EADD Benzo Discussion V. Waking up in a Wakefield skip

[Survival0200]

ive always wondered this, most benzos are for obv dealing with anxiety but just what is lorazepam uniquely mainly used for?
Diazepam is best for muscle relaxant properties, alprazolam is a great anti-anxiolytic, nitrazepam is great for sleep. so what makes lorazepam special?

It is effective for treating agitated patients in psychiatry when given as an intramuscular shot of usually 4 mg (I believe the Ativan injection is 4 mg/mL).

 

[Fertile]

My heating engineer told me about this guy. Take it for what it's worth.

 

[fastandbulbous]

Just had 1 and a quarter x 2.5mg lorazepam pill and holy crap is it a nice dose. im quite relaxed
ive always wondered this, most benzos are for obv dealing with anxiety but just what is lorazepam uniquely mainly used for?
Diazepam is best for muscle relaxant properties, alprazolam is a great anti-anxiolytic, nitrazepam is great for sleep. so what makes lorazepam special?
i mostly know it ford when people are having a psychotic episode and they get the IV out. fella near got gave it when he had an episode before his liver transplant with encephalopathy, TL;dr woke up in a hospital trying to fight off nurses and just got there before they hit him with it

I get lorazepam prescribed (1mg b.i.d.) to prevent spasm in my left forearm (without a hand on the end, spasms of those muscles are fucking agony)

 

[Fertile]

If you are in immense pain, obviously they are an appropriate medicine. That said, the 1,5-benzodiazepines are a whole different ballpark. I took 20mg clobazam BID and when, a year later, I didn't have it for a week I was fine. OK my myoclonuus had me body-popping so I fell of my crutches... but I was pleased to find I wasn't dependant.

 

[SpiralusSancti]

How's clobazam for muscle relaxation. I would like to stop benzos totally (well now it’s day 3 without any and for a long time I used only minimal doses and take breaks) but thing is I have physical pain for which muscle relaxing stuff does help. Actually if I take enough I can replace all or almost all dose of opiod with paracetamol and be pain free. Strong NSAIDs also work really good but I get bade side-effects from those so they are not long term option for me.
Strangely even weed works quite fine for my pain, great with some muscle relaxation but it makes me unproductive, so that neither isn’t good as daily solution.

 

[Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt]

If you are in immense pain, obviously they are an appropriate medicine. That said, the 1,5-benzodiazepines are a whole different ballpark. I took 20mg clobazam BID and when, a year later, I didn't have it for a week I was fine. OK my myoclonuus had me body-popping so I fell of my crutches... but I was pleased to find I wasn't dependant.

Speak of which ... some weeks ago in this last incursion into the Zone, and looking for my source(s) of benzos, I bumped into this geezer desperate for a fiver ...all he had was 100ml juice and some anti Parkinson capsules ( inside the blister though ) which I would purchase soon after based on a quick search and the will to sort him out :" when you´ve been there and you can" type of impetus.
Why am I even mentioning this ? After doing some research I was curious about what this would do with a ROA which would bring the effects much quicker ...subvert the whole process basically.
Having done what I´m about to expand upon, I can safely say that ,besides strong opiate agonists combined with things like Ibuprofen ( and other maligned NSAI(s) such as Nimesulide (most effective one when taken as directed, abuse might be liver toxic, duuno , what I do is that I´ve found diclofenac way harder to tolerate ! Who am I to challenge Science anyways ? ) - , having combined Buprenorphine + Diazepam + Amantadine has provided one of the strongest sense of analgesia I´ve ever felt .
I would like if any of you with "scientific knowledge " could back the following subject reported effects up :

Early am : 2mgs Bupre ( if that ) + 10 mgs Diazepam .
Mid afternoon : 1mg Bupre (again eyeballed )+ 2.5mgs Diazepam or 0.75 Bromazepam ( yeah , I know, go figure . I just break one of them 3 mgs one in 4 parts for no specific reason ) + empty a full capsule of 100mgs Amantadine, chop two 50 mgs lines ( For HR´s sake I´m not condoning this ,since, I´ve been feeling some minor ( in the short term at least ) side effects which tell me I should abandon such ROA : namely -upset stomach -but nothing in the vein of DXM though- way milder ; also, what I can only describe as "Heart discomfort " ( Term alone should be enough to discourage people from this ROA at least -aware this might just be sth personal but could also be sth else entirely different ...risky ? Sure does feel like it when this is felt. Proceed at your own risk , I guess. ) -it is a very weird type of HD , not the type which tightens, irradiates and heralds an increase of anxiety/arrival of a panic attack ;no increased BPm either. It´s just this presence which is just there a couple of minutes after you do the two lines and can increase to a point of discomfort .Once this subsides at the 30- 40 minutes mark ( you start feeling the positive effects much sooner though :, (muscle ) relaxation in general, slightly elevated mood, just a pretty noticeable increase in well being which I´m unable to compare to anything else ) , what you feel is sth which surpassed all the expectations I had once I purchased them .
Analgesia has to be the strongest aspect of the combo ...as I subjectively posted in the Amantadine thread ...it even feels as if you´re experimenting with a "new" opiate agonist ( do not expect an immediate rush as with Brown for example ,or any rush at all for that matter -just a stable , dreamy, relaxation which is very unique to full agonists ) -never have I came across a substance which turns a benzo + an opioid ( both of which I´m very accustomed to) into a whole different thing which is definitely not the sum of its parts - placebo having been discounted after various administrations at different doses I can only think of "Potentiation " somehow here . I actually have had the most profound sense of well being and relaxation ever since I quit Heroin or ,otherwise ,been sober and living the life I wished to live without any of the usual excuses which push you into (self ) medicating.
Again , apologise for hijacking the thread ,but since people were talking about benzos in a painkilling context I just felt to put this out there.
Gladly I have 2 capsules left ...the information on this substance ( outside a Parkisnson context ) is very erratic and rare even.
Having typed this I know Monday I´ll be on my way to the local drug rehab clinic, looking for that safe haven where this rather absurd sense of self importance which is un/consciously always present in each and every episode of addiction will eventually elope through interaction with professionals /people in the same condition .

 

[Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt]

How's clobazam for muscle relaxation. I would like to stop benzos totally (well now it’s day 3 without any and for a long time I used only minimal doses and take breaks) but thing is I have physical pain for which muscle relaxing stuff does help. Actually if I take enough I can replace all or almost all dose of opiod with paracetamol and be pain free. Strong NSAIDs also work really good but I get bade side-effects from those so they are not long term option for me.
Strangely even weed works quite fine for my pain, great with some muscle relaxation but it makes me unproductive, so that neither isn’t good as daily solution.

What kind of pain are you experiencing if you don´t mind me asking ?

 

[Bleaney]

I see something called Tofisopam 100mg (Etizolam substitute) for sale on a clearnet site.

I have never even heard of this before. Has anyone tried it or know anything about it?

It sounds quite interesting and promising from the wikipedia write up:

"Tofisopam is an anxiolytic that is marketed in several European countries.[4] Chemically, it is a 2,3-benzodiazepine. Unlike other anxiolytic benzodiazepines (which are generally 1,4- or 1,5-substituted) however, tofisopam does not have anticonvulsant, sedative,[5] skeletal muscle relaxant, motor skill-impairing or amnestic[6] properties.............. Tofisopam is indicated for the treatment of anxiety and alcohol withdrawal, and is prescribed in a dosage of 50–300 mg per day divided into three doses. Peak plasma levels are attained two hours after an oral dose. Tofisopam is not reported as causing dependence to the same extent as other benzodiazepines, but is still recommended to be prescribed for a maximum of 12 weeks."

Might be worth a punt. Not much to loose by trying and if the dependence profile is better than most other benzos then that's probably the sort of thing that would be beneficial for many people with benzo habits of various degrees.

Tofisopam - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt]

I see something called Tofisopam 100mg (Etizolam substitute) for sale on a clearnet site.

I have never even heard of this before. Has anyone tried it or know anything about it?

It sounds quite interesting and promising from the wikipedia write up:

"Tofisopam is an anxiolytic that is marketed in several European countries.[4] Chemically, it is a 2,3-benzodiazepine. Unlike other anxiolytic benzodiazepines (which are generally 1,4- or 1,5-substituted) however, tofisopam does not have anticonvulsant, sedative,[5] skeletal muscle relaxant, motor skill-impairing or amnestic[6] properties.............. Tofisopam is indicated for the treatment of anxiety and alcohol withdrawal, and is prescribed in a dosage of 50–300 mg per day divided into three doses. Peak plasma levels are attained two hours after an oral dose. Tofisopam is not reported as causing dependence to the same extent as other benzodiazepines, but is still recommended to be prescribed for a maximum of 12 weeks."

Might be worth a punt. Not much to loose by trying and if the dependence profile is better than most other benzos then that's probably the sort of thing that would be beneficial for many people with benzo habits of various degrees.

Tofisopam - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Interesting... well worth a try imho. I was also wondering :have you ever tried 1st generation Anti Histamines ? (Before they were banned in this country ) Phenergan tablets were very effective towards what you seem to be after ...even Atarax (Hydroxyzine )for that matter . Former I just (ab)used it in ways which I reckon have no interest to you -latter ( hydroxyzine) was an incredible tool each and every time I tapered and subsequently jumped off of Diazepam. Cravings, sleep and anxiety were much more manageable.
You might find them as useful as I did .And you can get those OTC easily ( or at least you could sometime ago ,a good story and 0 drug seeking behaviour hints and you´re sorted . ).
Another med a lot of people have a very negative opinion on which I found pretty useful at knocking me out ,when I needed the Diazepam to sleep , was Trazadone ...most vivid dreams I´ve ever experienced too .
All of the above are as easy to quit as sth such as Wellbutrin ...no sign of withdrawal once you quit any of the above.

 

[AlsoTapered]

Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt​

'Artane' AKA Trihexyphenidyl is the most commonly abused anti-Parkinsom drug. I went to a Polish club and a group of old boys were taking shots of vodka (being a club they could buy a whole bottle) and after each shot (75mL or so), they took an Artane. I suspect we are in the arena of cyclizine and other compounds on the bleeding edge of euphoria/delirium.

Put it this way, I've never heard of either drug being used alone. It MAY be the case that Artane alters the subjective effects of methadone. But even in the late 1980s when the addictive nature of such compounds was discovered, nobody could work out a consistent abstinence syndrome.

In short, it's a pretty desperate play. Don't go there.

BTW got blown up.

 

[Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt]

Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt​

'Artane' AKA Trihexyphenidyl is the most commonly abused anti-Parkinsom drug. I went to a Polish club and a group of old boys were taking shots of vodka (being a club they could buy a whole bottle) and after each shot (75mL or so), they took an Artane. I suspect we are in the arena of cyclizine and other compounds on the bleeding edge of euphoria/delirium.

Put it this way, I've never heard of either drug being used alone. It MAY be the case that Artane alters the subjective effects of methadone. But even in the late 1980s when the addictive nature of such compounds was discovered, nobody could work out a consistent abstinence syndrome.

In short, it's a pretty desperate play. Don't go there.

BTW got blown up.

Was just a curiosity which I happened to have bumped into ,and given my current state of mind ,decided that the what the world needs was another guinea pig.
It MAY indeed alter the subjective effects of opioids ...at least ( and this is still the best way of describing it ) it made me feel like I was on some Opiate Agonist each and every time I dosed - a relatively short lived one at that, and one without no "rush " ( as a reference: what you feel a few seconds after IVing half decent brown ) - 100mgs insufflated after Bupre/benzo would provide its exquisite high for 4 -5 hours -then back to tolerance´s normal state, keep in mind aforementioned "high " would slowly creep up on you till you would find yourself in that sort of dreamy,noddy opiate agonist zone ( again, there is sth to it which distinguishes it from each and every opiate agonist I´ve ever been on. )
Just an experience which makes more sense the more I research it . in hindsight ,it makes perfect sense to have read that Amantadine was/is also being used off label for things such as ADHD, depression , as a nootropic even . As stated above, the " odd opiate agonist" state I would get off of it can be interpreted as it having the aforementioned anti depressive, nootropic etc properties. Speculative ,of course.
For HR´s sake I would try to convince people not to do as I did since I felt some side effects which can be very unsafe - for example, you spoke of Poles drinking while on sth similar .One evening I accidentally had a couple of glasses of wine. In the social setting I was in I completely forgot ( and since I sometimes drink socially while on Bupre/benzos, albeit very moderately ) that I had dosed Amantadine that afternoon -it just felt wrong ...alcohol definitely does not mix well with Amantadine -Dysphoria, upset stomach , moderate general malaise -avoid !
Then it is corrosive ,specially dosing differently than recommended -that alone should deter people from (ab)using it like I did.

In sum : as AlsoTapered put it above : "In short, it´s a very desperate play. Don´t go there! " .

 

[AlsoTapered]

Well, the Polish pensioners don't necessarily represent your top end RC user. I just noted that they got smashed. Around here we see to many Eastern Europeans who ended up homeless, have no recourse to public funds and just sit drinking white cider all day every day.

My wife does a lot of work with the homeless but the death toll is shocking. But these people aren't breaking the law or harming others and so they are allowed to die. Debz has been averaging a funeral a month for several years. It can't be good for her. But then she's been homeless and I've been homeless and so we do appreciate that it's GRIM.

I don't know why they don't go back to their nations, but I can only presume that it's even worse.

For such people, Artane might seem classy.

Please, don't do it again! Their is an acute shortage of decent people, we need them all.

 

[Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt]

Well, the Polish pensioners don't necessarily represent your top end RC user. I just noted that they got smashed. Around here we see to many Eastern Europeans who ended up homeless, have no recourse to public funds and just sit drinking white cider all day every day.

My wife does a lot of work with the homeless but the death toll is shocking. But these people aren't breaking the law or harming others and so they are allowed to die. Debz has been averaging a funeral a month for several years. It can't be good for her. But then she's been homeless and I've been homeless and so we do appreciate that it's GRIM.

I don't know why they don't go back to their nations, but I can only presume that it's even worse.

For such people, Artane might seem classy.

Please, don't do it again! Their is an acute shortage of decent people, we need them all.

It would all be nice & sound in the UK if only our NHS rehab centers would be filled with foreigners who find IVing anti parkinson meds ok .
In reality : You go in one of them centers and what do you see ? :
1 - people from lower/mid even (know my share ) classes with a lot of psychosocial issues. They either never had any sense of structure in their lives or ruined what they had ... well , "irreversibly " is not exactly the word .Albeit, 1st which sprung to mind .
Happens the Big majority of these people at these centers are British ( 9.5 in 10 majority ) -odd exception in places like South London where you get a lot of West Indians and Portuguese etc .
Places such as ,says , Bromley or Fulham (just two examples ) ? English people for the most part .
Poles , Eastern europe´s addict population in the UK are like the Roma trying to wash your windshield as you drive past St Pancreas/King´s Cross station - a minority ,basically.
2 - As for the drug trend . As a NHS worker your wife must be fully aware that the problem is Oblivion at all costs ,Synths ? Sure. MDPV ? "But of course " ;"Street Valim " ? -"the more the merrier ,some cheap cider washing it down ". ".
These people are self destructing and do they get a push from their friends in high places so to speak .
Polydrug abuse is the main problem NHS rehab centers are confronted with in the UK ( as in most places I would assume ). Alcohol being the constant ,prevalent substance as you know .
South London is actually an incredible laboratory for Drug tendencies in the UK ...so is a city like Glasgow , mind you. When I was living there Heroin was literally "offered " to you 24/7 for example -much worse than Edinburgh ( people have this false impression of the latter based on Irvine Welsh´s novel - must be. Edinburgh almost felt like a "drug free zone " lol in comparison with Glasgow ).
On a side note ...the few ( again a minority ) foreigners I personally shared NA/AA meetings with , were in the UK in that state and wouldn´t go back cause they were already like that in their countries of origin, going back would be yet another "defeat " ...they choose numbing themselves into Oblivion as the option . Coming to the UK was that desperate attempt at catching a flight and tricking your shadow into staying back at the airport you have just departed from .
lol, apologise for the mix of rambling and reminiscing but ,not that I´m Pole or anything but , it felt like you were misrepresenting a minority which is actually pretty well integrated, actually.
It´s said London was built by the Irish, right ? Poles are catching up .

 

[AlsoTapered]

I merely told you what the situation is in this town. I never judged people for their nationality. I merely noted that Artane seems to be a rather dubious compound and the only other occasion I saw it used was in my local Polish club. I understand that those gentlemen had lived in the UK for over 50 years so I presume they were successful in obtaining and retaining those items basic to life.

As you noted, different areas see different groupings of people. It just so happens that where I live had a lot of jobs for people prepared to 'work the land' so I'm sure they intended to work and support their families. But often totally unrelated issues meant that they did not obtain their 'right to remain'.

I also made it clear that it's reasonable to assume they are still trying to make the best of their lives, so I have to presume that in their homeland they would be treated even worse.

Please don't read bad faith into a post that was not written as such.

 

[Smuck_Hey_Dee_Hewitt]

I merely told you what the situation is in this town. I never judged people for their nationality. I merely noted that Artane seems to be a rather dubious compound and the only other occasion I saw it used was in my local Polish club. I understand that those gentlemen had lived in the UK for over 50 years so I presume they were successful in obtaining and retaining those items basic to life.

As you noted, different areas see different groupings of people. It just so happens that where I live had a lot of jobs for people prepared to 'work the land' so I'm sure they intended to work and support their families. But often totally unrelated issues meant that they did not obtain their 'right to remain'.

I also made it clear that it's reasonable to assume they are still trying to make the best of their lives, so I have to presume that in their homeland they would be treated even worse.

Please don't read bad faith into a post that was not written as such.

Quite the contrary . If it came across like that I apologise ( the "bad faith " part of your reply ) . To be quite honest, and even though we are ...or rather -I am, hijacking the thread ,I enjoy exchanging ideas with you ,you seem quite knowledgeable ,articulate and polite.
Just got carried away , and somewhat offtopic, begun expanding on things I experienced/witnessed 1st hand in a lot of places in the UK ( come to think of it , in England most are coastal , from Brighton to Portsmouth, Dover ,Folkestone etc, etc ).
You ,on the other hand ,seem to have a whole different experience as far as locations are concerned. Namely, UK´s countryside which fascinates me greatly ...it must be a whole different world there ,for sure ...different trends, different dynamics .
I think I´m beginning to understand better how you got prescribed the amount of Diazepam you did too.
It´s all much more impersonal and rushed the closer you are to these core cities.
Curious you mention "people prepared to work the land " ...certain places in London where addicts would routinely flock for tea/coffee/dinner was where I begun noticing a pattern : employers from Rural areas would come and try to take some of those people away to "work the land ". Coincidence or not I begun noticing that they always avoided picking up either natives or people who were legal and with average language/social skills (in the sense them knowing how the system operates in the UK ...the basics at least ) .
In case you are wondering they would always favour the following profile: the least degraded, undocumented, little to no language skills types -basically the ones desperate enough to enter in a van heading towards an unknown place .
Even though I try to be as optimistic as I possibly can I won´t deny it crossed my mind that they were after potential cheap labour ,basically .
On the other hand, the Optimist me would help them select the ones I knew well enough to highly suspect that a new start could accomplish what years of therapy and medication would never had.
Again , hijacking the thread , and for that I, again , apologise. You having mentioned a different UK than the one I know intrigued me. All those little places have their peculiarities as opposed to these big cities where you can find pretty much everything a couple yards away from your front door.
The drug scene where you live must be pretty interesting ,perhaps the internet plays a major role in all you guys get there ...dunno.
Ok , I´ll stop ...sorry guys ...

Stay safe !

 

[SpiralusSancti]

I tried artane, without booze, but in combo with pregabalin and diazepam. It was fun and I wouldn’t mind doing it again some day. It’s not something I would put any effort into finding it but it’s a really unique experience (it doesn’t feel harsh to the body at all but in fact it feels quite good). In (quite distant) past it was rather popular within certain groups of drug users (who had access to “real drugs”) here, now it’s mostly obsolete.

 

[AlsoTapered]

My neighbour has Parkinson's and noted that after a pill, he has 2 hours of mobility before 'locking up' I feel for the guy. He worked all of his life and within a month of his retirement, he was disanosed.

He bears it well but I always keep an eye out in case he locks up on the street. He keeps going and I respect him for that. I think some people, knowing the long-term outlook, give up.

 

[pharaoh]

Hey guys. Thought I'd treat myself to some alprazolam after a tolerance break (usually use diazepam) and I just got them. Does anybody know how they compare in taste to bromazolam? I only ask because on wedinos, this brand seems to be mostly kosher but there are a couple of results that showed bromazolam. These are bitter, which is how I remember xanax to be, but I've seen people say that the two chemicals taste similar and it's bugging me lol. I went through a load of bromazolam when there was a bad batch of a normally reliable brand of diazepam (same brand that make the xanax I've got) and I sent them for testing and was surprised that they had anything in them, because they hardly had a taste at all. Slight bitter, chemical taste but I at first thought that they were inactive, even though they did "hold me" (no w/ds). The vendor made it right but as I say, the bromaz didn't really have much of a taste, whereas these are nasty bitter and hit me hard and fast too, which makes me think that they are legit. Of course there is only one way to tell and I will send off a sample but really I just wanna ask any benzo heads if the two compounds do have a similar taste or not. Also do they even compare? I remember bromaz being more like a dull cousin to valium than anything like xanax, which is obv known for its fast onset and short half-life. I think of it as the most "fun" of the benzos and I didn't get that feeling from bromaz. Some people love it though.

 

[steewith2ees]

Have not tried Tifosopam but on the surface it does not seem desirable to me personally, having next to none of the effects other BZD derivatives provide. With no anticonvulsant properties, muscle relaxation, sedation or amnesiac properties, its bare bones anxiolysis sounds similar to pyrazolam. Useful as a functional alternative in avoiding the impairment other BZD's induce and with little abuse and dependency potential but that ship sailed for me decades ago.

I only ever got my hands on one 500ml bottle of Clobazam suspension with 5mg in every 5 ml and I found the first couple of doses lovely. It has a pretty low equipotency however and did not last long.

I have run out of BZD's for the first time in years so to say I am facing a shock to the system is an understatement. It could be the break I need though as dreadful as the next few weeks will be.

 

[Bleaney]

Does anyone else think that any clearnet website selling Benzos etc that fails to update the copyright year right at the bottom of their home page is automatically sketchy and not to be trusted for that reason alone? Or is this just some weird hunch of mine, that probably has at least some merit, but shouldn't be an absolute cast iron rule?

The thing is, I don't know of any reliable website which does deliver its' stated goods, that doesn't update their copyright year.

And I suspect that the ones that are just left up on the net for years on end without ever changing their stated copyright year are nothing but blatant honey pot traps designed to catch the unwary, or people who don't notice minute details like that. Sites ran by scammers watching the money trickle in without ever sending anything out. I have solid evidence that one site doing this was in that category. There was links to their social media pages on their website, and it was flooded with genuine looking scam alerts. From real people's profiles. Not fake made up profiles.

I'm aware that my experience is fairly limited, it is only my own experience, and I haven't used a huge amount of these clearnet websites. I do think I have a pretty good ability to spot the sketchy ones though, and the ones that seem worth taking a punt on. I've found one just now that apparently has etizolam, which is otherwise currently unobtainable in the UK, but this website has not updated their year since 2022. The prices are very expensive too, way over the odds, so I'd have to do a bit of digging first before parting with any cash. The website looks OK apart from the year and the prices. Two bad signs I think. And two bad signs should probably be enough of a warning for anyone.