Dosing with multiple synthetics?

[fastandbulbous]

You need to think more thoroughly, FnB. Let's assume:

Compound X: 5-HT2A 30% activation; 5-HT2C 25% activation at 10 nM.
Compound Y: 5-HT1A 65% activation; 5-HT2A 30% activation at 10 nM.

Then our mixture will give us: 5-HT1A 65%; 5-HT2A ~60%; 5-HT2C 25%. That's the sum.

That one inhibits the metabolism of the other is speculation unless you have proof that is does.

Not really as they'll be acting in a way analogous to competetive inhibitors ie they will be competing with each other for receptor occupancy. The figures you give are purely for when the drug is interacting on it's own with the specific receptor (and competetive activity is determined from Michalis-Menton enzyme kinetics type calculation, which arent linear - it's the reciprocals that show a linear relationship)

 

[raybeez]

Although this isn't my speciality, it seems to me that another factor to consider might be syngerism between a serotonin and non-serotoninergic pathway.

The output (aka the "high") from these compounds can be a combination/overlay between a 5HT-receptor mediated pathway, and a secondary pathway. For example, this study found synergism occuring in appetite supression from mixing two serotonin and catchecolamine mediated drugs (FenPhen).

Two hallucinagens might produce additive effects in terms of 5HT2/1 receptor activitation, but if one of the compounds has even slight affinity for a different type of receptor as well, couldn't this lead to some downstream synergy and a non-additive increase in 'output' or 'high' ?

 

[BilZ0r]

Compound X: 5-HT2A 30% activation; 5-HT2C 25% activation at 10 nM.
Compound Y: 5-HT1A 65% activation; 5-HT2A 30% activation at 10 nM.

5-HT2A ~60%

From those figures, Compound X and Y have a 5-HT2A affinity of 23nM. You mix them together at 10nM and you get 23% binding each... so the total binding is closer to 50%. (drug binding is non-linear remember you can never get 100% binding; occupancy = [drug]/(Ka + [drug]).

Anyway, to answer the question, the drugs would add together for a psychedelic experience. Possibley in a non-linear, way. I wouldn't mess around with it though, as these drugs can be lethal.

Very little is know about the metabolism of PEAs and tryptamines, i.e. what the rolls of MAO are vs CYP vs other enzymatic systems. What is known, is that some of these drugs are lethal and some of them are enzyme inhibitors are what are likely physiological concentrations.

 

[fastandbulbous]

You need to think more thoroughly, FnB.

I did!

Thanks BilZ0r, I wasn't really wanting to have to start doing the mathematical part with the figures provided (as I've said before, I do have a big lazy sreak, given the opportunity)!

 

[bickoma]

I would imagine the compounds that effect a certain recepter, 'stack' on each other...

 

[BilZ0r]

You don't need to imagine anything, the effect of ligands on receptors has been well modelled.

 

[Morninggloryseed]

You might end up something like this guy. Doesn't seem like a great idea to me, but I have daydreamed about it curiously before. I used to be the kind of person who'd go to a party and sample a little bit of everything everyone brought there; this usually resulted in me not remembering good portions of the evening.

I forgot about that report, and it is a good example as to why it is NOT SAFE to go mixing these things without starting out with TINY, TINY quantities. From the looks of it, this guy was being very careful. 8mg of 3C-P is a small dosage (it doesn't seem to get very psychedelic until 30-40mg) and 12mg isn't too large of one for 2C-T-2. Unexpected things can happen and this is one more example as to why the "research chemical" psychedelic drugs are NOT TOYS. Yet so many of the fool-hearty hearts think that because they are "legal" and you can buy them with a credit card...that they are somehow safe. I wish more people could/would GET IT by reading of the mistakes of others, but based on what I read here, shroomery, and other places folks just still don't get it.

 

[djfriendly]

^ Wasn't flowgnome a contributor here at one point? Or do I just know his name from erowid reports?