Gibberings CLXIX: Theresa May's Amazing Legs

[ColtDan]

Yeah pretty much... we should probably drop this now while there is still a shred of doubt that i'm not some kind of internet sweat fetishist.

Haha

 

[Eveleivibe]

Yeah pretty much... we should probably drop this now while there is still a shred of doubt that i'm not some kind of internet sweat fetishist.




I read it and agree, the notion that PAWs is some kind of biological repentance system for your drug sins is utterly bizarre.

Eh??? Whi said PAWS is a biological repentant for drug sins????? That doesn't sound right somehow. PAWS is biological yes in the fact that the drugs have affected the brain. SSRI will just prolong this.

Let me give you an example:

If you've had a plaster over a wound, the wound is now healing n there's no need for the plaster. Do you A, rip it off slowly prolonging the agony or B rip it off fast speeding up the process?

Nontheless SM has a good head on his shoulders, he'll do what's best for him, armed with as much information as possible.

I've PMd him link to a good thread by NSA, who I have a lot of respect for on BL - knows his stuff on addiction n the stuff he's wrote is ace. Take a look at sober living.

Evey

 

[spacejunk]

Eh??? Whi said PAWS is a biological repentant for drug sins????? That doesn't sound right somehow. PAWS is biological yes in the fact that the drugs have affected the brain. SSRI will just prolong this.

Can you provide a source to support this?
As your whole hypothesis relies on this premise, it would be worthwhile to verify its accuracy.

 

[Ceres]

no offenc​

 

[ponch]

I do believe you should suffer it as I way of never going back there.

This is what I was referring to with that quote. Why would you allow people to suffer unnecessary? Comes across as trying to teach someone a lesson for their drug taking sins.

Your plaster analogy doesn't seem to have any real basis in this example whichever way you remove a plaster it does not affect your quality of life. PAWs can last for a very long time, what are people meant to do in that time? Just completely put their life on hold for months?

I'd liken it more to jumping out of a plane A. with and B. without a parachute, one is going to be quicker and not very pleasant. The other is going to be a much smoother ride.

 

[ColtDan]

FG had/has the same mindset... punishment and suffering to deter future abuse... ontop of many times of phycsosis.. very stupid delusional

 

[Eveleivibe]

Can you provide a source to support this?
As your whole hypothesis relies on this premise, it would be worthwhile to verify its accuracy.

Can you provide a source to validate that SSRIs do help n in what context? MDB did have a point in saying that they may prevent relapse if a person isn't suffering too much. I forgot to take into account addict thinking, which is often for relief. Off the top of my head I can't though I will look tomorrow when I am more sober.

I apologise for snapping at you - your initial post came across as condescending. I do know what I'm talking about i've been through withdrawals. Yes i agree it wasn't heroin but codeine wasn't a walk in the park - especially not the psychological stuff. - I honestly thought like the world was going to end because I could no longer have codeine. I could not deal with the WDs so had to go on suboxone. You do have some valid points, I think I misinterpreted your post as suggesting that I shouldn't have an opinion because I'd not taken stronger opiates such as heroin.

We will agree to differ re suboxone.

As I was thinking more scientifically / biologically based n forgetting the psycholocal impact of withdrawal ( as MDB pointed out ie higher chance of relapse ) I see your points but ask that you please accept that I've also a right to my opinion which may differ to your own.

I apologise for my petulant manner in how I responded to your posts.

Evey

 

[ColtDan]

They'll help yes, but replace it with another problem. I dont know much about SSRI withdrawl but ive heard its shit

 

[Eveleivibe]

FG had/has the same mindset... punishment and suffering to deter future abuse... ontop of many times of phycsosis.. very stupid delusional

Wrong. It is a difference of opinion. You all need to accept that we're going to have differences in opinion. Facts can be right or wrong. Opinions can't - because they're an opinion! Try to respect FG's point of view. It may not be Zyour Point of view - but it's his.

This is the one thing I find difficult - some of you seem to find it difficult that we have differences of opinion - and instead of agreeing to differ, are hell bent on trying to change them.

Evey

 

[Eveleivibe]

They'll help yes, but replace it with another problem. I dont know much about SSRI withdrawl but ive heard its shit

Exactly my point Dan. I'm on SSRI, citapolpram for my addiction. I'm almost two years on it because I can't get off them. I've tried and ended up having some horrible electric shock feeling through my head plus some other vicious symptoms. I'm trying to spare ScotchMist that - it's another issue he doesn't need, another drug to have to detox off, more horrific withdrawal symptoms.

It's actually better, in my opinion, to suffer the full effects of opiate withdrawal than prolong n create more issue - nothing to do with sin for taking drugs n I apologise that people got that impression that that was what I was implying.

Evey

 

[spacejunk]

Can you provide a source to validate that SSRIs do help n in what context? MDB did have a point in saying that they may prevent relapse if a person isn't suffering too much. I forgot to take into account addict thinking, which is often for relief. Off the top of my head I can't though I will look tomorrow when I am more sober.

I made no such claim, so the burden of proof does not fall to me.
My personal ambivalence towards SSRIs means that I wouldn't advocate their use, but I just want to know if you have actually read a study about Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors affecting post-acute opiate withdrawal.
Does serotonin play any role in PAWS?
Or withdrawal at all?

We will agree to differ re suboxone.

Can you elaborate?
What did I say about suboxone? That being on bupe maintenance doesn't count as being "clean?"
Is that what you mean?

It's actually better, in my opinion, to suffer the full effects of opiate withdrawal than prolong n create more issue

But...

I honestly thought like the world was going to end because I could no longer have codeine. I could not deal with the WDs so had to go on suboxone.

?

 

[Eveleivibe]

To be honest no I have not, though I've read up enough on neurotransmitters n the brain. If I had have been "me" n not the addict I had become, I never would have touched SSRIs -but I will look tomorrow for some stuff on Google scholar.

There are a few things that interest me about the whole thing.

Evey

 

[Mel22]

Can you provide a source to validate that SSRIs do help n in what context?

"Venlafaxine acts as an agonist at the mu-opioid receptor. [2] [3]It is surprisingly effective in treating depression in heroin and other opioid addicts compared to all other conventional antidepressants"

From the wiki. It's an SNRI as opposed to an SSRI, but still relevant.

You state you were thinking "scientifically/biologically"...lol, hardly. That involves educating yourself and checking your info before spewing it all over a forum, not hurling "opinions" and lashing out like a child when someone disagrees.

 

[ColtDan]

Wrong. It is a difference of opinion. You all need to accept that we're going to have differences in opinion. Facts can be right or wrong. Opinions can't - because they're an opinion! Try to respect FG's point of view. It may not be Zyour Point of view - but it's his

So youre telling me... that someone who has mental health issues... sends himself phycostic to sort himself out? i'll infact quote what he said, gimmi a sec

 

[Bella Figura]

It's actually better, in my opinion, to suffer the full effects of opiate withdrawal than prolong n create more issue
Evey

so why go on sub instead of just stopping codeine and feeling the full effects of your withdrawal? isn't that prolonging and therefore not the best decision to have made?



sub can be seen as a comfort med to help you get off codeine no?

whatever people need to get through it doesn't really alter the outcome everyone is hoping to achieve from it by the end.

 

[ColtDan]

Enligjhten me evey on the wise sensible-ness of this.. if you think this is a good decision then you;re off youre fucking cracker

MDMA & MDPV... doesn't seem like a wise combination?!?!

Did you not manage to cancel your peeve?

it be ok dont worry just something i need to do its one of them things i need to mess up a little to feel normal again but thanks for worrying hun

nothing stupid about it something is going to snap all the signs are here so i am just sort of speeding it up a little hopefully it will be like the bad trip that i need to force me sober longer if you see what i mean

it be ok dont worry just something i need to do its one of them things i need to mess up a little to feel normal again but thanks for worrying hun

Lol what a stupid reason that is. You need to send yourself psychotic to feel normal again?

It wouldn't have been appropriate for me to make that post given my history, Dan, but I'm glad somebody did.

 

[Eveleivibe]

Of course I don't, Dan, you've missed my point entirely and I think that I misinterpreted your post re: FG. Did you not read my response to c here's not a lot I can do from goodness knows how many miles away from him.

We can only sit here, watch n hope that he's ok n worked things through his own way. He gave a number out once I'm not sure it was really his as I text n no reply. As I'm not sure, and it may have been a random number so i can text it.

Wow i was posting this n fell asleep.

Night all,

Evey

 

[Urbain]

Urban how long do you go on sunbeds for per week? I don't care if I've increased my risk of skin cancer. We could all die tomorrow of a plague or whatever. I've spent most of my life being paranoid of things, no more! If I can get brown by going on sunbeds twice a week for 9 minutes I'm gna do!

Evey

"I don't care if I've increased my risk of skin cancer"...

Ignorant idiot.

Grow up.

 

[THECATINTHEHAT]

"I don't care if I've increased my risk of skin cancer"...

Ignorant idiot.

Grow up.

It's her body, up to her innit. No different to living in a sunny country.

I'm going to go for a sunbed tomorrow, it's the only thing that helps clear my bacne.

 

[lurching]

pregabalin is so much superior to benzos for relaxation, benzos just turn my mood sour and sedate me, pregablin just makes me feel content...even 300mg...

Even 300mg! I get a nice moodlift from just 50mg!

Anything over 100mg and I get a tingling relaxed feel in muscles, calm confidence like low dose GHB, and if I go over 150-200mg I'll start stumbling but feel warm and at ease. More than 200mg and it gets strange for me with a slightly trippy headspace, more cognitive blur, and a type of rebound that I don't like. I'm 70kg with currently no tolerance to alcohol or benzos or other GABAstuff.

That's after two years of near-daily use, with half of that period on 600mg per day and with only a handful of short tolerance breaks/tapers. I feel better at 200mg per day than at 600mg, and I suffer much less rebound anxiety that consecutive days of high dose can give, plus I could go a few days without my dose and not suffer withdrawal.

I've found it golden for any type of GABA withdrawal and cravings. I'd be in a bad place now if I hadn't discovered pregabalin as type of maintainance drug to get out of and stay out of recurrent self-destructive drinking/GHB phases.