EADD Theology Megathread

[rickolasnice]

Do you really think Christiannity would grow so big over the world if it were compiled by idiots who left in "mass amount of contradictions" by mistake? Do you really think so many intelligent, successful and famous people would be Christians if the book had "mass amounts of contradictions"? Those who compiled the worlds best selling book knew what they were doing.

Sorry.. No time to respond in full but I will.. Just wanted to say that I never thought all Christians were idiots..

And yes I believe when you want to believe something bad enough you will pick apart contradictions to suit your beliefs, whether that be making excuses (that isn't actually a contradiction) or dismissing them as something else (a book of metaphors that shouldn't be taken literally)

And also point to Scientology..

And invite you to watch Derren Brown: The Messiah.. (again.. I am not saying that all Christians are like the ones shown in this programme but.. ye.. take from it what you will)..

Your analogy doesn't work, either.. Science doesn't work like that.. It's ever evolving based on new findings and evidence.. You could say religion is evolving but it's not based on new findings and evidence, it's based on changing what the book actually says (human interpretation)

And no I see how the bible works and I can also see how people CAN learn some things from it.. but imo these things should already be within you (morals).. and if you have to read a book to gain them then .. But fair enough people need guidance.. But this only works if you read the New Testament as a story book.. not of a literal account of what happened.

Other than that, like I've probably said before, the bible can and is A LOT of the time used for evil.. money making schemes from the naive and vulnerable being the main one..

There have been many since Jesus that has used the bible to start a new religion (or cult).. Mormons come to mind.. It doesn't actually contradict anything I have been saying.. and you've kind of agreed with me.. Mans ability to pervert religion from it's true state.. something you could accuse JC doing..

Plus My Core issues about Religion is the damage it causes.. Like I said.. Poison like Ray Comfort and The Pope..

 

[Shambles]

did anyone hear the rumour that christianity was (and judaism) was based on a mushroom cult? see the chalice MUSHROOM. see them lil red cloaks cardinals wear...MUSHROOM. see them little hats MUSHROOM. see those weird stories in the holy books MUSHROOM.

SO THERE ya go. the mystery of god solved. god is a mushroom and i claim my 10 pounds.

Yup. This vid on the theory is pretty good - The Pharmacratic Inquisition. Some of it definitely stretches the idea past breaking point but some parts of the interpretation make a surprising amount of sense.

Is it a theory I subscribe to? Not really. But some of the stuff presented does seem to be within the realms of the possible. Maybe even the realms of the quite possible. Either way, mushrooms > monotheism

 

[Raasyvibe]

And yes I believe when you want to believe something bad enough you will pick apart contradictions to suit your beliefs, whether that be making excuses (that isn't actually a contradiction) or dismissing them as something else (a book of metaphors that shouldn't be taken literally)

Same goes for atheists. If someones lifestyle CLASHES with Christian values, they tend to read the bible how it suits them... (Hence all the ignorant memes flying over the net that you've clearly been looking at)

Yes a lot of people make a convenient truth out of the Bible. This doesn't negate those who are genuine and use the book to further their understanding of God and build upon their own spirituality.

And also point to Scientology..

And invite you to watch Derren Brown: The Messiah.. (again.. I am not saying that all Christians are like the ones shown in this programme but.. ye.. take from it what you will)..

Seen it. Firstly you can't really trust what you see on TV. The ratings these shows collect is worth millions (If it's successful, they will be allowed to make many more series's) all the TV producers care about is that the show looks impressive, and will subsequently get ratings. How honestly produced it is, is something we don't know.

But even if it is honest. No-ones suggesting every claimed religious experience is genuine. No-ones doubting that ones psyche can be manipulated. Just because some are delusional, does in no way disprove the credibility of all claimed religious experiences.

Your analogy doesn't work, either.. Science doesn't work like that.. It's ever evolving based on new findings and evidence.. You could say religion is evolving but it's not based on new findings and evidence, it's based on changing what the book actually says (human interpretation)

The analogy works. You clearly didn't grasp it. Read again.

I've studied Psychology at University, I know how the textbooks work. When looking in depth on a particular theme, it is common to refer to previous primitive research to show a logical progression in our understanding of a subject.

And even if you don't want to believe that, you should still be able to clearly see the point I was making, regardless.

And no I see how the bible works and I can also see how people CAN learn some things from it.. but imo these things should already be within you (morals).. and if you have to read a book to gain them then .. But fair enough people need guidance.. But this only works if you read the New Testament as a story book.. not of a literal account of what happened.

It's not simply a guidebook with a few obvious morals, Ricko. It is demonstrating how to deal with evil and stop disturbances to your spirituality. It brings confidence that keeping a "beautiful" attitude is possible in such a dire world.

It's deals with so much more than obvious morals. Have you even read the NT?


It deals with many other issues, for instance sexuality, which i'm sure would confuse many people had it not been for the Bible. Also other aspects of life such as spiritual mediums, psychics

(Though, despite illustrating these issues so candidly you still get gay Christian Churches and Christian "Spiritual" churches with mediums. Some people just read the bible how they like; that's true. Some of us though are genuine)

Other than that, like I've probably said before, the bible can and is A LOT of the time used for evil.. money making schemes from the naive and vulnerable being the main one..

There have been many since Jesus that has used the bible to start a new religion (or cult).. Mormons come to mind.. It doesn't actually contradict anything I have been saying.. and you've kind of agreed with me..

No-ones denying man perverts religion. But just because a few choose to abuse spirituality, how does that put the original religion at fault!?? We discussed this earlier. As FN said to you:

and even within C., there are many peaceful folks who don't go about hating on others. There are bad apples everywhere.

I think religion is a tool, but those who abuse it or do harm in its name are to blame, not religion as a grand whole itself. I have personally found religion useful, a tool for good in my life, so I do take offense at being lumped in with fundamentalist crazies.

_________________________

Mans ability to pervert religion from it's true state.. something you could accuse JC doing..

The above statement astonishes me. You simply couldn't be further from the truth.

Definition of "pervert" from merriam-webster

a : to cause to turn aside or away from what is good or true or morally right : corrupt


How you can claim Jesus "perverted" religion is beyond me. All Jesus did was attempt to end all the brutality and immorality which existed in religion at that time.

 

[1394]

It deals with many other issues, for instance sexuality, which i'm sure would confuse many people had it not been for the Bible. Also other aspects of life such as spiritual mediums, psychics

We always speak of Jesus during our orgies.

 

[Shambles]

It brings confidence that keeping a "beautiful" attitude is possible in such a dire world.

At least one of my major gripes with religion inna nutshell. It really does sadden me greatly - and always has done - that people have such low opinion of such a wondrous world. Even during my very darkest times I could see that this world is a thing of incredible beauty filled with beautiful beings of many kinds. Is it perfect? Not even close. Why not? Cos far too many people live in fear and resort to tribalism and groupthink identities. Really does cast a big shadow. If there were a magic wand to remove all traces of all religions and the paranoid thinking that created them then this world could be made perfect so much easier.

(Though, despite illustrating these issues so candidly you still get gay Christian Churches and Christian "Spiritual" churches with mediums. Some people just read the bible how they like; that's true. Some of us though are genuine)

Cos - as us heathens constantly point out - the Bible is The Big Book of Multiple Choice. You can justify more or less anything with it. All religions are prone to the "No True Scotsman" fallacy though so am not just blaming Xtians for it.

 

[1394]

If there were a magic wand to remove all traces of all religions and the paranoid thinking that created them then this world could be made perfect so much easier.

I'm intrigued, why would you say paranoid thinking?

 

[Shambles]

I wasn't entirely sure that "paranoid" was the right word when I typed it in all honesty. Is kindasorta what I was meaning but not really. Partially though. Am quite twatted so choice of words may be somewhat scattershot

Paranoid in the sense that religions are mostly based around fear. Fear of Self. Fear of Other. Fear of sex. Fear of death. Fear of wimminz. Fear of nature. Fear of the as-yet-unexplained. Fearfearfearfearfear.

And hate.

"Projection" is probably nearer what I meant. Gods are so very clearly just man writ LARGE. But so very primitive a version of man that the cracks really are showing now and have been for quite some considerable time.

Any of y'all religees got any piece of scripture that is anything other than simpleminded? Anything beyond very basic insight? Thought not. But am always willing to be proved wrong...

 

[Ceres]

 

[Shambles]

I genuinely have no idea if that's a pisstake or not.

 

[Ceres]

it is actually a real tv series, and quite sinister even though it's aimed at kids.

 

[Shambles]

Jim Carrey really has gone to shit.

 

[1394]

Aye, well I agree on the hate part and perhaps the part about "paranoia" too.

I always thought of God as a primitive father, rather than only man. I really mean that in a specific sense.

I mean, really think about this... everything starts with the father fucking the mother. Out first "other" is our brother.

Families are micro societies, "love thy neighbour" seems to be a primitive sense of nationalism... as the neighbour is the only identifiable "other" in proximity (after coming to terms with the "us" of family). Loving him/her forms a collective sense of "us" and so the paradigm continues.

There will always be the other, as long as there is us. It's about us against them. Which is kinda sad

 

[Raasyvibe]

^ WTF? lol....

You've not lasted too well with your new found Christiannity now have you? Did Father Sinclair yell at you when you forgot to bring a tambourine to his back garden gathering?

Aye, well I agree on the hate part

I think so...

I'm firing you now anyway.

If anyone wants to take your place alongside me and Jess, they are welcome. You get an eternal life of peace, tranquillity, love and comfort. And also this time around I'm throwing in a free action figure of "Bible-man". Bible man. He's "verses" your sins!

Paranoid in the sense that religions are mostly based ...... Fear of sex. Fear of wimminz.

Ha. Hahahahahahahaah...hahahahahahahaahahah

For years I've had many atheists friends try to surmise psychological explanations for my reasons for becoming a born-again Christian. But this one tops 'em all off...

Fear of woman!?

If that were true, half the guys on BL would probably be Christian.

hahahaha


______________
(More serious post coming in a few days)

 

[1394]

What? WHAT? Just like that?

I think you really do fear the pussy, Raas.

 

[Shambles]

I mean actual fear of wimminz (the concept of womanhood/femininity and of ladyfolk themselves) on a very deep psychological level, Raas. Not just being a bit nervy around a purdy ladygirl you happen to have yer eye on at the time. And I mean the religion itself not necessarily the followers of the religion. As religions are created by men they tend to reflect the views of the men who create them. Very primitive, backwards views that any decent human being should evolve beyond. Surely even the most committed Xtian can't fail to notice the rampant misogyny in the Bible and more or less every other religion on Earth. Even Buddhism (women are not able to reach Enlightenment as they are "spiritually inferior" to men 8)).

 

[Shambles]

it is actually a real tv series, and quite sinister even though it's aimed at kids.

BibleMan

The characters

"BibleMan" was originally played by washed-up kid actor Willie Aames,[6] but is now played by Robert T. Schlipp, a youth pastor from Northern California. BibleMan has had many cohorts. Currently, he is aided by:

Cypher: The brains of the team. (Funny, you'd think BibleMan would be the brains.)
Melody: With whom BibleMan has zero sexual tension. (And a double-bladed lightsaber)
BibleGirl: Ditto.
U.N.I.C.E.: BibleMan's supercomputer. (With God and Jesus on his side, why would BibleMan need a computer?)
Captain Omnipotent - God's crime-fighting alter-ego and the most ridiculously overpowered superhero in the history of the Omniverse.
PopeMan - Fellow superhero complete with staff that fires grappling-hook, Popemobile and Popecave hidden beneath the Vatican.
AltarBoy - PopeMan's sidekick.

Villians

There are quite a few, but a quick rundown:

Slacker von Lazarus - A villain with hypnotic mind-powers and lasers which he uses to brainwash people into the sin of sloth.
Professor Dawkins - Mad scientist and Leader of the United Alliance of Villainy.
Dr. Narcissus - Self-adoring supervillain who corrupts others with self-esteem and independent thought.
Femina - Evil sorceress who strives to infect the Church with insubordinate women priests and poison the minds of youth with Harry Potter books.
Mephisto - Satan-wannabe.
Doctor Doom - Because let's face it, what superhero hasn't fought Doctor Doom at some point in their career?

Genius

 

[coors light]

I mean actual fear of wimminz (the concept of womanhood/femininity and of ladyfolk themselves) on a very deep psychological level, Raas. Not just being a bit nervy around a purdy ladygirl you happen to have yer eye on at the time. And I mean the religion itself not necessarily the followers of the religion. As religions are created by men they tend to reflect the views of the men who create them. Very primitive, backwards views that any decent human being should evolve beyond. Surely even the most committed Xtian can't fail to notice the rampant misogyny in the Bible and more or less every other religion on Earth. Even Buddhism (women are not able to reach Enlightenment as they are "spiritually inferior" to men 8)).

so true

 

[StoneHappyMonday]

Yeah, the Buddhism they follow in Laos believes women can't reach nirvana because they have to come back as men first.

Spot on post Shambles, my missus would approve.

 

[rickolasnice]

So you don't think that there are a lot of churches who use psychology and trickery to wow their audience and take their money?

If you don't mind.. could you tell me how to deal with evil and spiritual disturbances as the bible teaches?

Sexuality would confuse many people if it weren't for the bible? What were people doing for millions of years before the Bible? If anything the bible causes the confusion.. There is nothing wrong with two adult men engaging in sexual activity. END OF. But growing up.. hearing that this is a sin and you will burn in hell for eternity for this kind of this can REALLY damage a childs mental well being..

And no..

Psychology books are not claiming to be the words of God, written by men of God or any such thing. They also do not claim anything to be absolute truth other than what studies SUGGEST to show. Big difference.

Well.. because it is the religions fault. It's a religion based on an ancient book. This ancient book is full of vile, hateful, impossible, loving, contradictory, confusing, positive, negative, ramblings.. You have your interpretations and your beliefs on this book which you yourself just claimed to be "genuine". You are basically saying your interpretation of this ancient book of parables is the correct one.. mine is wrong, his is wrong, hers is wrong, anyone that interprets it differently is wrong.. Come on man think about what you are saying.

And anyway I said that religion causes more harm than good. I've seen the "good" it can cause don't get me wrong. It gives widowers hope.. hell it gives people hope. Hope that there is something more than just this life. It doesn't matter what shit you are going through it is Gods plan and in the end it will all be love peace and happiness..

That's all well and good.. but I don't think that the belief or a creator and or an afterlife should be so strongly linked to mainstream religion as it is all too often BAD.. The power it has over people is WRONG. No condoms, gays will burn in hell, etc (won't go into child abuse), reaping money from the poor, spreading such ignorant BULL as creationism. Religion has too much power.. an all too easily (and often) abusable power..

The rest of my dislike for religion comes from just how absurd it is.. Why one and not the other? Where is the evidence? And so on..

By definition God already knows everything that will ever happen.. So he is creating souls knowing they will be subjected to eternal suffering.. It also kind of contradicts the free will thing, huh? If God is all poweful.. he knows the future.. meaning the future is set.. meaning we have no free will.

Why did God create Hell? What do you have to do (in your opinion of your interpretation) to avoid hell?

Definition of "pervert" from merriam-webster

a : to cause to turn aside or away from what is good or true or morally right : corrupt

Yes I know.. Maybe God is the vengeful warmonger of the OT?

You've ignored this part so many times already but i'll try again:

Why are you not Muslim? Why are you not Jewish? Why are you not Hindu? Why not Mormon? Are you Catholic? Protestant? Jehovah's witness? Why not? The God in the Koran is the same God as the bible speaks of. Why do you not believe Muhammad was the true prophet? Why do you not believe Joseph Smith spoke to angels?

IF Jesus existed.. he was nothing more than a clever, cult leader trying to spread morals but ultimately seeking power.

 

[pinkpapaver]

seek

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hide-and-seek/201207/the-creation-god

article on michaelangelo painting of creation of adam. God is in adams brain. it's in the painting.