EADD Benzo Discussion V. Waking up in a Wakefield skip

[snmfmy]

Why would anyone buy RC's over tried and tested diazepam? The likes of Diclazepam, Phenazepam, and other benzo analogues are far worse for skyrocketing benzo tolerance and harder to come off.

Isn't a large portion of this thread concern regarding counterfeit pills that actually have fentanyl or other unwanted adulterants in them?

Perhaps I should have said reputable online vendor. I'm sure there are Chinese and Indian vendors online that supply legitimate diazepam.

Or you could order some diclazepam which is chloro-diazepam, effectively as potent, has a 42 hour half life, is metabolized to delorazepam (chloro-nordazepam) with the 70-180 hour half-life like nordazepam, lormetazepam, and lorazepam. Basically the same as diazepam except the metabolites are chloro analogs of temazepam and nordazepam and oxazepam.

Delorazepam, lormetazepam, and lorazepam are all prescription drugs so their safety profile is well known.

Meaning, there is no more concern for skyrocketing benzodiazepine tolerance than with diazepam.

Diclazepam is a chloro-analog of diazepam and has the same half-life profile for it and its metabolites so benzodiazepine tolerance should be the same as for diazepam. TBH, the metabolites are slightly more potent than those of diazepam, but the amounts, and the extremely long half-life of the primary metabolite delorazepam is equivalent to nordazepam so tolerance and withdrawal really aren't an issue, unless you're eating them like pez.

Studies in primates identified that potency is comparable to Diazepam at 1, 2, and 10mg doses. WHO report cited.

World Health Organization
https://www.who.int › docsPDF
Critical Review Report: DICLAZEPAM.

 

[elgoucho9]

Isn't a large portion of this thread concern regarding counterfeit pills that actually have fentanyl or other unwanted adulterants in them?

Perhaps I should have said reputable online vendor. I'm sure there are Chinese and Indian vendors online that supply legitimate diazepam.

Or you could order some diclazepam which is chloro-diazepam, effectively as potent, has a 42 hour half life, is metabolized to delorazepam (chloro-nordazepam) with the 70-180 hour half-life like nordazepam, lormetazepam, and lorazepam. Basically the same as diazepam except the metabolites are chloro analogs of temazepam and nordazepam and oxazepam.

Delorazepam, lormetazepam, and lorazepam are all prescription drugs so their safety profile is well known.

Meaning, there is no more concern for skyrocketing benzodiazepine tolerance than with diazepam.

Diclazepam is a chloro-analog of diazepam and has the same half-life profile for it and its metabolites so benzodiazepine tolerance should be the same as for diazepam. TBH, the metabolites are slightly more potent than those of diazepam, but the amounts, and the extremely long half-life of the primary metabolite delorazepam is equivalent to nordazepam so tolerance and withdrawal really aren't an issue, unless you're eating them like pez.

Studies in primates identified that potency is comparable to Diazepam at 1, 2, and 10mg doses. WHO report cited.

World Health Organization
https://www.who.int › docsPDF
Critical Review Report: DICLAZEPAM.

Your honestly citing the WHO as a reputable souce of drugs to be taking?

Diclazepam is much more addictive, longer half life and all round more likely to cause the user to run into trouble than Diazepam. Go and look up the half life and the conversion chart via the Ashton Manual and I'm sure you should be able to work this out...

 

[snmfmy]

Your honestly citing the WHO as a reputable souce of drugs to be taking?

Diclazepam is much more addictive, longer half life and all round more likely to cause the user to run into trouble than Diazepam. Go and look up the half life and the conversion chart via the Ashton Manual and I'm sure you should be able to work this out...

The longer half-life that a benzodiazepine has the easier it is to taper and the less likely you are to have withdrawal. Why do you think Heather Ashton transitioned everybody to diazepam? She even said it's because of the half life.

The half life of diclazepam is identical to diazepam.

The half life of delorazepam is identical to nordazepam, those are the major metabolites of diclazepam and diazepam respectively.

The normal dose of diclazepam is 1-2 mg this is based on interviews of designer benzodiazepine users.

https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/An-expanding-world-of-new-psychoactive-Zawilska-Wojcieszak/3f8692e51163a970e03c4ce6312940e6001a8107

Now, based on different sources, 1 mg of diclazepam is equivalent to approximately 10 mg of diazepam (possibly five). Roughly the same potency as lorazepam, but not as potent as Xanax or Klonopin.

If the pharmacokinetics of diclazepam and diazepam are similar (and there's no reason to think otherwise) approximately 56% of the diclazepam dose will be converted to delorazepam. However only 50%of the diclazepam is excreted or converted to delorazepam in 24 hours. So if you took 2 mg twice a day you would end up with approximately 1 mg of delorazepam approximately 24 hours later. Delorazepam is equivalent to lorazepam yet it has a half-life of up to 140 hours.

The issue with diclazepam is not one of potency. It's one of people taking it like it's diazepam.

In other words, if 20 mg of diazepam does you good, take two milligrams of diclazepam.

The main metabolite which is delorazepam, is marketed as a prescription drug in ITALY under the names EN and Dadumir.

The dose for anxiety is 1 mg three times a day. The dose for insomnia is 2 mg at bedtime.

So conceivably somebody could be prescribed delorazepam at 5 mg a day.

The other metabolites are chloro analogs of temazepam and oxazepam respectively. But the amounts and the time of conversion is so long due to the half-life of delorazepam there's really no concern.

Again, the issue is people taking too much, not potency.

I wish I could get a hold of some delorazepam. The reason I refuse to use Ativan which is lorazepam is because it is too short acting.

Perhaps you should consider that. I commonly research things that I post on this site before I post them.

 

[elgoucho9]

Anyone else think the Martin Dows dosage has gone down?

Like the original ones 40mg seemed strong. I no longer take valium often. But now i feel like i need twice as many as I used to when they first came around?
Was slightly hungover from a bottle of wine and some coke with a ladyfriend I been hanging with, so got home there and took 80mg there. Just to see if they are actually underdosed.

Still a better option than the Bensedin with the Nitazenes test results in them though.

Here is a picture of the Dows.

20240203-133105 hosted at ImgBB

Image 20240203-133105 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

 

[opiofr3k]

Tolerance brother

 

[elgoucho9]

Tolerance brother

Already stated i do not have benzo tolerance. I hadnt taken any drugs for 2 months since a little recently.

Trust me i am a drug user for 20 years. Those martin dows although clean are nowhere near 10mg of legit diazepam.

I even had them wedinos tested last year when they were still dosed accurately. Came back as diaz. They still are diaz. Just not 10mg.

 

[opiofr3k]

After 8 months of being benzo free my tolerance was still not on zero, mb just me, don’t know

 

[elgoucho9]

Anyone else think the Martin Dows dosage has gone down?

Like the original ones 40mg seemed strong. I no longer take valium often. But now i feel like i need twice as many as I used to when they first came around?
Was slightly hungover from a bottle of wine and some coke with a ladyfriend I been hanging with, so got home there and took 80mg there. Just to see if they are actually underdosed.

Still a better option than the Bensedin with the Nitazenes test results in them though.

Here is a picture of the Dows.

20240203-133105 hosted at ImgBB

Image 20240203-133105 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

I standard corrected. They must have just took a while to kick in. Probably cos id just eaten prior to taking them. Quite spannered from 80mg lol. Dare say ill be in bed early between that and the hashish. Lol

 

[ageingpartyfiend]

If I'd taken a genuine 80mg diaz, I reckon I'd sleep 24 hours ish dunno - I definitely struggle to stay awake a couple of hours after taking even 20mg

 

[elgoucho9]

Yeah i got some more there. They been helping the stress since the whole kidnap/abduction/assault situation i experienced recently.
I did sleep for a long time after 80mg btw.

20240208-120502 hosted at ImgBB

Image 20240208-120502 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

I would truthfully estimate they are 5-7mg. They are wedinos tested as diazepam.

I would trust these much better than bensedins. I had some this morning and much less in pain and stressed about it all.

I also heard "Dizzy 10 Indian brand are exceptionally good clean diaz" i tried them a couple times and very good quality. Only thing is they cost more than the dows and less people have them. The dows are definitely nice clean feeling diazepam.

 

[pharaoh]

Well despite being in pain has to be said I have a feeling the Dows too are now underdosed.

Dunno if its cos the immense levels of pain. But i've taken 20 x 10mg tabs today. And feel completely sober. Usually 50mg and i'd be drooling. Yes they have helped the stomsch pain but this seems like surely they must be 5mg or even less.

anyone else tried them recently to confirm it's not just me?

Deffo underdosed. I used to get these all the time at a certain open air market and they were always good quality and super cheap. My vendor ran out of everything pretty much and then got these in (usually has bensedin) and they are proper but deffo underdosed. I think they are just very old/past the expiry date. They aren't bad though but there are some fakes on wedinos. Not that this is a way to tell but the fakes have blue text on the strips but the real have black based on the samples I've looked at.

 

[pharaoh]

I have one clear net shop and bensedin in last weeks was out of stock or just few boxes on stock. Now they are gonna totally, "diazepam uk" was ALWAYS out of stock, now its available and what ive found it they are martins, price same like for bensedins, if they are legit, i don't have info on that. But Rivotril, Ksalol or Bensedin were fine, same with preg, or i was lucky with batches. Didn't order them oftem and in big quantities. Just have Rivotril 2mg from them at the moment and 100% legit.

EDIT: sorry "diazepam uk 10mg" still out of stock but this position showed up exactly when bensedin vanished from website



I'll give em a try next time, will send to wedinos, according to site at worse it will be bromazolam, not some these new shit that was found in bensedins

I think I use the same site and they were real, just felt underdosed cos I used to use these all the time before going online and ordering bensedin. They ran out of them and so I went elsewhere and then went back and saw the Martin Dows, ordered some and they seem legit but weak. Looked on wedinos and the fakes seem to have blue text on the strips and the real have black text. Obv the only way to know is to test but I don't think the ones I got were anything other than diazepam and probs very old stock due to whatever is happening to the benzo market at the moment.

 

[elgoucho9]

There isnt a result in a while like 1year plus of the light blue dows in strips i posted being anything but diazepam.

Bensedin, nitazene analogues. Too much for me.

The dows are underdosed but at 24 a nox are you really caring if its 30 x 5mg clean pills even? I actually reckon its above 5, below 10. 5 at once makes me feel like i've had say 30-40mg actual diaz.

Like you say and i respect this. Every benzo user or opiate user. User of scripts. Get your stuff tested by wedinos first. Man its free ffs. We are all aware drug users. I wont take stims even that dont test clean.

 

[elgoucho9]

After 8 months of being benzo free my tolerance was still not on zero, mb just me, don’t know

This is also possible tbf. I had huge 10mg a day xanax habit years ago. And 100mg a day diaz habit. Even now 20mg is threshold material.

 

[pharaoh]

Same I've been taking more than usual due to stress but I can still start to feel chilled even after letting one melt under the tongue for a short while.

 

[Burnt Offerings]

Isn't a large portion of this thread concern regarding counterfeit pills that actually have fentanyl or other unwanted adulterants in them?

Perhaps I should have said reputable online vendor. I'm sure there are Chinese and Indian vendors online that supply legitimate diazepam.

Or you could order some diclazepam which is chloro-diazepam, effectively as potent, has a 42 hour half life, is metabolized to delorazepam (chloro-nordazepam) with the 70-180 hour half-life like nordazepam, lormetazepam, and lorazepam. Basically the same as diazepam except the metabolites are chloro analogs of temazepam and nordazepam and oxazepam.

Delorazepam, lormetazepam, and lorazepam are all prescription drugs so their safety profile is well known.

Meaning, there is no more concern for skyrocketing benzodiazepine tolerance than with diazepam.

Diclazepam is a chloro-analog of diazepam and has the same half-life profile for it and its metabolites so benzodiazepine tolerance should be the same as for diazepam. TBH, the metabolites are slightly more potent than those of diazepam, but the amounts, and the extremely long half-life of the primary metabolite delorazepam is equivalent to nordazepam so tolerance and withdrawal really aren't an issue, unless you're eating them like pez.

Studies in primates identified that potency is comparable to Diazepam at 1, 2, and 10mg doses. WHO report cited.

World Health Organization
https://www.who.int › docsPDF
Critical Review Report: DICLAZEPAM.

Honestly from the category of “RC benzos”, bromazolam is one of the better ones imo. It’s amazing how well it works at utterly stomping out a stimulant high

 

[pharaoh]

Honestly from the category of “RC benzos”, bromazolam is one of the better ones imo. It’s amazing how well it works at utterly stomping out a stimulant high

Interesting considering that it shows up in most "street valium" now (used to mostly be etizolam). It'd be nice to try it out without buying dodgy pills from the street without knowing dosage etc.

 

[Burnt Offerings]

Yeah it’s a good one. I only use em for “utilitarian” purposes, not for any kind of recreational effect as I don’t find the drug class to be particularly recreational, but yeah, very useful if you like getting thwacked out on stimulants or hallucinogens lol. Like you can consume a strong stimulant like meth for six straight hours, consume 2 mgs of bromazolam and sleep soundly. It’s freakin potent too, I administer it using volumetric dosing

 

[pharaoh]

Yeah it’s a good one. I only use em for “utilitarian” purposes, not for any kind of recreational effect as I don’t find the drug class to be particularly recreational, but yeah, very useful if you like getting thwacked out on stimulants or hallucinogens lol. Like you can consume a strong stimulant like meth for six straight hours, consume 2 mgs of bromazolam and sleep soundly. It’s freakin potent too, I administer it using volumetric dosing

Yeah I suppose most benzos are effective for that to varying degrees. I'm not a stim guy any more but I wouldn't touch anything without having some benzos for the crash. It's good that you're weighing it up properly and safely too. As I said it turns up in most street valium as they call it here and no one knows the dose. People on the streets eat 20 pills in one go, mixed often with their methadone script and the bad "heroin" going around. Lots of people dying but that's a different kind of usage (trying to escape living on the streets, in hostels etc., coming out of prison, all the usual horrors that lead to addiction and problematic drug use).

 

[Bleaney]

After 8 months of being benzo free my tolerance was still not on zero, mb just me, don’t know

How are you defining zero tolerance? Getting full effects off a standard dose, or less than a standard dose?

When I did a long and gradual taper down a few years ago and then had 6 months of complete abstinence, when I finally cracked and got back on the benzos, really low doses were doing just fine for me, for a prolonged period. Maybe up to 6 - 12 months IIRC.

So I'd have like less than 25% of 1 of the 4 cubes in a xanax bar crushed and weighed and that would be plenty. Mind you I never did find out what the dose was meant to be for those bars, might have been 2mg per cube, not sure. but still getting good effects off less than 0.5 mg isnt bad going.

And also half an etiz was sufficient for a while IIRC.

Ofcourse this low tolerance doesnt last long with regular use, and my doses gradually krept up, but never got anywhere near the crazy doses I was on first time round. At least I've managed to stick to at or below the recommended 'therapeutic' doses ever since I learn the error of my ways after the first time round.

(Occasionally I've had a bit of a blow out with nitrazepam or temazepam when those were suddenly easily but briefly available on the clearnet a year or so ago, just for the indulgence of the heavy hitters, which I enjoy, but that was nothing very regular or sustained.)

The best thing is to try to have weekends off or something like that, that way tolerance and dependence can be kept in check indefinitely.

Much easier said than done though obviously, as life has a tendency to become complicated and demanding, and often making planned tolerance breaks not so easy tos stick to.