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Heroin Heroin Addiction and Codeine Based Opiate Replacement Therapy

Doctors should look at what addicts use when they run out of their DOC. Some might score DHC, some Ultram and Darvocet. Those particular drugs don't keep withdrawal at bay, but it does make wd a bit more comfortable. Add clonidine and benzos (or z-drugs for sleep) and you've got a decent detox set up. It won't be Disney World, but it would be much better than cold turkey. Since I have to quit suboxone now, I'll probably use Ultram, which is what I call "poor man's methadone". I've never, EVER gotten high off of it, but it does give me some energy and brings back some equilibrium during the Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome.
 
In france codeine is otc (20 mg pills without APAP )and very cheap , it is sarcasticly referred to as "the french methadone project " by junkies , before subutex which was introduced it was the only option for opiate maintenance for recovering french addicts , in big cities such as paris it's not uncommon to find whole streets paved with empty Neo-codione boxes.

I must say that even at a high tolerance one of those boxes will hold you for a day or at the least 5 hours If you ahve to take the whole box at once (400 mG)
 
Absolutely Binge. Personally I find that Codeine is much better at controlling cravings that DHC or Buprenorphine. It's a shame the half-life isn't greater. Controlled release is one thing I'm thinking about and looking into.
 
Tramal, Ultram etc.

McFly said:
Yeah, i like tramadol though
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Hey. Although yes Tramal targets 1 opiate receptor (TRUE opiates target many more), Tramal, Ultram, whatever country you're in, you must understand that Tramal is vastly structurally different to an opiate. It's not even in the class of opiates of this reason...

There are many opiate receptors. I will name them, but they are in greek alphabet. δ which is Delta, which resides in brain, κ - Kappa - which is another receptor found in brain, μ which a lot of American texts call "mu" but it really is pronouced "Mju". The last one is slightly different, does not only reside in brain (also spinal cord) and is not in a letter of Greek alphabet - it's called Nociceptin receptor. (OP4)...

Tramal uses only 1 of these receptors and in a very poor way. Sure you might get off your face on it but its pretty bad for you if you take more than is prescribed. It is a μ receptor agonist, but that is the only opiate part of it. The rest of it contains Noradrenergic and Serotonergic qualities, which brings up an important point. If you are on any antidepressant, even if it is not an SSRI, you *SHOULD NOT TAKE* Tramal, and double goes for pregnant women and women breastfeeding.

So I guess what I am saying in essence is Tramal is more of an antidepressant-type drug than it is a painkiller, but by making you happier, you feel less pain. But please, people on antidepressants - be careful. Too many lives have been lost already from this confusion.

Regards
Pharm
 
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If you or someone else you know has consumed both an antidepressant and Tramal, they should be taken to ED/ER (Whatever country you're in) as it can cause severe Sertonin syndrome.
 
If the dose is low then it's fine. I've been scripted Tramadol whilst on Dosulepin and was fine.
It's just large doses you need to be weary of.
 
Hey there... where can you go for this APOMORPHINE treatment???? I wanna try it but can't find it...
thanks
 
heroin withdrawal

I would recommend trying an antihistamine (like hydroxyzine) + a benzodiazepine + tramal + clonidine. It should put a person to sleep and Tramal is known to make opioid withdrawal symptoms less severe as well as clonidine is (it is a sympatholytic drug, thus lowering blood pressure, reducing anxiety, it is known to reduce symptoms of opioid withdrawal with no abuse potential). The practice where I work is giving hydroxyzine with tramal up to max. dose, then giving enough clonidine to induce profound sedation, and using benzodiazepines if this is not enough (long lasting, like clonazepam). Usually heroine addicts respond very favorably to this combination (although monitoring is neccessary) - it puts them to sleep - we keep them on this combo for a couple of days (4-5), first going off the benzodiazepine (cause it is addicting in its own right), then reducing the dose of clonidine (but not to 0 as rebound hypertension and overstimulation may occur easily in people whose sympathetic system was suppressed for a long time). It is possible to change Tramal to Methadone if its not working well enough.
Sometimes we add an antidepressant to this combo, for example venlafaxine (its chemically similar to Tramal btw) but cautiously as it may provoke serotonin syndrome (hopefully I have not seen it yet and we have experience).
Most of times such treatment makes coming off opiates quite painless (person is sleeping through the worst period) and if he/she is willing to continue treatment its a good starting point. Most ppl still use some kind of opiate afterwards (like Tramal or Methadone) cause the addiction is often very strong, but they are a lot less damaging than IV heroin.
 
As some have said, see f you can get a hold of some Tramadol Hcl (Ultram, Ultracet ER, ect...) I would say give that a try. Some people get a lot out of this drug while it leaves others wishing for more, so I'd say test it out before investing too much of your time/money into it. Tramadol is a pseudo-opiod SSRI with pleasant opiate effects. The good thing about this drug is that it's very cheap in case you'd don't have health insurance & doctors are very liberal about prescribing this particular pain-killer. However Tramadol will still give you a withdrawl (Slight SSRI WD aswell), but tapering effectively to a low-enough dose should keep this to a minimum.

Good Luck!
- Rob
 
CLONIDINE
VALIUM
DOLOXENE
Im so dopey i cant tell im withdrawing at all, only on day 3 tho.
I have backup SEROQUEL
DONT MIX TRAMAL IF YOUR ON ANTIDEPRESSANTS
2nded
 
Unknown said:
In the US, doctors arent allowed to rx narcotics for detox maintenance. The only approved drugs are methadone (CII) and buprenorphine in subutex/suboxone preparations (CIII).

I think buprenorphine is the best way to get off that shit...
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yeah but they do, law is stupid
 
^^^ always depends on ur dr and ur relationship/trust with them...
My doc for example, i was addicted to codeine, DXM, valium and occasional herroin.

I decided myself he should put me on a program, i stayed on the program and stayed clean for 5 months (drug testing of course) and built some rapport.

Now he is happy to work with me in my decision to jump off the methadone program.
He scripts me valium and an opiate (amongst other symptomatic things) to use during a home detox as i wanted.

I have never experienced this before, and the honest reason, he is the FIRST i mean FIRST DR i have never lied too... go figure.
 
umm my doctor prescribed me a regiment of oxy starting with 3 80's per day and tapering down 20mg a week until i got 10s and then 5s (yes, contin 5's).
 
I would imagine in the UK they're much, much stricter about using certain meds and the "pick up your script for the day" thing. I'm hoping, when I try abstain my use again, to try get the Dr. to try something different.
 
triiper said:
umm my doctor prescribed me a regiment of oxy starting with 3 80's per day and tapering down 20mg a week until i got 10s and then 5s (yes, contin 5's).
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yaeh my friend tried that too
went from #45 5mg script a week, to a 45 10mg script (note:eek:xycodone alone [no acetaminphon])...bla bla bla, now he ends up getting 4 yes 4 seperate RXs a week for 15 80sOCs...thats 600mg-1200mg a day this kid was popping...luckely his dr fucked him over an went on vacation without calling him so hes weeaned off with perks/vikes all CWE (about 30-50 a day) til he was at about 300mg than he waited 16hrs and took his subs..omg he was a 2 days ago and yesterday but fine tody
 
I was hooked on some opiate based stuff for a while. This is how it looks from my point of view, codeine < subuxone < methadone. Most people are starting to see that the Suboxone train doesn't have any stops on it's route, and every now and then a few people manage to painfully jump off. I spent a year and a half on Suboxone (realizing I was getting high off of it) before I decided to switch to codeine. Now given respect to the fact I am a kickboxer and have had many major surgeries, most doctor's would prescribe any painkiller I want, but fact is, this is all pain I can tough out myself without opiates just like millions of people do everyday. To this day I take 20MG of codeine everyday, have been doing it for about a 2 years now. It keeps cravings down, and makes me feel "normal" more or less, as opposed to a Suboxone or Methadone high. Not to mention it doesn't rot my teeth (I was amazed how much better dental condition my mouth was in a year after stopping sub). I have abused it 4 times in the past couple of years (took about 50MG) when I get knocked out and my neck is just killing me (real pain or binge? who knows, you be the judge), but what I do know is it keeps me normal, people can't tell I am high, and with my life I don't have time to take 6 months off to rebuild a new life and a new mental outlook on everything. It is what it is. I can buy it over the counter, no need to be evaluated by judgmental doctors, etc. This works for me, may, or may not work for you.
 
I tried tramadol when i was about 8 days clean having horrible paws. Taking 150mg did let me get to sleep and take away the heebiejeebies but if I was in the pit of my addiction doing oxy/h every day i doubt they would do SHIT for my withdrawals. They are weak as fuck...i don't get how people party on them/

theartofwar said:
I'm on 8th day dome w/ds tramadol is an option, I just want to get rid of the RLS it's driving me nuttier than squirrel shit... aside from the rec dosages that ppl use tramadol or ultram has anyone had success atleast easing the RLS symptoms w/tram?
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That's a fact jack. And if it ain't a fact, then it's an awful big coincidence how alotta bupe and sub users have teeth problems.
 
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