Failed attempt...

[DemonSeed]

Hello TDS,

I kicked off benzo for good I think... it was really painful and took me several attempts. I finally did it by myself at home without any sort of help. I have no idea how I managed to do it. The debiliting chest pain, the insomnia, the sweats, the hot flushes... to deal with the flushes I started smoking pot a lot. It was very helpful. Now I find myself addicted to weed... I also do hydromorph twice every two weeks, I pop some oxycodone every now and then and I smoke tobacco. The weed makes me eat like a pork, I noticed I had been eating shitload of crapfood for the last three months. The high just give me a general pushing on the head feeling. The hydromorph keeps me going in w/d for a few days... it's just not pleasant, but the craving for this drug is very intense and unpleasant; it makes my heart beats in excitment as if I was going to see my lover, you know what I mean? The oxycodone is not really a big problem, since I only take small dosage (because of avaibility I suppose...) but I will get pissed if I don't get some. And tobacco... can't even get this dizzy feeling out of a pipe and it tastes like shit and smell like crap and does NOTHING. Really why the fuck am I indulging myself into all of this shit?

I was confident today (I had been getting myself ready for this) I would keep busy and not smoke anything, nor take any oxies... I knew I would be bored, I knew there would be temptations. I took a healthy breakfast, went for some jogging, felt bored... ended up smoking some tobacco, went to visit my best friend. It made me crave oxies and he gave me 5 mg. Even though I won't get high of 5 mg, it makes me happy to get it and since it doesn't do much of a thing, I felt bored quite fast enough. He gave me another later - once again I was content to get just one. All in all, I told myself it was all okay as long as I didn't smoke pot (brilliant rationalizations...). My brother smokes pot and sell me some if I need it. I was so bored, sort of felt lonely so I called a friend and went for a walk... we went to a spot where they were joints leftovers, I collected them, filled my bowl, and the wind prevented me from toking and I throwed all of it. I went home... still felt lonely so I went back to my best friend. He wouldn't give me a oxy, I was pissed and went home and smoked some of my brother joints leftovers.

Now I feel there is some sort of progress. I'm also about to start a job. I am really pissed at my self justifications... sometimes it feels like I would need to walk all day long to avoid drugs. I used to do a whole load of drugs and now that I find myself struggling less, I really went to kick off. Even weed because weed is not as friendly as it seems... it tricks my mind into thinking it is friendly so I go and toke again. There's no way am ever going back to any sort of standard rehab, the only rehab I would go to is Takiwasi in Peru. If I can't do it, that's what I'm planning to do. Just need to gather money and keep on learning Spanish...

Sorry for being long... I have been wanting to speak to a friend more deeply but I felt too low for that or when I would introduce the subject of quitting it, my best friend wouldn't really care and keep on rambling with his things, which really is a lot of bullshit... I suppose I should just try again tomorrow?

 

[Swimmingdancer]

You need to be really careful not to just replace your benzo addiction with an opioid addiction. I would highly recommend you doing some work on your mental and spiritual (if you wanna call it that) health and read some good books about addiction and how to withstand cravings. There are going to be cravings - I know exactly what you mean when you say it makes your heart beat in excitement as if going to see your lover - but you CAN choose how you react to them. If you keep choosing not to act on them and do something else instead, they will gradually lose their power over you and get less frequent.

There are programs similar to Takiwasi in Canada, I am actually using ayahuasca for my addiction if you would like some info.

 

[Allein]

I would highly recommend a nicotine replacement treatment, I'm from the UK but assuming these things are available where you are, I gave up smoking tobacco and hash after a heavy long term habit 11 years ago now, using Nicotine Lozengers. More recently My father gave a up a 50+ year habit using nicotine inhalers.

The statistics in the UK show that quitting this way is much more successful than cold turkey, I think it enables you to deal with the psychological side, the ritual and habit before having to deal with the chemical addiction. If you fall off the wagon you can at least fall back to the replacement therapy rather than actually smoking. I'm on the tail end of a Benzo taper myself and not for the first time but hopefully this will be the last.

I'm so glad I don't smoke anymore, my main motivation was my partner and I wanted to have children so we both gave up before we even started trying, in started smoking tobacco at 8 years old and was smoking everyday by 13 and then smoking hash daily by 16. My father smoked and whilst I in no way blame him for my actions I do think it was almost inevitable I would take the habit up.

 

[DemonSeed]

There are programs similar to Takiwasi in Canada, I am actually using ayahuasca for my addiction if you would like some info.

Where can I find informations about ayahuasca therapies in Canada? And what about your own use of Ayahuasca? I have been thinking to try it on my own just to see if I could get a good refreshing experience and after-glow. Since I'm going to start working soon, I'm going to have the money to try... I was also contemplating extracting DMT and see if it can have some positive effects. Or maybe ibogaine? Well I would appreciate if you shared your own experience with that sort of atypical therapies.

atm23, thank you for taking the time to share your experience! I gave up on smoking twice this year... I used nicotine gums and noticed I didn't had any physical w/d issues... I don't smoke a whole lot too. I suppose chewing some nicotine or just regular gums could help. I just need to perseverate and eventually I will make a full day without those stupid drugs...

Today I still smoked some weed with a friend... I'm very concerned about my frenetic munchies, so I decided to drink water instead. It worked like wonders! Little by little, failed attempts are teaching me the way to the light. I must be hard and at the same time I have to go easy with myself. There's no point in accumulating frustration, resentment and thinking that my failures has no positive meaning!

 

[DemonSeed]

Swimmingdancer, reading books about addiction and how to deal with it is a great idea! Do you have any suggestions? I am rereading the "Art of happiness" to pass time and somehow it helped me to be more aware of the causes of my sufferings and that's sort of things. I'm also waiting to read "Singing to the plants" to acquire more knowledge about Ayahuasca and how to use it properly, etc. In any case, I would love to hear your suggestions! Thank you and good evening=)

I have an african friend also that wants me to try a healing plant. At first, what he described to me seemed like iboga (it grows in Congo-Brazza where he is from) and I was very interested... it turns out it is something else which isn't really knew. He is a PhD scientifist and knows quite a bit about healing plants... I am really curious to try this! If it's interesting I will share my experience some time soon.

 

[DemonSeed]

BUMP

I would really appreciate a reply concerning books suggestions about drugs addiction that would help to increase my awareness on the subject and how to deal with cravings... and about Ayahuasca therapies in Canada... just putting my thread back to the top. Thank you for helping.

 

[Missykins]

Mindful Recovery by Thomas Bien
Moments of Clarity by Christopher Kennedy Lawford
A Million Little Pieces by James Frey
The Basic Text of Narcotics Anonymous (www.na.org for a meeting in your location).

 

[Swimmingdancer]

Sorry I didn't see your post! My favourite book on addiction is In The Realm of Hungry Ghosts by Dr Gabor Mate. I HIGHLY recommend it. It is the most sophisticated and accurate explanation of addiction I have ever read. Incidentally, Dr Mate has actually done treatment for addictions using ayahuasca, but Health Canada told him to stop so I'm not sure if he's doing it anymore.

Check out these films:
Vine of the Soul - an excellent introduction to ayahuasca (which also has a part with Gabor Mate and discusses ayahuasca as a treatment for addictions)
The Jungle Prescription - a documentary from the CBC and David Suzuki, featuring Gabor Mate, about when he started using ayahuasca to treat his addicted patients

You can probably watch both of these online, but I would recommend getting Vine of the Soul on DVD if you can because it has a lot of special features and interviews that were not included in the film.

If you want to use ayahuasca, it is definitely best to find a healer experienced in using it to help you, if you can. Google "ayahuasca forum" for an excellent online forum dedicated to ayahuasca.

What is this plant from Congo-Brazza you were mentioning?

Oh and here is a thread I posted on how to deal with cravings: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/...-to-quit-addictions-and-improve-mental-health


As for programs smilar to Takiwasi or ayahuasca healing in general in Canada, you have to put out your feelers and get involved with the community to find out about them. I am not really familiar with any in your area as I live on the West Coast, but I have heard they exist in Quebec and Ontario as well and I know there are ayahuasca healers who travel there. The problem is that ayahuasca therapy is a legal grey area so people are discreet about it and it isn't widely publicized. If you are meant to do ayahuasca it will find you. I know that may sound strange and new-agey, but it really seems to work that way. One someone starts thinking ayahuasca will be helpful for them they usually soon meet someone who informs them of an opportunity to attend a "ceremony".

Feel free to PM if you have any questions or I don't reply fast enough to your posts in future

 

[Eyes On the Roll]

Be verrrry careful around oxycodone man. That shit will take the world right out from under your feet and you won't even realize it. I've tried more drugs than I can count on my hands and feet, but oxycodone (and I guess opiates in general) is the most addictive substance I have experienced. And I have a very long list of experiences.

 

[DemonSeed]

Hey guys! Thank you for the replies and suggestions for the books, that's really cool! Swimmingdancer, I know what you mean about Ayahuasca finding you... I think this "plant spirit" is currently searching for me somehow. I'm sort of asking for meeting and it's sort of telling me to gather informations about it so I'm reading "Singing to the plants" by Stephan V. Beyer. I know it sounds psycho so it's all just sort of I'm going to copy all your suggestions (for when I have the money) and see your thread about how to deal with cravings... I have already seen The Jungle Prescription and I also seen Metamorphosis. I know the "antidotes" to anger (patience and tolerance), for fear and anxiety (being honest)... but I was wondering about cravings / destructive desires and boredom.

I have no idea about that plant from Congo-Brazza... my friend says it ain't iboga, and there's no occidental scientific name. We are currently waiting for his wife to ship it. So I'm pretty excited to see if it can be useful. If it is interesting and unknow, I will post a thread about it in the near future!

Eyes on the roll, I know what you mean about oxycodone. Fortunately, I do no have access to huge quantities of oxies so my addiction is not as strong as it was when my tolerance was low. I went to see my friend this evening and forced myself not to ask for any. I'm repeating myself that it is poison when I get the desire and have thought a lot of the pros and cons. The negatives are much more worse. I'm free from benzo since 2 months, free from amphetamines since 3 months, free from hydromorph since 2 weeks, free from cannabis since 5 days and now it's my first totaly clean from oxy (though I have been only taking therapeutic dosage for the last week so no serious w/d at all). And the fight for happiness continues... I'm very optimistic

 

[Eyes On the Roll]

It is possible to keep using oxy addiction free, but it takes a tough mind to do that, you seem like you have a firm grasp on your desires. I was able to use oxy sporadically from ages 17-20, never experiencing withdrawal cause I never allowed it. After 3 years I just gave in and started using everyday.I have a friend who takes oxy about 2-4 times a month, one day a dose, for years, and has never gotten addicted and has never experienced withdrawals. I have so much respect for that guy, because you really have to have some control over your mind to be able to do that.

I have been prescribed benzos, from klonopin to xanax, but I haven't experienced heavy withdrawals. By relating them to opiate withdrawals, and I know benzo wd's can be terrible.. even causing death, I have to say you have progressed pretty far, farther than most people could. The wd's are the worst part. The cravings aren't shit compared to the wd's. For the cravings you just have to find something to fill the void. For me, sadly enough, it was getting a part time job, playing video games, and improving my image by clothes shopping on my spare time. Just keep up the good work, lifes much better when your life isn't under the control of a tyrannical drug.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

Hey guys! Thank you for the replies and suggestions for the books, that's really cool! Swimmingdancer, I know what you mean about Ayahuasca finding you... I think this "plant spirit" is currently searching for me somehow. I'm sort of asking for meeting and it's sort of telling me to gather informations about it so I'm reading "Singing to the plants" by Stephan V. Beyer. I know it sounds psycho so it's all just sort of I'm going to copy all your suggestions (for when I have the money) and see your thread about how to deal with cravings... I have already seen The Jungle Prescription and I also seen Metamorphosis. I know the "antidotes" to anger (patience and tolerance), for fear and anxiety (being honest)... but I was wondering about cravings / destructive desires and boredom.

I have no idea about that plant from Congo-Brazza... my friend says it ain't iboga, and there's no occidental scientific name. We are currently waiting for his wife to ship it. So I'm pretty excited to see if it can be useful. If it is interesting and unknow, I will post a thread about it in the near future!

Awesome! Glad you don't think I'm crazy for thinking that ayahuasca calls you Let me know if you want any other book or film suggestions, or anything else. I also find things like yoga and mindfulness classes very helpful.

Be careful with the mystery plant, there are many such plants that you can't take with certain meds and foods (for example with ayahuasca and iboga you have to avoid a lot of meds for at least 24 hrs, some for weeks beforehand, and you have to avoid certain foods for 24 hrs). Try to find out as much as you can about this plant and start with a very small dose to see how it affects you.

It is possible to keep using oxy addiction free, but it takes a tough mind to do that, you seem like you have a firm grasp on your desires. I was able to use oxy sporadically from ages 17-20, never experiencing withdrawal cause I never allowed it. After 3 years I just gave in and started using everyday.I have a friend who takes oxy about 2-4 times a month, one day a dose, for years, and has never gotten addicted and has never experienced withdrawals. I have so much respect for that guy, because you really have to have some control over your mind to be able to do that.

I don't believe that it is something you can deliberately control. Some people are just less predisposed to addiction than others and it is much easier to control their use. It doesn't necessarily mean they are stronger or have more willpower than others, it is just a lot easier for them because their brain is different. In addition, opioids are rarely instantly addicting, it is something that creeps up on you over a period of months or years. The other thing is that you can be addicted without being physically dependen, just because someone only uses 3 times a week or whatever doesn't mean they aren't addicted.

The wd's are the worst part. The cravings aren't shit compared to the wd's. For the cravings you just have to find something to fill the void. For me, sadly enough, it was getting a part time job, playing video games, and improving my image by clothes shopping on my spare time. Just keep up the good work, lifes much better when your life isn't under the control of a tyrannical drug.

I also disagree that the withdrawals are worse than the cravings. If that were the case, there wouldn't be so many people who get addicted when they aren't yet physically dependent, or so many people who go back to using after they are no longer physically dependent. Withdrawals are absolutely terrible, but cravings last a long longer than physical withdrawals and can be just as hard to bear if you don't learn how to not act on them. It's the mental addiction that keeps people using, much more than the physical dependence. I have had a physical dependence to other drugs but it was a walk in the park in comparison to stop taking them because I was not addicted.