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parttime crackhead said:
What if you got to like a band based on hearing them now, then went back & listened to their back catalogue of utter horrendous shite yet still proclaimed that you liked it because you liked what you heard at first? Would you do that? Would that be ok? Would you lie to yourself & others that you liked the old shite just because you like the new shite?
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I thought this was a good analogy.

I don't know why the Old Testament doesn't just get flat out ignored, it's the turd in the punch-bowl. You've got all this peace, love & tolerance and then the Old shit is all homophobia, misogyny, death and fiery torture.

My Old Dear is Christian and used to drag me along to a Happy Clapper church when I was a kid (stopped as soon as I told her I thought it was bollocks). She doesn't believe in any of that old piss. She just feels that the stuff that Jesus said, was basically fair and good and that if you live by those ideas (the things he is alleged to have said himself, rather than the other thousand odd pages), you'll not go too far wrong. She views the whole thing as metaphors and allegory, not displays of magical powers. Plus she likes a good sing song and a cup of tea with the rest of the Grey Haired Mafia.

I can see that religion has it's place. Just not for me.
 
effie said:
Or wife, or donkey :D

(JSP you are NOT American despite modding a non-EADD forum, don't drop your Us young man! ;) )


- Dalai Lama

^ sums up my thoughts on the matter of religion. Along with:

"Our prime purpose in this life is to help others. And if you can't help them, at least don't hurt them."

"The purpose of our lives is to be happy."

Abd my personal favourite:

"Sleep is the best meditation. "

The Dalai Lama is pretty awesome.
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I'm terribly sorry it was copypasta.
 
Morning all !. Sister Efficacious Heart Burn :)

Crack.. 'logic' was the wrong word to use there.. 'empirical' maybe..

Evenso..:p

****

*jingle * Word for Today..

RAHAB (2) 28 Feb 2012

''I know the plans I have for you,' says the Lord. 'They are plans for good...'' Jeremiah 29:11

While everybody else was preparing to fight, she was preparing to surrender. Somehow Rahab had heard about the things God had done for Israel; how He'd turned the Red Sea to a red carpet, converted rocks into drinking fountains, made breakfast for them every morning in the wilderness, and dried up the waters of the Jordan River. Rahab may not have been wise when it came to her body, but she was wiser than everybody else in town when it came to her soul. She wasn't about to fight God, for she knew it's a fight you can't win. For her the path to victory was surrender! And that is the right path for you too. If only you'll stop trying to 'run the show' and turn your life over to Christ, He will take you to places of blessing you've always dreamed of, longed for, but didn't know how to get to. God had a great future for Rahab. He planned to make her a progenitor to King David, and also our blessed Lord Jesus. How's that for recycling? And God, who loves both the down-'n'-outer and the up-'n'-outer, will do the same for you regardless of the spiritual condition you may be in today. Read this: 'For I know the plans I have for you,' says the Lord. 'They are plans for good and not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope. In those days when you pray, I will listen. If you look for me wholeheartedly, you will find me...I will end your captivity and restore your fortunes' (vv. 11-14 NLT).

http://www.ucb.co.uk/word_for_today
 
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Furious George said:
My Old Dear is Christian and used to drag me along to a Happy Clapper church when I was a kid (stopped as soon as I told her I thought it was bollocks). She doesn't believe in any of that old piss. She just feels that the stuff that Jesus said, was basically fair and good and that if you live by those ideas (the things he is alleged to have said himself, rather than the other thousand odd pages), you'll not go too far wrong. She views the whole thing as metaphors and allegory, not displays of magical powers. Plus she likes a good sing song and a cup of tea with the rest of the Grey Haired Mafia.
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And if religion limited it's role in society to helping out people like your 'old dear' rather than, for example, telling non religious homosexuals they aren't allowed to marry, i'd almost be in favour of it's existance.
 
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MrM said:
And if religion limited it's role in society to helping out people like your 'old dear' rather than, for example, telling non religious homosexuals they aren't allowed to marry, i'd be almost be in favour of it's existace.
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You can't really tar all Christians with the same brush. Only a few hardliners care if homosexuals have state weddings, they just don't want to be forced to take part in it. The main, and only, objection I have to homosexuals being married in churches is that the bible gives no such authority and it's not the churches place to make things up as it goes along to fit in with the society of the day. Many of the hardliners will say that people were made homosexuals as a test, but my personal view is that it is a test of tollerance that they are failing.
 
can anyone explain why it is God tests us? it makes no sense to me. it can't be for Him to find out how faithful we are, as he is omniscient, so he will learn nothing by subjecting us to tests. actually fuck why does God test us, if He loves us so much why do we have to take on a physical form and lead a life He wants us to lead, just to get into heaven when He could perfectly well send us straight there. i've started to feel like the only purpose for life, if created by a Judeo-Christian God, is for Him to get the chance to send some of us, who He supposedly loves, to hell. Not really my idea of mercy and compassion.

So maybe our lives play some role to make us more spiritually full when we get to heaven, to better appreciate it etc etc. But that just suggests that God isn't omnipotent, as in that case we'd come into existence with our souls in the state He wants them to be when we join Him in heaven.

Argh though I know any answer to this question will possibly include something about the ineffable mind of God, so I guess its not very possible to answer.
 
jancrow

Quote Originally Posted by watsons torment View Post
Picture of loads of cool stuff on just that ONE corner of the table, his whole flat must be INCREDIBLE. I bet he has a huge snake in a tank. And a bowling lane he does drugs off. And a pet Frankenstein. Also, he keeps all that stuff by the door, because the first thing he does when he comes in from work is drink a half pint of whisky, do a load of coke, shoot up, smoke, gamble with himself and shoot something, while wearing a vest and looking at a skull. Surely he is the happiest man on earth and it is he we should be inspired and guided by.
...

Just spotted the nunchuks hanging off the door knob too! This guy is the man! Any Jehovah's Witnesses turn up and he can Bruce Lee them like a Boss
 
Chin can you imagine a world with out tests?* Nothing to reach for? Nothing to aim for? Nothing to overcome? Would be incredibly dull IMO... I think also as we 'pass' tests and overcome...our confidence and faith grows.

He is merciful and compassionate.. sometimes seems to be screaming the answers out to people while they agonise over the 'answers'.

We are also free and human not robots. God gives us a will of our own and choice.. You can choose life or death, heaven or hell.

Hell for me btw means distance from God.




gyps.jpg



* perhaps nice to have a holiday home there :D
 
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The main, and only, objection I have to homosexuals being married in churches is that the bible gives no such authority and it's not the churches place to make things up as it goes along to fit in with the society of the day.
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But isn't that exactly what religion has done all along? And isn't it a good job too? Otherwise the religious would still be literally following the nastier parts of the bible that say stoning people to death is ok rather than going with a more modern interpretation that places more importance on the nicer parts of the new testiment with jesus etc? It's not like the bible contains details on every possible modern situation - a certain amount of interpretation is inevitable unless you want to end up believing that you are literally a bond servant to christ or some rubbish.

I don't think anyone is going to force any religion to marry gay people in their church. Rather it will be up to each religion to decide whether or not to allow it in their churches based on their faith, and of course you can have gay marraige outside of church no problems (unlike now).

I don't understand how any religious person can possibly object to gay people getting married as long as they don't involve religion. I'm straight but an atheist and when i get married i wont involve the church in any way. If i was gay why should that make a difference?

This is just one small example of why people like me feel very strongly about the political effects of organised religion.
 
The OT is in harmony with NT on homosexual sex. its an abomination. God doesnt want to look at it!

This isnt to say that a gay bloke cant either come into Gods presence or get married.. Just it isnt going to happen within the gates of heaven.

* just know this is going to ignite a sh*t storm *

To balance what I said out.. other things such as lying and even stirring up descent among brethren* are considered abomination too.

* Do hope Ive shared this with a heart to instruct or heal rather than stir up.


NB.. just realised that noone is getting married or having sex within the inner sanctum of heaven anyway.. Jesus said we
would be like angels.. not marrying or whatever..

so.. yeah hmm * ponder *

Perhaps thinking of a hindu temple . with the kama sutraing couples decorating it might help here.. they are outside not inside

Sex-KamaSutra-01.jpg
.

http://www.google.com/search?q=hind...tra+decoration&pbx=1&oq=hindu+temple+kama+sut


I think the real Gods home is not dissimilar :D
 
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MrM said:
But isn't that exactly what religion has done all along? And isn't it a good job too? Otherwise the religious would still be literally following the nastier parts of the bible that say stoning people to death is ok rather than going with a more modern interpretation that places more importance on the nicer parts of the new testiment with jesus etc? It's not like the bible contains details on every possible modern situation - a certain amount of interpretation is inevitable unless you want to end up believing that you are literally a bond servant to christ or some rubbish.

I don't think anyone is going to force any religion to marry gay people in their church. Rather it will be up to each religion to decide whether or not to allow it in their churches based on their faith, and of course you can have gay marraige outside of church no problems (unlike now).

I don't understand how any religious person can possibly object to gay people getting married as long as they don't involve religion. I'm straight but an atheist and when i get married i wont involve the church in any way. If i was gay why should that make a difference?

This is just one small example of why people like me feel very strongly about the political effects of organised religion.
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We wouldn't be following the nastier parts like stoning, because the new covenant basically did away with it. For most situations the bible is quite clear on the rights and wrongs. I believe many were against gay marriage, and wanted it to be called a civil partnership, because there is a very real possibility the government will invoke or create some sort of legislation that forces them to let gays to marry in their church - a bit like how the Catholic adoption agencies had to shut down because they refused to let gays adopt.
 
The idea that homosexuals should miss out on marriage in order to possibly protect churches from maybe being forced to marry them in church in the future should another law also be changed is pretty horrible. If that's the way many people in the church feel about the issue then i think they are moral cowards to try and protect themselves from some vague possible future harm in this way at the expense of the welfair of people outside of their church.
And the catholic church has pretty much proven itself not to be trusted with children over the last few years so i don't think we've lost much there.
 
Mr Smokes Blunts. said:
We wouldn't be following the nastier parts like stoning, because the new covenant basically did away with it.
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There's no part of the NT that specifically discards all the 'nasty stuff' though. Aside from criticisms of the hypocrisy of the Jewish clergy and the decision to dispense with Jewish dietary requirements, there's very little refutation of the Old Testament and its laws in there.

The decision to abandon the parts of the OT which don't sit well with the more peaceful aspects of Christian doctrine was something that took centuries of schisms and bloodshed to arrive at, and even now there's nothing like a real consensus.
 
the laws are still there .. as is the freedom though.

If we submit to christ as shepherd and are born of the spirit we can embrace both.

The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit." John 3.8

So in terms of sex.. only sex sanctified by marriage is the proper carte blanche, creme de la creme of coupling !

Can I get an amen there Msg?
 
I think;

YellowPolkaDotHalo said:
The OT is in harmony with NT on homosexual sex. its an abomination. God doesnt want to look at it!

This isnt to say that a gay bloke cant either come into Gods presence or get married.. Just it isnt going to happen within the gates of heaven.

* just know this is going to ignite a sh*t storm *
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Is sufficient evidence that the new testiment hasn't erased all the nastiness from at least some people's modern interpretation of christianity.
 
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