Giblets CLXXXII - Tree worship time is almost upon us

[Ceres]

scotch mist: mxe does have opiate receptor activity, i can imagine it probably is very useful for opiate detox, partly because of that but also partly because of the NMDA action on your mood, aswell as being capable of making you lose track of time and feel out of it aswell.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

perhaps mxe could also help with opi w/ds in terms of you being mentally detactched from your physical body.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

Dissociatives in general can inflate your ego, I've found. I notice it in myself, and I notice it in friends.

cheers for that, i feel much better about myself now. :D

I do have some ego stuff going on sometimes, but most of the time i think im generally far more 'level headed' and "grounded" now, especially compared to how i was in my late teens and early 20s when my ego was embarrasingly out of control.

I guess its a relatively normal part of 'growing up' from a teenager to a 'mature adult' for many people. Its been an ongoing quest to develop a healthy self confidence for valid reasons, rather than letting the good things 'go to my head'. I think drugs definately feed into the whole ego thing, sometimes in an unhealthy way.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

it's because these drugs poke part of your brain involved in mania, its nothing to do with underlying psychological tendencies, 3-meo-pcp in particular is bad for this, mxe not so much but the dissociation gives you this kind of weird perspective that makes you more engaged with the real and there is a lot of mind fuckery to be had if you delve deep with these substances.

never tried 3-meo-pcp and from what you've said i never want to either. I used to find even with things like liberty caps that i felt like some "all seeing - all knowing" fucking egomaniac. I was but a youth at the time though. I found that mxe could give me the feeling that the whole world was revolving around me, which i found very embarrasing afterwards, and it spoiled the enjoyment as its one of my flaws im trying to correct or atleast monitor.

 

[Chatative]

Tis all rather hard to comprehend really.. Why it isn't used more for opiate detox ill never know

I always thought that MXE had an intial opiate like warmth, does it act on those receptors at all in a minor way... might explain why it works so well for opiate detox. I thought that was what made it such a lovely drug, the opiate warmth, dissociation & mind expansion... not to mention melting through furniture.

As you say, F&B... come hither! :D

PS - Cheers Ceres. Answered the question. Should really read through all replies before posting. 8)

 

[ColtDan]

I always thought that MXE had an intial opiate like warmth, does it act on those receptors at all in a minor way... might explain why it works so well for opiate detox. I thought that was what made it such a lovely drug, the opiate warmth, dissociation & mind expansion... not to mention melting through furniture.

Spot on

 

[felix]

I always thought that MXE had an intial opiate like warmth, does it act on those receptors at all in a minor way... might explain why it works so well for opiate detox. I thought that was what made it such a lovely drug, the opiate warmth, dissociation & mind expansion... not to mention melting through furniture.

Yes! That was a deliberate part of its design, before it was even made. Something about the PCP bit binding to the opioid receptors, or summat else I don't understand.

 

[Chatative]

Didn't someone on BL design, or take part in pushing vendors towards this RC? Might be another drug I was thinking of but sure it was MXE.

*edit* - Yes, never mind I have my answer.

 

[Ceres]

never tried 3-meo-pcp and from what you've said i never want to either. I used to find even with things like liberty caps that i felt like some "all seeing - all knowing" fucking egomaniac. I was but a youth at the time though. I found that mxe could give me the feeling that the whole world was revolving around me, which i found very embarrasing afterwards, and it spoiled the enjoyment as its one of my flaws im trying to correct or atleast monitor.

3-meo-pcp is glorious. Shame it's banned now.

I really don't get how mxe ended up being in a tabloid newspaper shitstorm leading to its banning, when it was probably one of the safest rc's on the market. Even a lot of ket heads I spoke to didn't rate is a recreactional drug.

Now it is scheduled a huge barrier has been put up to any legitemate scientific / medical research being done with it as a potential therapeutic agent.

 

[StoneHappyMonday]

I think I can answer that one Ceres. War on drugs and media are lying pile of shit.

Yep. That covers it.

 

[Ceres]

Succinct. Bunch of tossers in charge of policy.

 

[StoneHappyMonday]

Even more succinct. It's not even the individuals. It's the hegemonic nature in charge of tosserdom.

 

[Ceres]

Good point. It is kind of sickening that of all people the americans are leading the way with decriminalising the weed. They still need to learn to pronounce the H in Herb though.

 

[Sammy G]

Now it is scheduled a huge barrier has been put up to any legitemate scientific / medical research being done with it as a potential therapeutic agent.

Is that strictly true though? Trials have been conducted with ketamine in the treatment of bipolar depression recently. Okay, ketamine's different in that it was used in medicine for a long time before it became a street drug, but its notoriety would have made the researchers' task more difficult if anything.

Interestingly, ketamine's efficacy as an antidepressant is confirmed by the research, but its suitability as a long-term treatment is almost universally considered to be highly questionable.

 

[StoneHappyMonday]

Is that strictly true though? Trials have been conducted with ketamine in the treatment of bipolar depression recently. Okay, ketamine's different in that it was used in medicine for a long time before it became a street drug.

Yea it is true precisely because of this being the difference. Ket trials started waaaaaaay before it was popularised as a street drug.

 

[Ceres]

The problem is that the way they have amended the law means scientists who want to research that entire class of compounds have to go to a lot of trouble to do so,

David Nutt and the ISCD discuss this precisely, relating to methoxatime here http://www.drugscience.org.uk/blog/2013/01/23/throwing-out-baby-bathwater/

Although putting analogues in Schedule 1 still theoretically allows them to be researched, the current situation regarding Schedule 1 licenses is such that this research will be severely hampered. The holding of Schedule 1 drugs is subject to a specific Home Office license that now costs about £5000 to obtain and then incurs significant time and other costs in relation to inspection . It also takes up to a year to get one. Currently we know of only 4 hospitals in the UK with one; neither Hammersmith Hospital or University College Hospital, two of the leading clinical research centres in the UK hold one. In contrast NHS hospital and university departments that conduct biomedical research which requires controlled drugs in Schedules 2-5 are exempt from the need to purchase a license to hold these. These hurdles induced by Schedule 1 status, though surmountable, effectively stifle research.

Interestingly, ketamine's efficacy as an antidepressant is confirmed by the research, but its suitability as a long-term treatment is almost universally considered to be highly questionable.

Ketamine is not a long term antidepressant drug. It is useful in acute depressive episodes. That is what the research and trials are beginning to demonstrate. Even though a lot of people knew this already from first hand experience.

 

[Sammy G]

Aye, it's a notable difference.

What I'm getting at though, is despite ket's subsequent demonisation, it's still being used experimentally in that context. I'm sure that if Big Pharma saw better potential in methoxetamine, it'd be patented and in the same kind of trials before you could say 'profit'.

Ketamine is not a long term antidepressant drug. It is useful in acute depressive episodes. That is what the research and trials are beginning to demonstrate.

Um, that's kind of exactly what I said.

 

[Ceres]

Big pharma doesn't see potential in methoxetamine, or isn't making noises about it, because it emerged as a grey market drug outside of the leviathan procedural ways of the big pharma market. It will be years and years before it filters up from research labs into anything remotely resembling a lead compound.

MXE appearing on the grey market just meant people had access to it to use it and experiement with without the shackles of big industry or politics. Which is the whole point of the RC market for me, and the beautiful, yet risky thing about it.

 

[Ceres]

the NMDA receptor role in depression is somethng that ketamine has brought to light, the fact is used as a drug of abuse is neither here or there as far as drug companies are concerned.

 

[Sammy G]

I see what you mean, and I used to agree. There's just too much ill-advised self-medicating going on. I've been as guilty as anyone. More guilty than most, in fact.