found a happy medium - 1mg klonopin

[ocean]

^I don't really agree with this.
I take Klonopin and it helps my physical symptoms.......now, I DO get w/d symptoms (similar to physical anxiety symptoms- heart palpitations, shortness of breath) when I need to take my next dose....... But taken everyday, regularly- not just as needed, Klonopin does help my physical symptoms of anxiety.

 

[Legerity]

I'm in the same boat as you...recently started taking daily xanax for anxiety. The dose is quite low, not more than 1mg per day, so I try to spread it out in a way that will be most helpful.

I think the thing with benzos is that the doses should not continued to be raised and raised. I discussed this with my psychiatrist and he told me he won't raise my dose...I can use this as long as it works and if it no longer does then he's going to taper me off. I'm not sure that most psychiatrists have this kind of approach but it seems to be sensible to me.

It's also not an absolute NECESSITY that you continue build tolerance for ever. Yes there are a lot of nightmare stories, but this doesn't need to be the case. Some people to maintain low doses for extended periods of time, or go through periods of using much less when their regular dose is not needed.

The way I see it is that if you are not overly sedated all day with the benzos and still have some periods of feeling anxious, then you still have the opportunity to learn how to work through the anxiety while having periods of relief from the benzos. If they are used on their own without the addition of other stress-management techniques then I can see how they may become problematic.

That's my current opinion but I've only recently began with medications.

@Bojangles: I was prescribed beta-blockers too for the physical anxiety symptoms and it they are not as effective as the benzos, to be honest I'm not sure they have done anything at all. I stopped taking them today and didn't really notice a difference, in fact I was probably calmer than yesterday.

Anyways, I hope they continue to offer relief, without having to continually up your dosage

 

[Bojangles69]

Well first when I say "beta blocker" I'm refering mainly to inderal. There are beta blockers like toprol that don't do shit and are mainly prescribed for high blood pressure.

Ocean: You are right klonopin DOES do *something* for physical anxiety. But in cases where physical anxiety is the main component of anxiety, doctors usually prescribe inderal. Klonopin is more of a "head med", its stronger than xanax at relaxing the body I'll give it that, but in comparison to how a strong betablocker works a betablocker is less likely to leave "gaps" where physical anxiety can still manifest. Even when I told my doctor the klonopin didn't do shit for keeping my body in check he said it was normal and thats why a lot of times he stacks inderal with it. And when I say "didn't do shit" YES I felt how it calms the body... but it was still largely a joke. I'd walk into social situations on 6mg of that crap and my heart would slow down a whole 2 beats a minute.

I'm not trying to trash klonopin, its a great drug, but it doesn't quite do it for people with extreme physical anxiety.

Legerity: What beta blocker did you take and how much? The whole thing with betablockers is you will NOT notice you're on them untill you are exposed to a trigger.
If you take 60mg of inderal, and stand in front of an approaching train, I don't care who you are you heart is not going to skip a beat. Only a very tiny amount of people who take inderal report it not doing anything for them.
Read askapatient.com and you'll see like 95% of the people on there praising it. Go read about klonopin and see how many people trash talk it for not doing shit for physical anxiety.

Klonopin has an effect where you can "feel" it slowing down your body w/out actually being triggered. Thats because it works more on your brain. But if someone points a gun at you on klonopin, theres a good chance your heart is still going to race, klonopin doesn't do a single thing to modify adrenaline. Your heart can NOT race unless there is a prior surge of adrenaline in your blood. I don't think people understand this basic fact. Thats why if you wanna chill your heart out, and your entire body, take inderal.

Let me explain briefly how anxiety tends to work:

You're exposed to a trigger, your head produces an initial anxious thought, your body RESPONDS to the thought by triggering adrenaline.
That adrenaline floods your blood, makes your heart race, speeds up your breathing, makes you sweaty, makes you shake, makes you stutter (which then turns into a feedback loop often).

Klonopin "stops" this by attaching to receptors in smooth muscles and basically just relaxes your heart. If you take A LOT of klonopin, it will work A LOT better obviously, but it still not doing anything for adrenaline which is the core. It works indirectly through the CNS.
What that means is in order to achieve the same depressed affect, on the heart specifically, the amount of klonopin you have to actually take can make you sick. It works indirectly/inefficiently.

Strong betablockers attach directly the your adrenal receptors. There is NO WAY your heart is racing on them. On klonopin in order to have the same effect you'd prob have to take like 10mg. And you'll wind up passing out/falling asleep.
The whole point of inderal is its more effective, and will not do shit to your brain so your a slurring zombie when it comes time to face your triggers... w/e they are.

And like I said before, if the main component of your anxiety is you can't control your thoughts, than inderal will be a waste of time.

 

[molly897]

i just got prescribed 1mg twice a day but "may take less" if needed
i started with .5 twice a day when i made this thread but now......

i've been taking 1 full mg and then a half and this has seemed to work better. i can't wait to be on 4mgs next. this is so exciting (sarcasm). my tolerance is building slowly but surely

@Bo it's all in my head. when i was WDing from adderall and benzos together my anxiety was physical. i was on the floor rolling around like i was having a seizure. that's why my doc let me try adderall and benzos together because i thought the adderall would fix my PHYSICAL anxiety, cause the benzos fixed it mentally. but now it seems that klonopin is working just fine. my doctor asked if i wanted more addy but i said no. i don't wanna go down that road again. i'd rather build a tolerance and take this shit than build and take both of em

TBH i do feel like that physically if i don't take any medicine. sweaty/shaky but not racy like i took an adderall. but klonopin has seemed to work for both it actually allows me to eat. i stopped taking my stomach meds cause i felt they were giving me anxiety cause i'd puke and feel weird when i took em. and ever since i have been able to eat and my axiety is really under control. i DO need this medicine though. that is 100% a fact. or i'll be on the floor rolling around again

 

[Legerity]

@Bo: I started on 20mg inderal twice a day, then 30mg twice a day. He told me I could try up to 40mg twice a day although I have not taken any since tuesday.

My anxiety doesn't usually manifest in rapid heartbeat, although there was a period where I had a lot of palpitations and chest pains. The main issue may be like you said, about controlling my thoughts, in particular socially. Although I do get other physical symptoms like muscular tension...sometimes it will hit suddenly and my whole body will just tense up when I think about something, it feels like a lightning bolt just hit me or something. Other times it is more in the background.

 

[molly897]

here to say I'm at 2mg a day now and going back next week

y'all weren't kiddin

 

[slowpoke1967]

I think one problem is that it's easy to get used to being anxiety free and then it becomes even harder to tolerate any anxiety at all. And it's hard to make yourself learn other ways of reducing and managing anxiety when you have the option of pushing your dose higher and not experiencing it at all.

The downside of regular dosing rather than as required dosing is that you eventually reach a point of needing to take it to avert withdrawals even on days when you're not anxious - so not only has your ability to reduce and manage anxiety not changed but you've also picked up a physical dependence which needs servicing even though it provides little relief anymore. I honestly that doctors who don't set out a tapering off plan when they first prescribe benzos are doing their patients a huge disservice.

i find this to be a very good point im on 8mg clones a day and i do have to take them even if im not haveing an attack at that moment,i just start feeling wierd and take them and i do believe it is to hold off the WDs sometimes,cause if i didnt take my dose for even a day and even though the half life is 20 to 36 hours i start to have WD symptoms....and since haveing a few i never wanna go threw them again so i at least try and stick to my 8 mg daily even though on the odd occation i will double the dose and take temazepams and nozinans with them to realy feel realaxed for awhile.cause just takeing the 8 mg of k pins only wards off my WDs i dont even feel them anymore not even when i mix and match,its like nuthing,cept i know if i happen to roll over i will fall asleep...

 

[slowpoke1967]

^I don't really agree with this.
I take Klonopin and it helps my physical symptoms.......now, I DO get w/d symptoms (similar to physical anxiety symptoms- heart palpitations, shortness of breath) when I need to take my next dose....... But taken everyday, regularly- not just as needed, Klonopin does help my physical symptoms of anxiety.

i have to agree with this also,taken everyday ussualy at the same time i keep my physical reactions to a minimum.
And if i wait for physical reactions to occure ie chronic anxiety and take my pills in time i feel normal again.
Now it is very possible that it can be mental.
But regardless it works...

 

[slowpoke1967]

Well first when I say "beta blocker" I'm refering mainly to inderal. There are beta blockers like toprol that don't do shit and are mainly prescribed for high blood pressure.

Ocean: You are right klonopin DOES do *something* for physical anxiety. But in cases where physical anxiety is the main component of anxiety, doctors usually prescribe inderal. Klonopin is more of a "head med", its stronger than xanax at relaxing the body I'll give it that, but in comparison to how a strong betablocker works a betablocker is less likely to leave "gaps" where physical anxiety can still manifest. Even when I told my doctor the klonopin didn't do shit for keeping my body in check he said it was normal and thats why a lot of times he stacks inderal with it. And when I say "didn't do shit" YES I felt how it calms the body... but it was still largely a joke. I'd walk into social situations on 6mg of that crap and my heart would slow down a whole 2 beats a minute.

I'm not trying to trash klonopin, its a great drug, but it doesn't quite do it for people with extreme physical anxiety.

Legerity: What beta blocker did you take and how much? The whole thing with betablockers is you will NOT notice you're on them untill you are exposed to a trigger.
If you take 60mg of inderal, and stand in front of an approaching train, I don't care who you are you heart is not going to skip a beat. Only a very tiny amount of people who take inderal report it not doing anything for them.
Read askapatient.com and you'll see like 95% of the people on there praising it. Go read about klonopin and see how many people trash talk it for not doing shit for physical anxiety.

Klonopin has an effect where you can "feel" it slowing down your body w/out actually being triggered. Thats because it works more on your brain. But if someone points a gun at you on klonopin, theres a good chance your heart is still going to race, klonopin doesn't do a single thing to modify adrenaline. Your heart can NOT race unless there is a prior surge of adrenaline in your blood. I don't think people understand this basic fact. Thats why if you wanna chill your heart out, and your entire body, take inderal.

Let me explain briefly how anxiety tends to work:

You're exposed to a trigger, your head produces an initial anxious thought, your body RESPONDS to the thought by triggering adrenaline.
That adrenaline floods your blood, makes your heart race, speeds up your breathing, makes you sweaty, makes you shake, makes you stutter (which then turns into a feedback loop often).

Klonopin "stops" this by attaching to receptors in smooth muscles and basically just relaxes your heart. If you take A LOT of klonopin, it will work A LOT better obviously, but it still not doing anything for adrenaline which is the core. It works indirectly through the CNS.
What that means is in order to achieve the same depressed affect, on the heart specifically, the amount of klonopin you have to actually take can make you sick. It works indirectly/inefficiently.

Strong betablockers attach directly the your adrenal receptors. There is NO WAY your heart is racing on them. On klonopin in order to have the same effect you'd prob have to take like 10mg. And you'll wind up passing out/falling asleep.
The whole point of inderal is its more effective, and will not do shit to your brain so your a slurring zombie when it comes time to face your triggers... w/e they are.

And like I said before, if the main component of your anxiety is you can't control your thoughts, than inderal will be a waste of time.

halfta dissagree with the k pin dose i can take like 20 2 mg clones and be wide awake and act just fine and normal,maybe im an exception but it seems no matter how much benzos i take i feel fine alert and comprehensive ,.
Of course if i do lie down and try to sleep it is much much easier on a bunch of pills...