally doesn’t tend to turn out too well, even when they want to be managed.

The big questions are what you want to get out of your relationship, regarding their drug issues but also beyond.

Sorry for misunderstanding the situation. I’d assumed you were the person with the drug issues, probably because I was rushing with the holiday here. Apologies.

Edit: I am so sorry for misunderstand what was going on here. You situations sounds absolutely horrible, but it doesn’t sound like there is much you can do except look out for your own interests right now. Keeping the lines of communication open (to the degree he’ll do so himself) is definitely a good idea, but I’d strongly suggest you focus on what you can do to protect yourself in the current situation. From you have written, it seems like the person doesn’t want anything to do with you and is content with fucking over loved ones. He is probably truly suffering, but he is also probably unaware of just what the impact he is doing is having on you all.
 
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ragtime2 said:
how can i get that message through to him without pushing him further away
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Just be there for him when he needs you.

Oh ok this is a boyfriend? He's abusive? That's a totally different situation. You need to get away and stay away. Tell your parents change your phone number and your living place. This is oh so serious. Most women who are victims of murder experienced physical abuse before hand. Drop everything and get the hell out of your situation
 
Meth is more important than being alive. I'd dose until my heart would go all funny and I'd black out for hours and wake up on the floor.

Good luck bro.
 
I hope OP didn't bow out like she mentioned above. I think it's pretty shitty that people are saying this isn't the place for advice on how to deal with a loved one using... where better?

Ragtime- be there when your husband asks for help, but sending money is not the answer. This will just enable him to spiral faster and further away. If you are there when he needs a safe place to land, you'll be helping BOTH of you. Giving an addict the means to get more drugs (i.e. money, valuables, etc.) just leads them down the road of addiction and further from help. While I agree that the statement 'they' have to hit rock bottom is deceiving in a lot of ways, everyone has their own bottom. It might be that his is simply hearing that you won't help him kill himself. So stay strong, be ready to help him find his safe place when he decides he wants it.

Best of luck- grsh
 
No. Not until their garden looks like a third world war zone will they wake up.

We just let go an employee of six years because of alcoholism. It's been five months. He's since lost three jobs, was disowned by his father, and has lost our friendship because in his mind, we don't understand. He's just a little sick. He won't come to work drunk again. How judgmental we are! They are just cocktails. He send vicious texts and then grovels an apology. We're not supposed to remember anything. Now he can't make his rent and will be homeless but it is everyone else's fault. He's 53.

These are not logical people. Their addiction stained their worldview. They are whining, churning, conniving, desperate addicts that will burn the world to get their fix. In this situation, I would encourage everyone dependent on him to plan for a life without him so that they aren't affected by his behavior as much. And if his family doesn't know what is coming, that puts you in a unique moral dilemma. Yet again, how addicts spread shit over everything they come into contact with.

I have been married 27 years. He is my life.I know the depth of love and dependence that you have on him. But as the child of addicts, and the ONLY non addict among five kids, believe me, you can't win. This isn't about you. It isn't about love. It's about his brain being hijacked and his consciousness not wanting to fight it. You have the power to decide to turn from him and to protect what he has put at risk, if you can. Pouring your efforts into changing his mind will be moot. Putting that energy into damage control WITH his family as allies is the only decent way to move forward. You will need to be the strong one for the innocent. I think you will find comfort in taking control.
 
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Wow, this thread really wound up full of toxic myths and misinformation.

OP, I hope you're still here...There's no need for a person to hit 'rock bottom' before they begin to undo addiction-related damage. A crucial thing for someone facing such problems is to be reminded (probably many times) that there are people who care about them no matter what. Friends and family must, of course, be sure to guard themselves first and to work hard not to support damaging behavior. But outside of those caveats, the more love and support you can offer, the better.

I also feel compelled to respond to ElleAZ's comment:

These are not logical people. Their addiction stained their worldview. They are whining, churning, conniving, desperate addicts that will burn the world to get their fix. In this situation, I would encourage everyone dependent on him to plan for a life without him so that they aren't affected by his behavior as much. And if his family doesn't know what is coming, that puts you in a unique moral dilemma. Yet again, how addicts spread shit over everything they come into contact with.

​
This is a cruel over-generalization. It also smacks of uninformed, Reagan-era 'tough love' approaches to recovery. The members of the Sober Living forum are--almost across the board--people whose lives have been profoundly wounded by addiction but who are making good-faith efforts to get better. It seems to me that the person spreading shit over everything is you.

<3
Sim
 
Like a couple others have said rock bottom is kind of a bad terminology. It's different for everyone, some people see that they're hurting the people they love and that's their trigger to quit, others have to lose everything to see the light. I had a friend for a while who was on heroin, he never showed any interest in quitting until his fiancee said she couldn't see him like that and she was leaving if he didn't get clean, so he did and stayed clean. Whereas for me getting clean the first time took me laying in a hospital bed alone, not remembering how I'd gotten there, and having a doctor telling me I'd od'd. It took me almost dying alone on the streets to see that light.

Just be there for him when he needs you, that is the best course of action.
 
This thread reminds me that the most important work is the work against the stigma of addiction. No one sets out to get addicted. No one sets out to destroy everything they love.
 
Very true cj that stigma, leads to a lot of good people never getting help
 

​
"This is a cruel over-generalization. It also smacks of uninformed, Reagan-era 'tough love' approaches to recovery. The members of the Sober Living forum are--almost across the board--people whose lives have been profoundly wounded by addiction but who are making good-faith efforts to get better. It seems to me that the person spreading shit over everything is you." ​


I was raised by addicts. Beaten, touched, and neglected by addicts. I was stolen from. I was put in dangerous situations. I have cigarette burns on my hands from my junkie prostitute sister. My father abandoned us before I was one and drank himself to death at 52.

I am not in an ivory tower, untouched by addiction. I've been touched all over by addiction, sweetie.

My comment was obviously about people in active addiction, not those "making good faith efforts to get better." And her husband IS burning the world to feed his hunger. I have a right to my opinion. Addiction changes people and destroys everything it touches. I did not make my comment personal to anyone. But you did get personal. That's not my problem.

By all means, feel superior over my limited knowledge and understanding of addiction. I obviously have issues.
 
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simco said:
Wow, this thread really wound up full of toxic myths and misinformation.

OP, I hope you're still here...There's no need for a person to hit 'rock bottom' before they begin to undo addiction-related damage. A crucial thing for someone facing such problems is to be reminded (probably many times) that there are people who care about them no matter what. Friends and family must, of course, be sure to guard themselves first and to work hard not to support damaging behavior. But outside of those caveats, the more love and support you can offer, the better.

I also feel compelled to respond to ElleAZ's comment:
These are not logical people. Their addiction stained their worldview. They are whining, churning, conniving, desperate addicts that will burn the world to get their fix. In this situation, I would encourage everyone dependent on him to plan for a life without him so that they aren't affected by his behavior as much. And if his family doesn't know what is coming, that puts you in a unique moral dilemma. Yet again, how addicts spread shit over everything they come into contact with.

​
This is a cruel over-generalization. It also smacks of uninformed, Reagan-era 'tough love' approaches to recovery. The members of the Sober Living forum are--almost across the board--people whose lives have been profoundly wounded by addiction but who are making good-faith efforts to get better. It seems to me that the person spreading shit over everything is you.
Click to expand...
 
simco said:
Wow, this thread really wound up full of toxic myths and misinformation.

OP, I hope you're still here...There's no need for a person to hit 'rock bottom' before they begin to undo addiction-related damage. A crucial thing for someone facing such problems is to be reminded (probably many times) that there are people who care about them no matter what. Friends and family must, of course, be sure to guard themselves first and to work hard not to support damaging behavior. But outside of those caveats, the more love and support you can offer, the better.

I also feel compelled to respond to ElleAZ's comment:

These are not logical people. Their addiction stained their worldview. They are whining, churning, conniving, desperate addicts that will burn the world to get their fix. In this situation, I would encourage everyone dependent on him to plan for a life without him so that they aren't affected by his behavior as much. And if his family doesn't know what is coming, that puts you in a unique moral dilemma. Yet again, how addicts spread shit over everything they come into contact with.

​
This is a cruel over-generalization. It also smacks of uninformed, Reagan-era 'tough love' approaches to recovery. The members of the Sober Living forum are--almost across the board--people whose lives have been profoundly wounded by addiction but who are making good-faith efforts to get better. It seems to me that the person spreading shit over everything is you.

<3
Sim
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cj said:
This thread reminds me that the most important work is the work against the stigma of addiction. No one sets out to get addicted. No one sets out to destroy everything they love.
Click to expand...

Very true.

The frustrating thing is that we all want the same thing in this, to live healthier, successfully, more meaningful, fulfilling lives worth living. And even more so, what will be truly beneficial to the person struggling with substance use disorder tends to also be what is truly beneficial for the person who is struggling with their relationships with people who use or anyone else. That is, navigating healthy boundaries, ethics, etc. That is a very developmental kind of thing that must be learned, and without healthy people in our lives it is a lot harder to figure them out.

Mistakes can be useful, lest we let them define who we are (or let others define who we are only or primarily through our mistakes).

Reminds me how it is possible to use drugs, and that being something that becomes an unhealthy part of one's life, and that quitting drugs is not necessarily what's most needed to solve the problem. Of course, not engaging in drug use that causes one/other harm is a very basic way to improve the situation, but it is very rare for issues just isolated to surrounding drug use. Normally they bleed into drug using behavior or infest it from the start, but they also seep into all other areas of life as well.

I often feel recovery is all about cultivating resiliency in the face of all the various hardships life will invariably bring, whether because we continue making mistakes or just because life just does what it tends to do (stress, etc).

Iono, I'm going off on a tangent now.

I hope the OP comes back at some point, I'd be curious to hear more about how they're handling this.
 
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ElleAZ said:

​
"This is a cruel over-generalization. It also smacks of uninformed, Reagan-era 'tough love' approaches to recovery. The members of the Sober Living forum are--almost across the board--people whose lives have been profoundly wounded by addiction but who are making good-faith efforts to get better. It seems to me that the person spreading shit over everything is you." ​


I was raised by addicts. Beaten, touched, and neglected by addicts. I was stolen from. I was put in dangerous situations. I have cigarette burns on my hands from my junkie prostitute sister. My father abandoned us before I was one and drank himself to death at 52.

I am not in an ivory tower, untouched by addiction. I've been touched all over by addiction, sweetie.

My comment was obviously about people in active addiction, not those "making good faith efforts to get better." And her husband IS burning the world to feed his hunger. I have a right to my opinion. Addiction changes people and destroys everything it touches. I did not make my comment personal to anyone. But you did get personal. That's not my problem.

By all means, feel superior over my limited knowledge and understanding of addiction. I obviously have issues.
Click to expand...

I am really sorry to hear what a rough time you had growing up. That flat-out sucks, and I can only imagine the scars that all must have left. No child should have to deal with that kind of shit.
 
ElleAZ said:

​
"This is a cruel over-generalization. It also smacks of uninformed, Reagan-era 'tough love' approaches to recovery. The members of the Sober Living forum are--almost across the board--people whose lives have been profoundly wounded by addiction but who are making good-faith efforts to get better. It seems to me that the person spreading shit over everything is you." ​


I was raised by addicts. Beaten, touched, and neglected by addicts. I was stolen from. I was put in dangerous situations. I have cigarette burns on my hands from my junkie prostitute sister. My father abandoned us before I was one and drank himself to death at 52.

I am not in an ivory tower, untouched by addiction. I've been touched all over by addiction, sweetie.

My comment was obviously about people in active addiction, not those "making good faith efforts to get better." And her husband IS burning the world to feed his hunger. I have a right to my opinion. Addiction changes people and destroys everything it touches. I did not make my comment personal to anyone. But you did get personal. That's not my problem.

By all means, feel superior over my limited knowledge and understanding of addiction. I obviously have issues.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry you went through that. I really am. I didn't have a good childhood either in fact it was fucking bad. Maybe this should be left alone but I have to say not all bad people are addicts and not all addicts are bad people. It takes a special kind of asshole to hurt a child in an overt way and I don't think addiction excuses or explains it.
 
Sounds like they weren't just describing addiction or substance use disorder, but an extreme of addiction where it's involved in broader harmful behaviors, like child abuse. That's not just a drug issue (or even primarily an issue of drug use in my eyes), so much as it is an issue related to parenting, anger, and likely serve mental health challenges. Way more than just addiction going on there, as sad as it is.

cj said:
I have to say not all bad people are addicts and not all addicts are bad people. It takes a special kind of asshole to hurt a child in an overt way and I don't think addiction excuses or explains it.
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I agreed. I think there are issues at hand with most cases of abusive caregivers that extend far beyond just drug use. The drug use might certainly contribute and add fuel to the problem, but there is far deeper things at issue than just drug use when someone is abusing their child.

A lot of abusive folks I have met engage in drug use because, on some level, they feel like a piece of shit for what they do, at least to the degree they're aware of it. It's not an excuse for them, just a little context as to how the drug use can fuel other harmful, unaware patterns.

Still keeping my fingers crossed we hear back from the OP at some point.
 
simco said:
There's no need for a person to hit 'rock bottom' before they begin to undo addiction-related damage. A crucial thing for someone facing such problems is to be reminded (probably many times) that there are people who care about them no matter what. Friends and family must, of course, be sure to guard themselves first and to work hard not to support damaging behavior. But outside of those caveats, the more love and support you can offer, the better.
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Well said, my friend :D
I never liked it on "Intervention" when they would tell the addict's family to "bring the bottom TO them".

First of all, it sounds cruel. Second, I can tell you from personal experience that sometimes "rock bottom" seems more like a bottomless pit; I went through a few things that I thought would have "scared me straight" (having a gun pulled on me comes to mind), but as I'm sure you can already guess... they didn't!
 
Indeed. In themselves traumatic experiences reinforce unhealthy behaviors/coping skills related to substance use disorder, not resolve them... They rarely seem to directly lead to any resolution whatsoever - that is the exception, not the rule. It blow my mind how people think it works the other way around.
 
ElleAZ said:
I was raised by addicts. Beaten, touched, and neglected by addicts. I was stolen from. I was put in dangerous situations. I have cigarette burns on my hands from my junkie prostitute sister. My father abandoned us before I was one and drank himself to death at 52.
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That is utterly heartbreaking, and I am deeply sorry that you had to endure it.

My dad was an abusive alcoholic, although not nearly to that degree. Unfortunately, I started to develop my own addictions around the age of 25. Although I have never been physically abusive towards anyone, I HAVE hurt the people closest to me through my words and actions. That is the main thing that started me on the journey toward recovery.

Much Love,
Dreamflyer
 
G.R.S.H. said:
I hope OP didn't bow out like she mentioned above. I think it's pretty shitty that people are saying this isn't the place for advice on how to deal with a loved one using... where better?
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OP has now gone, for the sake of moving to the correct sub forum :|
 
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