First cycle ever -- a cutting cycle -- feedback please

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nasaltr0n

Bluelight Crew
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Feb 11, 2002
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218
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Russia
Hi folks.

BL veteran here returning after a long time away, for some pretty different reasons.

Age: 35

Weight: 240lbs / 6'1"

AAS experience: back in 2004 when 1AD and 4AD pro-hormones were both real and legal, I did a larger (medium-high of recommended on both) stack of both and put on about 40lbs very easily. Of course my diet was shame-able, but a great deal of it was muscle and intensity through the roof.

I've also consumed many dieting supplements in years past including a few of the crazier ones that a lot of people who use gear would not ever touch (like two weeks of DNP when I was 30yo in 2008, for example), more acceptably: EC stacking & Clen. Have always steered clear of Thyroid.


Goal: Fast drop in bf% while sparing or even gaining lean mass. I want a *very* dramatic body re-composition prior to Spring/Summer.

BF: ~25% - Higher than it should be for someone starting a cycle like this, I'm aware or so I at least have to impression from several searches on other forums. I was over 300lbs in April 2013 so I've done an enormous about of natural losses in that last 10 months without any magic bullets. With just exercise and very clean eating.

I'm just at an age and place where I have a chance to turn things up for a little bit and I'd like to capitolize on this time frame. I would be ecstatic if I could hit about 12-15% BF for summertime and especially with a little more visible hypertrophy.


Diet: Somewhat paleo, clean. I'm mindful of when I need glucose/glycogen. Expecting to be adding in whey shakes more additionally to my animal protein intake. I have a food scale in the kitchen and have been cooking lately so I can actually "mock label" portions of what I make as to their macronutrients / calories if necessary. Is it probably best bang for the buck on T3/Clen to count calories again?

Because I'm still higher on the bf % side I should be able to run a pretty high deficit (i.e. 31+kcal per lb of FFA as per Lyle McDonald meta-analysis article) but that's also a trade-off as to whether I want to take advantage of being on AAS beyond simple muscle sparing, right?


Workout Schedule:

I was actually just doing CrossFit for a few months about 2-4x a week to try something different. That is on hold and I've switched back to free weights 2-3x a week very recently. I feel that I actually have *a lot* of muscle memory that will come into play especially as supplementing with AAS goes. I've spent about 9 years as a total gym rat (religious in attendance), mostly between 1999-2008.

I've fallen a little behind (injuries, other bs excuses) and two different friends in my life said "hey bro dip into the secret sauce". So here I am, doing just that. Please critique the cycle, diet, food intake, etc.

*** NOW, that I have bored everyone with my life story ***

All of the logistical aspects of this are already handled. So it's probably a done deal as to particular ingredients. But I'd love feedback from some BLers in this area as respect to timing and dosage please.

DHT hairloss and possibly gyno pre-disposition could be a real issue for me, drawing from my prohormone experience 10 years ago. So adding Adex equivalent in for that reason.

Ten week cutting cycle:
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Week 1-10: Test-E EW 500mg

Week 1-10: Anavar ED 40mg (able to go as high as 60-80mg ED if advisable and sides aren't bad)

Week 1-10: LiquiDex 0.5 EOD or as much as .1 ED if it seems needed

Week 1&2, 5&6, 9&10: Clen 60-80mcg or as high as 120-200mcg - will gage by tolerance and temperature
Alternate: 5 days on, 2 off, 4 on, 3 off indefinitely. A trainer I know just put someone on this w/T4.

Week 1-10: T3 ED 25mg to feel it out maybe as high as 50-75mg if I want to go all out (tapper down dosage?)

PCT (wk1/wk2/wk3/wk4):
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Something like
LiquiNolva 40/20/20/20
LiquidClom 100/50/50/50.

Not sure how soon to start PCT after last dose, I've read 3-4 days? Immediately?)

Extra Credit:
-------------------
With a forum search or two, you might see that I used to help moderate Health Q&A on here about 12 years ago. But now I'm the one who would like to ask for some feedback and possibly a little "can I mix this cycle with a fun night out" question.

My b-day is smack dab in the middle of April and I'd like to start this cycle very soon. What say those in the know to a some MDMA on a singular occasion, 2-3 weeks in.

Thanks in advance folks!

nasaltr0n
 
Relevant: I have good blood pressure. It's tied to my stress and even with some major life uncertainties right now I'm 129/79.

(reading through Your first Cycle sticky thread. Have somewhere to hustle off to here soon but looking forward to finishing the second part of that post "Protocols")
 
At 25% BF.... You clearly don't have a clue how to train or eat... AAS are not for you..!!

I suggest you get yourself on a diet and weight loss program.. If it proves successful and you can stick with it, come back & we'll educate you on AAS..

Jumping on stims and hormones won't fix what's clearly not working, if anything they could make things worse..
 
25 percent, and you want to do a cycle based mainly of test....


No. If you just figure out how to diet, you should drop bf to a much more respectable level. That test and ani isn't going to make any significant difference. You need to learn to train and diet before you use aas,or you're just going to put your endocrine at rrsk for no reason and no gain.
 
-Genetic Freak,

First off thanks for the response, I do appreciate any feedback one has while I feel like I might not have effectively communicated or strongly hinted enough around some explicit things.

I would describe it more like a cross between comfort eating and self destructive behavior that I've worked through. I've never been that big before (as when I was over 300lbs). Although I've been back and forth between 180 and 240 plenty. I have been down to 8-10% by my own caliper as far back is 2001 as I've had a passion for bodybuilding without anabolics for a long long time.

I've also had a destructive streak or outlet, if you will which I've worked through at this point in my life.

I have been down to 8% in the past using cyclic ketogenic diets and have been following nutrition, physiology, and the like since about 1999 back when a lot of this was still discussed in misc.fitness.weights group or private email lists where you would get the Patrick Arnolds and various other athletes, ergogenic company owners and authors were doing much communicating directly.

So I assure you that it was not a lack of understanding. We could speculate/conjecture all day long as to self control and what drives/traumas or self limiting believes are behind comfort eating or binge eating/drinking/other weight gaining activity.

Add to that some thoracic/cervical neck junction and martial arts broken rib injuries that left my with muscle cramps that would run all the way up around my scapular/trap areas for years to follow. And then a break up of a long term relationship to tie it all off. But you now what? I'm big on personal accountability which is why I summarized all of this as (iinjuries, other bs excuses). Because I was not expecting to articulate into such.

During my 9 years of religious attendance, I've done regular weight lifting, HIT, Super Slow, HIIT, Hypertrophy Specic Training, other similar methodologies similar to Bulgarian periodization as well a lot of my own hybrid approaches to the above.lf

I've done cyclical ketogenic diets when Duchaine (RIP)'s first Body Opus book came out to great success. When Lyle McDonald followed that up with a TKD plan I also tried that on a more pre/post workout carbs variation. I have done isocaloric, zone. They all work and are all pretty similar to just limiting your calories in versus calories out.

And you know what? All the different training methodologies worked as expected when adhered to... so did all of the diets. Yeah there's nuances and strategic reasons to do one versus the other.

But that very self destructive diet behavior is *WHY* I have never run a cycle yet even when I was in my 20s and cut... because I knew about my bad eating streak that would end up with me wasting the gear or worse.

And my taking food intake serious finally at 35 is *WHY* I'm not no longer dealing with what's been as I've overcome what's been one of my greatest obstacles/fights (against my own compulsions) in life.

But I've done major reform to what I eat and why I eat it. Weight gain was tied to traumatic type life events rather than ignorance. If that helps make sense.

So you can, but probably shouldn't just take a cursory bodyfat % and assume that I have no dietary or training knowledge.

I did come here to learn about AAS further though.....

If a strong test base is a bad idea then it's a bad idea. If keeping t3+clen and taking *some* anavar would help me towards my jet setting from 25->15% bodyfat for once in my *many* *many* times shooting up and down the % scale, then I'm fine rationalizing it to get extra motivated on top of what has already been an amazing last 10 months.

But this isn't me getting to sub 10% or contest shape, I'm just time lining myself towards getting back to average bf% and what will surely be above average strength/muscle size.

Natural, I was 10 set squatting 365lbs at my peak 315lbs SLDLs no wrist strap at a significantly lower weight. I'll have it all back AAS or no. I'm just jump starting and I don't see the bf% thing as a reason to not get *one* jumpstart down this year and then maybe never even take any of it again.

Please do bear in mind that I'm down 75 lbs of my own diet and exercise from 10 months ago before wanting this for myself....

At my age and with my current diet I'll maintain the bf% much better anyhow.. as test starts to decline , who knows.. HRT maybe but I have a unique time in life due to the alignment of about a half dozen things that are where they need to be that allow me the time to make this happen before this summer.

I lost 75lbs.. of course I can drop another 30-40 and come back in a 2-4 months somewhere (or drop 50-60 come back in 6 months and be really cut enough to do a clean bulk as opposed to a cutting cycle) BUT I'll also be back employed and in a high exposure position for my industry which makes cycles and thermogenic side effects a no-go. I have a special time right now. 25% withstanding.

nasaltr0n
 
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Perhaps humor me and replace 25% with 15% and at least critique the stack if anyone cares to :)

And like I mentioned two friends that suggested I go this route.. either one might do it, ultimately if I take this advice and just regularly diet for a while longer and never run the cycle myself anyhow....

I was hoping for that in addition to any "go learn how to diet" type responses as well

For me, alternatively is just the clen+T3 of course but T3 is a lean mass eater, potentially which is why at least a little bit of var seemed to make sense if not to get swole while doing a quick cut
 
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nasaltr0n said:
Perhaps humor me and replace 25% with 15% and at least critique the stack if anyone cares to :)

And like I mentioned two friends that suggested I go this route.. either one might do it, ultimately if I take this advice and just regularly diet for a while longer and never run the cycle myself anyhow....

I was hoping for that in addition to any "go learn how to diet" type responses as well

For me, alternatively is just the clen+T3 of course but T3 is a lean mass eater, potentially which is why at least a little bit of var seemed to make sense if not to get swole while doing a quick cut
Click to expand...

If you replace the 25% with 15%, maybe then I'll offer advice on correct AAS methodology... 25% BF is unacceptable to be jumping on gear.. One reason: the aromatase enzyme that converts Testosterone to Estrogen is mainly located in adipose (fat) tissue... With so much BF you'll end with far too many estrogen related side effects...

Regarding Clen + T-3, you've just written an essay on how you believe you can diet down to single figures... Then do it..!! You shouldn't be using stims and thyroid hormones..
 
LOL seriously if you can get there via diet, then do it the look is better when you can do it with out beating your body up.Shit Makes blowing up lean that much easier if you can diet your sure as hell can eat proper.
 
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