Fractals and Buddhism

[DwayneHoover]

Hmm... didn't realize this forum let you choose people to block. Well actually I would prefer to know what others are seeing. And besides, sometimes a grain of sand leads to a pearl. (perhaps that's his purpose, though that is probably giving him more credit for good intentions than deserved, but it is a possibility :D )

OK lets stop talking about him now.

MORE about trippy fractal Buddhist MAGNIFICENT VEGETABLES!

 

[phaedrusattva]

You could always block him so his posts aren't visible. Problem solved...Well the myriad of problem(s) in IsMene's head will persist of course.

Not just persist, but propagate as well, adding to the din in the echo chamber of the internet...

I've seen his warrantless and irrelevant attacks on Buddhism in other threads as well. I can appreciate a little iconoclasm, but misinformation/propaganda is a different thing.

"I (Socrates) consider [debunking] in other respects graceful, but belonging to a man who is too terribly clever, laborious, and not altogether fortunate...he will stand in need of much leisure. But I do not at all have leisure for these things; and the cause of it, my friend, is this. I am not yet able, according to the Delphic inscription, to know myself; it appears to me laughable indeed for one who is still ignorant of this to examine alien things...I examine not them but myself."

Isn't that why we're here?

 

[MattPsy]

I don't think there's any meaningful or special connection between the two. You are just putting your mind in a mode where it is more likely to generate this sort of content. I can do the same thing by thinking about religious imagery or ideas (but I am not at all religious), or by thinking about molecular biology, physics, or information systems. This does not diminish the beauty of this phenomenon, at all.

Also, right on Delsyd - isn't nature/we/everything wonderful!?

 

[Ismene]

Are you claiming too that every Christian who participated in the Crusade is a blood thirsty maniac?

If they behaved like bloodthirsty maniacs then yes, clearly that's obvious.

Especially when those actions are totally irrelevant to the fundamental tenets of the belief set

Yeah but that's the key isn't it. You judge someone on what they actually do rather than what they say.

 

[Ismene]

As we all know, history is not an objective science free from the prejudices of man, and the history of Tibetan Buddhism, like that of Tibet itself, is likely not as simple as Ismene is leading some to believe.

I'm not "leading you to believe" anything. I'm presenting you with an example from severall historians of how the "enlightened" Tibetan monks behaved with their Tibetan slaves. It's something to bear in mind before believing everything the buddhists tell you.

Saying it's all "chinese propaganda" is a little simplistic. If you can find me any historian that says the Tibetan monks didn't own slaves who they punished severely then please do so. I can assure you I'm not a chinese maoist. I'm interested in the truth and someone talking about "enlightenment" while gouging out their slaves eyes doesn't strike me as having much to do with truth.

 

[Ismene]

You could always block him so his posts aren't visible. Problem solved...Well the myriad of problem(s) in IsMene's head will persist of course.

Please do so. You and Dwayne. I'm tired of 14 year olds getting offended by someone expressing their opinons. Put me on ignore and save wasting bandwidth with your personal attacks. I thought when you said you were "interested" in how Buddhist monks lived that it was a little too open-minded of you delta.

the hell does any of that have to do with Buddhist philosophy

What does discussing how Buddhist monks lived have to do with Buddhism? You work it out Dwayne.

 

[delta_9]

My personal attacks? Hmm let's take a look shall we

I'm tired of 14 year olds getting offended by someone expressing their opinons

I thought when you said you were "interested" in how Buddhist monks lived that it was a little too open-minded of you delta

whether you believe in some buddhist horseshit or not

All I said was you pushed my buttons on occasion. I'm sure glad I don't live in Tibet or this kind of remark would result in you cutting off my hands, or worse.

And btw I didn't even see your link.

All I ask is you tone it down a bit. Sure, this stuff may really be going on(I don't doubt it actually, I just prefer for it not to be 'in my face'), but why do you have such a hard-on for torture and mutilation? Seems quite strange.

 

[Solipsis]

I can find myself in Zen Buddhism, it's not a matter of believing or not. Belief in terms of faith is a dogmatic church thing and it's not relevant to many forms of Buddhism though I think the Tibetan religion is pretty fucked.

About fractals, perhaps they reflect a sort of fractal pattern in our neurology? I think I remember reading in a book from Kurzweil that nerve systems in different levels in our brain can be very similar, a sort of branching effect that might reflect the fractal nature of ourselves and/or ways in which we perceive the world - the latter is also a part of us, I don't think we should make a distinct dualistic dichotomy at that point... we are taught to do that since Aristoteles and have such a hard time putting those colored glasses down we think that it is part of fundamental reality.

 

[Listening]

About fractals, perhaps they reflect a sort of fractal pattern in our neurology?...

You've got it backwards, the universe came first. Just take a look at any of the great astrophotos out there. We were born and evolved in a fractal universe; we're part of it. It's no wonder that our biology (and that of our vegetables) is also resplendent with fractals.

When I feel like I'm seeing more visual detail in everything while on a psychedelic drug, I feel as though my brain is using its (natural) fractal extrapolation algorithm to fill in the missing bits. Our brains do this anyway whilst sober: the mechanism is just pumped up to overdrive while on these drugs. Even my thoughts sometimes feel recursive and fractally while on psychedelics. I feel that it must be a reflection of our naturally evolved pattern recognition algorithm.

 

[vegan]

yea i know exactly what you mean.. when it first happened to me i wanted to tell the whole world haha. but over time its sort of faded back into the background of my life, but its never really left me.

come on guys!
watch out or next thing you'll be wearing wife-beaters in your trailer while zapping until you get some ads on tv to get your daily dose of culture

don't forget!
stay young!
what was amazing when you discovered it is still amazing today, even if it's been several years
don't let time spoil your revelations

i still want to tell the whole world

and i do tell people when i get the opportunity, although i've been sober for way too long

 

[Ismene]

My personal attacks? Hmm let's take a look shall we

.

Yep, go back to the start of the thread and see who first started making personal attacks. Hint, it wasn't me. Don't start bitching when I ask you to behave like a grown up.

All I said was you pushed my buttons on occasion

That's a lie isn't it. You said I had "problems in my head" didn't you. Go on, admit it.

My main "problem" appears to be that I wouldn't agree with you in the ego death thread and that's reason enough for you, Dwayne and the other one to follow me around every thread making personal attacks to "get your own back". It's not that important. We disagree - ok. There's no need to turn it into a personal vandetta. If you met me we'd probably get along fine.


And btw I didn't even see your link

So you asked me to give you a link and then didn't read it. Now why doesn't that surprise me.

 

[Ismene]

About fractals, perhaps they reflect a sort of fractal pattern in our neurology?

There's a few standard patterns that emerge when you mess with the brain - there was an experiment a while ago where when the brain was stimulated by electrical currents it produced psychedelic patterns.

But I think it's just down to this guy refusing to see fractals unless he first thinks he believes in buddhism. Placebomine is a strange thing - you tell yourself something often enough and your mind starts providing it for you.

 

[.Lucid.]

come on guys!
watch out or next thing you'll be wearing wife-beaters in your trailer while zapping until you get some ads on tv to get your daily dose of culture

don't forget!
stay young!
what was amazing when you discovered it is still amazing today, even if it's been several years
don't let time spoil your revelations

i still want to tell the whole world

and i do tell people when i get the opportunity, although i've been sober for way too long

i didnt mean it was forgotten or something.. its just that it became such a part of my life that its just normal now. and i gave up on telling the whole world because nobody cares or wants to listen.. even the people that do care and want to listen dont get it anyway.. they have to see it for themselves.


this has turned into the worst thread ever btw.

 

[Ismene]

^^ I don't think it's that good.

 

[delta_9]

Yep, go back to the start of the thread and see who first started making personal attacks. Hint, it wasn't me. Don't start bitching when I ask you to behave like a grown up.

All I said was you pushed my buttons on occasion

That's a lie isn't it. You said I had "problems in my head" didn't you. Go on, admit it.

Indeed, You are quie astute my friend. I did indeed say that, however you apparently thought it necessary to escalate it to a whole other level.

But it's not a lie. I did say it and you do push my buttons sometimes.

So you asked me to give you a link and then didn't read it. Now why doesn't that surprise me.

Becasue it was 3am, I was on 4mg phenazepam, and really tired. Please oh please forgive me. 8)

Edit - apologies to the PD staff. This is not how this thread should've gone at all. I will kindly leave this thread.

Love to all
---d_9

 

[RainbowWarrior]

It's perfectly plausible to be more aware of certain patterns whilst in a spiritual mindset ...the way to the place in the head does not matter, only to be there... be it drugs, meditation, prayer, there are many ways to the light, and firm believing is part of every real prayer or meditation even when it sometimes seems delusional to others, it feels good to believe

whichever path works for you is the right one!

 

[IamMe90]

If they behaved like bloodthirsty maniacs then yes, clearly that's obvious.

Especially when those actions are totally irrelevant to the fundamental tenets of the belief set

Yeah but that's the key isn't it. You judge someone on what they actually do rather than what they say.

dude... you're making such a basic fallacy it's boggling me. and you just did it again.

the point is that they don't all behave like bloodthirsty maniacs, and it's clearly fallacious to induce the actions of everyone in a group based on the actions of some in a group when what defines the group isn't relevant to those actions.

It's like saying that because a large group of black people are criminals that all black people are criminals, or rather, that "blackness" is criminal. it's disgusting and outright fallacious.

no, what a bunch of buddhists did is really not relevant to buddhism. it is simply a portrayal of individual human behavior and i promise you, you can find examples of every core religious, political, or consolidated group in that era of history that committed analogous acts. that does not mean we tar everyone else with the same brush.

 

[.Lucid.]

dude... you're making such a basic fallacy it's boggling me. and you just did it again.

i wish i was ismene right now so i could say "dude.. ill boggle you with my phallus 8)"



you can have that one for free buddy

 

[IamMe90]

what can i say, i love being boggled by phalluses

 

[Solipsis]

You've got it backwards, the universe came first. Just take a look at any of the great astrophotos out there. We were born and evolved in a fractal universe; we're part of it. It's no wonder that our biology (and that of our vegetables) is also resplendent with fractals.

Yes but I don't think it's far out to say that our neurological faculties came before our perception of fractals, which is what I meant when I said 'fractals' and believe was implied.
Cosmology is wonderful by the way Not confusing it with astronomy though that is wonderful too... although perhaps a bit boring behind the scenes sometimes.

^^
Can I just say: at ease guys - don't shoot the messenger either.
But let's take everything a little less personal and not use hyperbolic language.

These things are subjects that have a whole lot of sides and even though logic seems like the same as common sense to some people, logical fallacies are made all the time and I think we can all take a Buddhist example of peacefulness when we point them out to each other.
Talking about the Buddhist teachings here, not what unholy things people do to each other 'in the name of...'.