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  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

Frank

When me and my mates were younger and before we discovered Erowid etc we'd look at Talk To Frank to decide if particular drugs were worth taking and would be enjoyable lol, we figured that if a drug still sounded great on a government website designed to scare people away from drugs then it was probably gonna be a lot of fun to take! A lot of the information on there is very inaccurate though, once we found websites devoted to proper explanation and harm reduction then we never talked to Frank again...
 
StreetHalo91 said:
When me and my mates were younger and before we discovered Erowid etc we'd look at Talk To Frank to decide if particular drugs were worth taking and would be enjoyable lol, we figured that if a drug still sounded great on a government website designed to scare people away from drugs then it was probably gonna be a lot of fun to take! A lot of the information on there is very inaccurate though, once we found websites devoted to proper explanation and harm reduction then we never talked to Frank again...
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Yay BLUELIGHT FOREVER, eh?!

Evey
 
I've always thought it's a travesty that we aren't told how to use drugs safely... they need to wake up, smell the bacon & realise than people will use drugs despite their misinformed propaganda. Might as tell them how to use them safely.
 
That's partly why I'm sorting out my recovery threads. As I stated previously I phoned Talk to Frank about my addiction n ask if they could give me any contacts for help n support, which they could not n were not familiar with codeine at all when I tried to discuss my addiction with them.

And yes people will use drugs, they shouldn 't be lecturing people but at least giving them harm reduction advice so that they can take the drugs safely.

Most of us are aware that drugs are illegal n what class of illegality each drug is in. It may put some people off using yes but most people want to know how to use safely n they are doing a huge diservice by not giving harm reduction n simply lecturing people.

The person I spoke to was completely out of her depth. I ended up seeking help
Myself n through the help n advice of a good, online friend who had been through similar n had also been put on the suboxone maintenance programme.

So hopefully I can help others like me n bring them to Bluelight same time.

Evey
 
Who is this Frank fellow? Seems like a nice chap, taking calls and talking about drugs. No one else listens to me ramble on about them. I bet he has good connections too and he seems like a knowledgeable type, apparently mephedrone isn't plant food! No wonder my plants keep dying. :\
 
BecomingJulie said:
Well, quite. The government's officially-stated position is "Better they die than they get high".

Anything that might lead to people enjoying drugs more safely goes against that, and so would not be allowed on government propaganda.
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Indeedy. This is a thing that's been bothering me greatly of late. I've had little choice but to go along with "officially sanctioned" procedure these last couple years when it comes to scripts in particular. What have I gained from this? A swollen liver from excessive paracetamol use on top of an existing fairly heavy alcohol pattern of abuse, internal bleeding from excessive ibuprofen and aspirin use (with added bonus of potential heart problems from excessive NSAID use in general) and now having beta blockers pushed on me cos they are so very much more acceptable than benzos for anxiety issues. I used to be reasonably stable on my prescribed meds - particularly on the benzos side cos I gave up abusing those many years ago, less so on the opies side cos they are so heavily restricted they'd rather prescribe co-codamols with a metric fucktonne of paracetamol daily dosed than prescribe more effective, far safer opies.

It seems to me the emphasis is so heavily placed on there being no possible potential for "feeling good" whilst also providing truly effective meds - and at reasonable doses in my case cos abuse is not really on my agenda on a day to day basis any more - that absolutely any alternative is considered preferable no matter how much more harm it actually causes. Insanity barely covers it :\
 
Shambles said:
Indeedy. This is a thing that's been bothering me greatly of late. I've had little choice but to go along with "officially sanctioned" procedure these last couple years when it comes to scripts in particular. What have I gained from this? A swollen liver from excessive paracetamol use on top of an existing fairly heavy alcohol pattern of abuse, internal bleeding from excessive ibuprofen and aspirin use (with added bonus of potential heart problems from excessive NSAID use in general) and now having beta blockers pushed on me cos they are so very much more acceptable than benzos for anxiety issues. I used to be reasonably stable on my prescribed meds - particularly on the benzos side cos I gave up abusing those many years ago, less so on the opies side cos they are so heavily restricted they'd rather prescribe co-codamols with a metric fucktonne of paracetamol daily dosed than prescribe more effective, far safer opies.

It seems to me the emphasis is so heavily placed on there being no possible potential for "feeling good" whilst also providing truly effective meds - and at reasonable doses in my case cos abuse is not really on my agenda on a day to day basis any more - that absolutely any alternative is considered preferable no matter how much more harm it actually causes. Insanity barely covers it :\
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WOW Shamby, I'm sorry that all that's happening to you. Taking codeine or addictions to codeine is actually seen as a higher risk than say Heroin, due to the paracetamol / ibroprufen. My keyworker told me this cause that's why I 'm on Secondary care, not primary. Apparent most on scripts go to clinics but my key worker didn't want that for me as I get anxious.

Last time a bloke kicked off n i was in tears but it wasn't just that it was anticipation of seeing the doctor n once i was in there, I broke down which was completely unexpected even to myself.

I think it sucks how you've been treated.

Why did they sanction your script? You don't have to answer that if you don't want to. I get for weeks of scripts from the drug place n then have to go into the pharmacy weekly.

Went daily, supervised for the first week then daily take home for a few months then it was 3 times n i think November started weekly pick up

Evey
 
Eveleivibe said:
WOW Shamby, I'm sorry that all that's happening to you. Taking codeine or addictions to codeine is actually seen as a higher risk than say Heroin, due to the paracetamol / ibroprufen. My keyworker told me this cause that's why I 'm on Secondary care, not primary. .
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I'm really not sure what they meant by all that, codeine itself doesn't have any risk of paracetamol or ibuprofen poisoning, that would only come with botched CWEs and I find it hard to see how anyone could sustain a 800mg + a day habit via cocodemol or such, in fact it just wouldn't be possible.

I doubt any decent drug worker would see one as simple 'higher risk' than another, it's way more complicated than that and I wouldn't want anyone reading this site to think it would be safer to stop glugging codeine linctus and start using street heroin, the idea that it would be 'lower risk' is madness and only someone who had no experience of such things could possibly hold such a view. I dispare of some drug workers and the utter bilge they come out with.

I get way more shit picking up morphine than I ever did codeine, got refused the other week because the script said Zoromorph tablets and they come in capsules ....lucky I still had a couple of days worth left because I had to get a completely new script.
 
Excuse me, Allein - That was what my key worker said. And I am PERFECTLY aware that codeine and paracetamol / ibuprofen are different but most people taking over the counter codeine do not know about CWE and when in addiction the mind doesn't think in terms of "safety," as I have said before all I wanted was the codeine and the CWE was taking to much time and not giving me the full codeine and I was willing to risk whatever to get it now and as much as possible. I feel like you are misinterpreting my words here. It's not that CODEINE is more dangerous than HEROIN at all, it is the method by which CODEIE is taken. Not everyone addicted to codeine has to access to codeine lictus (it is EXTREMELY difficult to get when you are an addict - people start to know you n access becomes restricted and so forth).

There is a different between danger of drugs recreationally and danger of drugs, in drug addiction.

An addict will not think harm reduction and safe they will think NEED. It is like needing food and drink but moreso and the mind will do whatever in order to get it.

I feel that you have completely misinterpreted my post here. I wold suggest reading Shambles post above and some of the issues he's experience(ing/ed) and then you will, hopefully, see what I am saying here.

Also - I did not choose what care I got, I was put into it. They were also aware that I was illegally purchasing 60mg codeine tablets. In fact it was the reason I was allowed in with them and not the over-the-counter prescription service that my doctor had referred me too.

I apologise to anyone who has misinterpreted my post here as I am in NO WAY SAYING that codeine is more dangerous than Heroin but moreso the components in which are taken with the drug. I believe when it comes to drug addiction that ALL substances are dangerous because one is not in normal mindset to truly think rationally towards their drug of choice and will even risk potential death in order to seek / consume the drug. I remember lots of people telling me I could die and the idea of stopping codeine sounded more frightening than the idea of dying. Whenever people mentioned that I could die I would often get could at manipulating them in acting thoroughly shocked then taking codeine like nothing had been said

When it comes to CWE how harm reducing is it? I was unwell many times from doing CWEs (when I did them), how do you know it's truly paracetamol and not just the fillers? I'm not saying this to sway people from CWE but to make people think and because I've heard two sides of the argument and don't know for sure.

I hope this clears things up and if anyone is upset over my post / needs more information, please feel free to PM me and discuss this further.

Evey
 
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Eveleivibe said:
. I apologise to anyone who has misinterpreted my post here as I am in NO WAY SAYING that codeine is more dangerous than Heroin but moreso the
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Not really required since it wasnt you that was talking shite it was some random hearsay from some random drug worker, they tend to talk a fair bit of shite IME, but if apologising makes you feel better go for it ;)


as for the rest of it tl:dr
 
I don't understand their system, to be honest. The only "Primary, Secondary .... care" I know of is when I worked for the LHB (NHS) being admin for Health, Social Care n Wellbeing strategy, where we had to deal with enquiries concerning GPs, Dentists, Pharmacies n opticians. One of the drug workers tried explaining their system to me once but brain was fried on high doses of suboxone n nothing sank in, literally.

Evey
 
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